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Post by Ripley on Oct 1, 2024 14:23:23 GMT
And that's why I simply cannot understand ex-pats who don't speak the local language. How the hell do they Sus the stunt the plumber is pulling right in front of them ....... The English are famous as migrants for not learning the local language. I mean dordogne in France , and the south of Spain are well known for it. I think it's largely down to laziness , as American English is the economic language of the world . Ive noticed a hell of a change in France over the years with many young French kids being fluent in English . As a Francophile, it greatly disappoints me to hear English so widespread in the Dordogne. I go to France to interact with the French and to speak French, but this is one area where I hear more English than French even among the locals. Don't get me wrong. I am a proponent of foreign language acquisition, but I hate to see the French being obliged to speak English in their own country because some Brits refuse to attempt French. I think that travellers who resist foreign language acquisition are making a very short sighted choice. Language is a valuable currency. |
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Post by Bentley on Oct 1, 2024 14:31:48 GMT
You should walk through London or even many smaller towns in England. The Eastern European and Asian languages might upset you though .
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Post by thomas on Oct 1, 2024 14:34:57 GMT
The English are famous as migrants for not learning the local language. I mean dordogne in France , and the south of Spain are well known for it. I think it's largely down to laziness , as American English is the economic language of the world . Ive noticed a hell of a change in France over the years with many young French kids being fluent in English . As a Francophile, it greatly disappoints me to hear English so widespread in the Dordogne. I go to France to interact with the French and to speak French, but this is one area where I hear more English than French even among the locals. Don't get me wrong. I am a proponent of foreign language acquisition, but I hate to see the French being obliged to speak English in their own country because some Brits refuse to attempt French. I think that travellers who resist foreign language acquisition are making a very short sighted choice. Language is a valuable currency. The idea that the French just will not learn the language of foreigners , especially the English , is laughable nonsense as anyone knows who ever sets foot in the country. Ive especially noticed the difference over the last twenty or thirty years , where you have young French kids walking around eating macdonalds and listening to American rap music. Ive found all countries the same , you make the effort with the locals , and they in turn make the effort with you. To be fair Ripley , what I should have said is the English speaking world , rather than just the English , who only make up a tiny part of the English speaking world. What really dumbfounds me is this modern idea that monolingualism is the norm , and that multi lingualism in all or most countries is somehow abnormal. Multi lingualism is the norm , and ive been banging the drum about this for years. We are simply getting lazy , and arrogant , and expecting others to make the effort where the English speaking world doesn't have to . the same brit nats defending mono lingual brit nats in the dordogne, or southern Spain , will be the same ones having meltdowns in Blighty about uppity welsh or Scots /irish speaking their native languages or daring to put them on road or rail signs. As Ive said for many a year now , this hysteria about languages isnt a sign of a healthy britian , it's a sign of a declining weak state where non English languages are treated with contempt or fear. im proud my influence has rubbed off on the daughter to encourage her to take up languages as a university , and hopefully later career choice. |
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Post by thomas on Oct 1, 2024 14:37:28 GMT
You should walk through London or even many smaller towns in England. The Eastern European and Asian languages might upset you though . same in scotland or any other country though Bentley. You should walk through Edinburgh or Glasgow and listen to happy jack having a meltdown about Gaelic language road and rail signs. Its hilarious. Or pop over to taffydom , and listen to John of gwent moaning about yakki da and the cottage burners. Why a language would possibly upset someone is beyond me. I find them fascinating , and highly interesting. |
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Post by Ripley on Oct 1, 2024 14:56:35 GMT
As a Francophile, it greatly disappoints me to hear English so widespread in the Dordogne. I go to France to interact with the French and to speak French, but this is one area where I hear more English than French even among the locals. Don't get me wrong. I am a proponent of foreign language acquisition, but I hate to see the French being obliged to speak English in their own country because some Brits refuse to attempt French. I think that travellers who resist foreign language acquisition are making a very short sighted choice. Language is a valuable currency. The idea that the French just will not learn the language of foreigners , especially the English , is laughable nonsense as anyone knows who ever sets foot in the country. Ive especially noticed the difference over the last twenty or thirty years , where you have young French kids walking around eating macdonalds and listening to American rap music. Ive found all countries the same , you make the effort with the locals , and they in turn make the effort with you. To be fair Ripley , what I should have said is the English speaking world , rather than just the English , who only make up a tiny part of the English speaking world. What really dumbfounds me is this modern idea that monolingualism is the norm , and that multi lingualism in all or most countries is somehow abnormal. Multi lingualism is the norm , and ive been banging the drum about this for years. We are simply getting lazy , and arrogant , and expecting others to make the effort where the English speaking world doesn't have to .
the same brit nats defending mono lingual brit nats in the dordogne, or southern Spain , will be the same ones having meltdowns in Blighty about uppity welsh or Scots /irish speaking their native languages or daring to put them on road or rail signs. As Ive said for many a year now , this hysteria about languages isnt a sign of a healthy britian , it's a sign of a declining weak state where non English languages are treated with contempt or fear. im proud my influence has rubbed off on the daughter to encourage her to take up languages as a university , and hopefully later career choice. I also see this as a terrible arrogance, but it is also disadvantageous. Why would you want to disadvantage yourself in any of your transactions with foreigners? In times of war, do you want to be ignorant of your enemies' language while they are conversant in yours? |
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Post by thomas on Oct 1, 2024 15:09:11 GMT
The idea that the French just will not learn the language of foreigners , especially the English , is laughable nonsense as anyone knows who ever sets foot in the country. Ive especially noticed the difference over the last twenty or thirty years , where you have young French kids walking around eating macdonalds and listening to American rap music. Ive found all countries the same , you make the effort with the locals , and they in turn make the effort with you. To be fair Ripley , what I should have said is the English speaking world , rather than just the English , who only make up a tiny part of the English speaking world. What really dumbfounds me is this modern idea that monolingualism is the norm , and that multi lingualism in all or most countries is somehow abnormal. Multi lingualism is the norm , and ive been banging the drum about this for years. We are simply getting lazy , and arrogant , and expecting others to make the effort where the English speaking world doesn't have to .
the same brit nats defending mono lingual brit nats in the dordogne, or southern Spain , will be the same ones having meltdowns in Blighty about uppity welsh or Scots /irish speaking their native languages or daring to put them on road or rail signs. As Ive said for many a year now , this hysteria about languages isnt a sign of a healthy britian , it's a sign of a declining weak state where non English languages are treated with contempt or fear. im proud my influence has rubbed off on the daughter to encourage her to take up languages as a university , and hopefully later career choice. I also see this as a terrible arrogance, but it is also disadvantageous. Why would you want to disadvantage yourself in any of your transactions with foreigners? In times of war, do you want to be ignorant of your enemies' language while they are conversant in yours? I would think so too. A terrible disadvantage , which goes against the very grain of the English language as a borrowing language , a language that came into contact with other languages over centuries , with English speakers learning and using words from non English languages. As I said , I think there are many reason for this , not least the brit nats going into siege mode and getting increasingly jumpy about other nationalities. |
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Post by Ripley on Oct 1, 2024 15:35:50 GMT
I also see this as a terrible arrogance, but it is also disadvantageous. Why would you want to disadvantage yourself in any of your transactions with foreigners? In times of war, do you want to be ignorant of your enemies' language while they are conversant in yours? I would think so too. A terrible disadvantage , which goes against the very grain of the English language as a borrowing language , a language that came into contact with other languages over centuries , with English speakers learning and using words from non English languages. As I said , I think there are many reason for this , not least the brit nats going into siege mode and getting increasingly jumpy about other nationalities. Ironic, isn't it, that gathering from many other languages is the reason for the huge vocabulary of English, and the language's global ascendancy. But to think that lingua franca status allows English speakers to be indifferent to other languages is very shortsighted and naive, in my opinion. Chinese and Spanish are waiting their turn. |
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Post by Vinny on Oct 1, 2024 15:39:11 GMT
We are not lazy or arrogant we are simply not taught foreign languages early enough in our schools.
The curriculum is to blame, not our ethnic traits.
And the curriculum is the fault of political morons.
Simplify education and teach creative skills first and then scientific skills like maths from 7 onwards.
French is a bloody useful language to know, as is German and Spanish.
Hell, I was taught Russian at high school by an actual Russian, before everything went crazy over there.
Russian has a lot in common with French, through the Tsars who used to speak French.
It's great being able to speak other languages.
But we are not taught early enough.
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Post by thomas on Oct 1, 2024 15:46:21 GMT
We are not lazy or arrogant we are simply not taught foreign languages early enough in our schools. We are in scotland , and ireland and Wales........ |
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Post by Ripley on Oct 1, 2024 15:48:47 GMT
We are not lazy or arrogant we are simply not taught foreign languages early enough in our schools. The curriculum is to blame, not our ethnic traits. And the curriculum is the fault of political morons. Simplify education and teach creative skills first and then scientific skills like maths from 7 onwards. French is a bloody useful language to know, as is German and Spanish. Hell, I was taught Russian at high school by an actual Russian, before everything went crazy over there. Russian has a lot in common with French, through the Tsars who used to speak French. It's great being able to speak other languages. But we are not taught early enough. There's a sort of optimum window of opportunity for learning languages, and earlier is generally better. At what age were you taught foreign language? I think I was eleven or twelve when I began French, followed a year or so later by Latin and Attic Greek, all of which was useful later. While not difficult, French would have been easier to acquire earlier in childhood, but I think that Latin and Attic Greek would have presented more of a challenge too early on. What age would you recommend that foreign languages be introduced in school? |
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Post by Bentley on Oct 1, 2024 15:50:14 GMT
The simple answer is that we are an island off the coast of Europe . There isnt a great need to know other European languages.
When I stayed in Nice it was a 30 minute train ride to Italy . Many European mainland have greater ties to bordering countries , travel through those countries ,some even have been invaded or invaded bordering countries .
The usual suspects will criticise Brits for not learning languages that they don’t need to learn but that’s what they do best , criticise for no reason .
I suspect the same people would cry ‘ racist ‘ at those who criticise migrants that fail to learn English when they live in England .
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Post by Bentley on Oct 1, 2024 15:51:22 GMT
We are not lazy or arrogant we are simply not taught foreign languages early enough in our schools. We are in scotland , and ireland and Wales........ Are they foreign languages Thomas ? 😁 |
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Post by thomas on Oct 1, 2024 15:52:48 GMT
We are in scotland , and ireland and Wales........ Are they foreign languages Thomas ? 😁 definitely. |
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Post by thomas on Oct 1, 2024 15:55:09 GMT
The simple answer is that we are an island off the coast of Europe . There isnt a great need to know other European languages. When I stayed in Nice it was a 30 minute train ride to Italy . Many European mainland have greater ties to bordering countries , travel through those countries ,some even have been invaded or invaded bordering countries . The usual suspects will criticise Brits for not learning languages that they don’t need to learn but that’s what they do best , criticise for no reason . I suspect the same people would cry ‘ racist ‘ at those who criticise migrants that fail to learn English when they live in England . every language spoken in these islands is a European language. For a small island , there historically has been a great need to speak and understand various European languages , and your own English language is essentially a mix of French German and danish. So not sure about the geographical argument. Historically and currently 20 miles of water has never been a barrier to European languages . |
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Post by Bentley on Oct 1, 2024 15:59:05 GMT
The simple answer is that we are an island off the coast of Europe . There isnt a great need to know other European languages. When I stayed in Nice it was a 30 minute train ride to Italy . Many European mainland have greater ties to bordering countries , travel through those countries ,some even have been invaded or invaded bordering countries . The usual suspects will criticise Brits for not learning languages that they don’t need to learn but that’s what they do best , criticise for no reason . I suspect the same people would cry ‘ racist ‘ at those who criticise migrants that fail to learn English when they live in England . every language spoken in these islands is a European language. For a small island , there historically has been a great need to speak and understand various European languages , and your own English language is essentially a mix of French German and danish. So not sure about the geographical argument. Historically and currently 20 miles of water has never been a barrier to European languages . It has because it it were not there would be more Brits speaking the various European languages . |
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