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Post by jonksy on Sept 24, 2024 7:55:30 GMT
FFS Baron is that the same China that this year alone have put another 47 fired power stations on line? Kinda defeats the object does it not? Yes but China would say it has a lot of coal, it is always on the point of not having enough energy and good olde Blighty has burnt a lot more coal per capita than China will ever do. We started hundreds of years back.
That's not to say they are being belligerent. They have it all pencilled in where peak coal will occur. They do plan to phase it out eventually, but it is a kind of stop-gap measure. Also they are probably telling them to clean up the emissions in the new plants.
FFS BVL it kinda takes the edge off chinas green and pleasant land does it not? You are stating they are building EV's to save peoples health and yet they are polluting the atmosphere with coal fired power stations. Can you not see the blatant deception by those actions? |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Sept 24, 2024 8:03:18 GMT
Yes but China would say it has a lot of coal, it is always on the point of not having enough energy and good olde Blighty has burnt a lot more coal per capita than China will ever do. We started hundreds of years back.
That's not to say they are being belligerent. They have it all pencilled in where peak coal will occur. They do plan to phase it out eventually, but it is a kind of stop-gap measure. Also they are probably telling them to clean up the emissions in the new plants.
FFS BVL it kinda takes the edge off chinas green and pleasant land does it not? You are stating they are building EV's to save peoples health and yet they are polluting the atmosphere with coal fired power stations. Can you not see the blatant deception by those actions? It's not deception. It's just what they do. The government are very open about their projections and where they plan to take things. I'm just giving you the answer that you would get from a Chinaman. Whether it is "doing enough" is a political thing. Just because we are mavericks in the UK should not mean all other countries must be just as nutty. |
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Post by jonksy on Sept 24, 2024 8:11:42 GMT
FFS BVL it kinda takes the edge off chinas green and pleasant land does it not? You are stating they are building EV's to save peoples health and yet they are polluting the atmosphere with coal fired power stations. Can you not see the blatant deception by those actions? It's not deception. It's just what they do. The government are very open about their projections and where they plan to take things. I'm just giving you the answer that you would get from a Chinaman. Whether it is "doing enough" is a political thing. Just because we are mavericks in the UK should not mean all other countries must be just as nutty. Of course it is deception. On one hand they are producing EV's and with the other hand they are building coal fired power stations. And you say other countries are nutty..FFS BVL wise up... |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Sept 24, 2024 8:16:44 GMT
It's not deception. It's just what they do. The government are very open about their projections and where they plan to take things. I'm just giving you the answer that you would get from a Chinaman. Whether it is "doing enough" is a political thing. Just because we are mavericks in the UK should not mean all other countries must be just as nutty. Of course it is deception. On one hand they are producing EV's and with the other hand they are building coal fired power stations. And you say other countries are nutty..FFS BVL wise up... The problem is the way you look at it. You think burn coal/don't burn coal. China thinks we burn coal, but what is important is how much we burn and how long we burn it for and when are we going to phase it out. Coal power a while back was on a steep climb as industrialisation increased. Now it is levelling off and will go down in the future. Check the graphs and you will get a much clearer picture. |
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Post by jonksy on Sept 24, 2024 8:21:25 GMT
Of course it is deception. On one hand they are producing EV's and with the other hand they are building coal fired power stations. And you say other countries are nutty..FFS BVL wise up... You think burn coal/don't burn coal. China thinks we burn coal, but what is important is how much we burn and how long we burn it for and when are we going to phase it out. Coal power a while back was on a steep climb as industrialisation increased. Now it is levelling off and will go down in the future. Check the graphs and you will get a much clearer picture. I look at it objectively BVL not through chinky made rose coloured glasses.. |
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Post by sandypine on Sept 24, 2024 14:18:14 GMT
FFS Baron is that the same China that this year alone have put another 47 fired power stations on line? Kinda defeats the object does it not? Yes but China would say it has a lot of coal, it is always on the point of not having enough energy and good olde Blighty has burnt a lot more coal per capita than China will ever do. We started hundreds of years back.
That's not to say they are being belligerent. They have it all pencilled in where peak coal will occur. They do plan to phase it out eventually, but it is a kind of stop-gap measure. Also they are probably telling them to clean up the emissions in the new plants.
Have you any stats on that per Capita claim and how it is measured, as a rough estimate the UK has produced approx 40 billion tonnes over the years. China has exceeded British production since 1958 and closely matched during the early 20th century, we currently produce less than 1 million tonnes China produces almost 4 billion tonnes. At that rate if they have not overtaken us they may do so very soon. |
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Post by patman post on Sept 24, 2024 16:05:20 GMT
Year on year sales of pure EVs have gone down 44% in France and Germany and plans for new EVs are being being dropped by car manufacturers because the demand simply isn't there. The situation is pretty similar in the UK and the rules that EVs (purely electrical cars) must make up 22% of new car sales (and gradually ratchetting up to 100% by 2030) is holding back sales of new conventional cars because EVs are stuck on about 18% and going down. At some point our useless politicians must recognise that there's a problem or we're going to lose what's left of our car industry. But so far none of them have even commented. There have been numerous news articles recently reporting a fall in the number of private individuals who are buying electric cars. Yet the data show that in 2023, private ownership of the cars had never been higher.
The UK has encouraged companies to buy electric cars with a little-known tax benefit. People who get company cars or cars on a salary sacrifice scheme pay almost no benefit-in-kind tax on the value of the car. That caused a huge rise in the number of electric cars registered to private companies.
A record 20,000 people bought ex-company electric cars in Q4 of 2023
Ex-company cars offer a great way to get a good quality, used EV for people who don't usually buy a new car
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Post by sandypine on Sept 24, 2024 18:27:02 GMT
Year on year sales of pure EVs have gone down 44% in France and Germany and plans for new EVs are being being dropped by car manufacturers because the demand simply isn't there. The situation is pretty similar in the UK and the rules that EVs (purely electrical cars) must make up 22% of new car sales (and gradually ratchetting up to 100% by 2030) is holding back sales of new conventional cars because EVs are stuck on about 18% and going down. At some point our useless politicians must recognise that there's a problem or we're going to lose what's left of our car industry. But so far none of them have even commented. There have been numerous news articles recently reporting a fall in the number of private individuals who are buying electric cars. Yet the data show that in 2023, private ownership of the cars had never been higher.
The UK has encouraged companies to buy electric cars with a little-known tax benefit. People who get company cars or cars on a salary sacrifice scheme pay almost no benefit-in-kind tax on the value of the car. That caused a huge rise in the number of electric cars registered to private companies.
A record 20,000 people bought ex-company electric cars in Q4 of 2023
Ex-company cars offer a great way to get a good quality, used EV for people who don't usually buy a new car
I think New Automotive has an axe to grind. If we had a report of how rubbish EVs were from a group funded by Big Oil you would laugh it out of court. |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Sept 24, 2024 21:13:56 GMT
Yes but China would say it has a lot of coal, it is always on the point of not having enough energy and good olde Blighty has burnt a lot more coal per capita than China will ever do. We started hundreds of years back.
That's not to say they are being belligerent. They have it all pencilled in where peak coal will occur. They do plan to phase it out eventually, but it is a kind of stop-gap measure. Also they are probably telling them to clean up the emissions in the new plants.
Have you any stats on that per Capita claim and how it is measured, as a rough estimate the UK has produced approx 40 billion tonnes over the years. China has exceeded British production since 1958 and closely matched during the early 20th century, we currently produce less than 1 million tonnes China produces almost 4 billion tonnes. At that rate if they have not overtaken us they may do so very soon. I have not checked the accuracy of that claim, but it is what the Chinese claim. Well they say Britain had its industrial revolution and they are having theirs now so it is unfair to put out all of those fumes and then kick the ladder away. I do recall seeing the data on coal production. It was on the classic exponential as you would expect since economies are exponential, but it's on its way to turning a corner. They have a date pencilled in for peak coal and another date for net zero. This net zero was originally set for 2060, but now they reckon they might well get there before then and be the first major industrialised economy to reach the target. This is mainly due to technical advances in green energy and the massive increase in investment, especially in the last couple of years where new solar and wind installations have rocketed up. It just goes to show how hard it is to predict the future, but the Chinese government often exceeds its performance targets. As the property sector slumped, so investors switched to investing in green energy instead. |
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Post by Pacifico on Sept 24, 2024 21:24:41 GMT
Have you any stats on that per Capita claim and how it is measured, as a rough estimate the UK has produced approx 40 billion tonnes over the years. China has exceeded British production since 1958 and closely matched during the early 20th century, we currently produce less than 1 million tonnes China produces almost 4 billion tonnes. At that rate if they have not overtaken us they may do so very soon. I have not checked the accuracy of that claim, but it is what the Chinese claim. Well they say Britain had its industrial revolution and they are having theirs now so it is unfair to put out all of those fumes and then kick the ladder away. I do recall seeing the data on coal production. It was on the classic exponential as you would expect since economies are exponential, but it's on its way to turning a corner. They have a date pencilled in for peak coal and another date for net zero. This net zero was originally set for 2060, but now they reckon they might well get there before then and be the first major industrialised economy to reach the target. This is mainly due to technical advances in green energy and the massive increase in investment, especially in the last couple of years where new solar and wind installations have rocketed up. It just goes to show how hard it is to predict the future, but the Chinese government often exceeds its performance targets. As the property sector slumped, so investors switched to investing in green energy instead. What are you talking about?. Chinese CO2 emissions are still rising, unlike the US and Europe.  |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Sept 25, 2024 7:30:31 GMT
I have not checked the accuracy of that claim, but it is what the Chinese claim. Well they say Britain had its industrial revolution and they are having theirs now so it is unfair to put out all of those fumes and then kick the ladder away. I do recall seeing the data on coal production. It was on the classic exponential as you would expect since economies are exponential, but it's on its way to turning a corner. They have a date pencilled in for peak coal and another date for net zero. This net zero was originally set for 2060, but now they reckon they might well get there before then and be the first major industrialised economy to reach the target. This is mainly due to technical advances in green energy and the massive increase in investment, especially in the last couple of years where new solar and wind installations have rocketed up. It just goes to show how hard it is to predict the future, but the Chinese government often exceeds its performance targets. As the property sector slumped, so investors switched to investing in green energy instead. What are you talking about?. Chinese CO2 emissions are still rising, unlike the US and Europe. UK was producing more pollution than that in the 1950s. I have seen CCTV footage of Stoke. |
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Post by Pacifico on Sept 25, 2024 7:43:07 GMT
Don't be daft - the entire world only produced 6 billions tons of CO2 in 1950.
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Sept 25, 2024 8:00:18 GMT
Don't be daft - the entire world only produced 6 billions tons of CO2 in 1950. It was thick smog. It's because we used a lot of coal back then. Coal is one of the dirtiest along with burning wood. CO2 is a harmless gas, but in coal and wood fumes there are hundreds of noxious chemicals.
Also look at the buildings around East Manchester. They may have knocked them down now but they were all black. London you can see it too. The white stone of historic buildings is destroyed.
This is why we really do need electric cars. The cities will have clean air and everything will look clean as well. The government in China recently was very happy with itself as the change in pollution levels in their cities has been dramatic. It's now back to just being s little higher than European levels. India has places were it is dangerously high, but Indians don't give a shit. Amazing how the MSM has never ever mentioned India as the bad man of pollution.
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Post by Dubdrifter on Sept 25, 2024 8:22:13 GMT
When they calculate the CO2 stats on emission benefits of EV’s … do they add up the damage EV owners create queuing at charge points? …. and the extra infra-structure that’s needed to cater for their needs … while they wait hours to get on a charger?.:
… extra coffee supplies ….(more destruction(burning/clearance) of prime Amazon rainforest to set up more coffee plantations)
…. extra donut/cupcake production… switching farmers to food/animal/dairy production(?) … instead of bio-fuel crop production+wood chip burning to give them leccy.🙄
…. building gym workout facilities where EV owners can work off their growing obesity courtesy of extra McDonalds.
…. which => more weight in car … => extra range anxiety => need for extra medications … => extra non-Green Big Pharma medicine production. ….
Oh dear … it’s a vicious cycle of knock on extras … that could all be avoided … by just going for sensible efficient eco diesel/petrol and returning to fossil energy power generation
… surely the most efficient energy gift this planet was given? … which will last us much longer than scare-mongering $$$ Globalists and $$$Green scientists want us to believe.
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Post by Orac on Sept 25, 2024 8:23:16 GMT
I hesitate to point this out, but modern IC cars don't burn coal
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