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Post by Vinny on Aug 27, 2024 13:54:13 GMT
Anyone who promotes Putin's narrative, is either a Kremlinbot, or a brainwashed idiot.
That regime has a track record of invading other countries in violation of the UN Charter, and Article 1 of the CSTO Treaty.
I'm not defending what we did in Iraq, I'm not defending what we did against Serbia.
All violations of the UN Charter are contemptible.
I am standing up for Ukraine's sovereign rights of self defence and self determination.
There is no "making peace" with the dictatorship in Moscow, there is only making peace with its successor.
Surrender land to it would keep it in power, give it time to re arm and there would be another war.
A war in which the dictatorship had developed smart weapons on a par with the HIMARS, and even more will die.
Peace can only be achieved by defeating that dictatorship and encouraging the Russians to overthrow it in a revolution.
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Post by Bentley on Aug 27, 2024 13:59:33 GMT
Ah. Whatever is not your narrative must be Putins narrative ….therefore anyone not posting your narrative is a Kremlin bot and brainwashed idiot .
Got it 👍
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Post by Vinny on Aug 27, 2024 14:02:40 GMT
The idea that peace can be achieved by Ukraine ceding land to Russia, is bollocks.
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Post by Bentley on Aug 27, 2024 14:12:12 GMT
The idea that peace can be achieved by Ukraine ceding land to Russia, is bollocks. That’s up to the US. They can’t here your ranting . |
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Post by Vinny on Aug 27, 2024 14:58:07 GMT
No, it's up to the Ukrainians.
Ukraine is a sovereign country not a US colony.
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Post by Bentley on Aug 27, 2024 15:09:29 GMT
No, it's up to the Ukrainians. Ukraine is a sovereign country not a US colony. Nope. If the US turns off the tap they are finished . If the US turns down the tap they will forced to negotiate with Russia. |
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Post by Vinny on Aug 27, 2024 17:07:41 GMT
Nonsense, Ukraine have started manufacturing their own smart cruise missiles.
Ukraine have already pushed Russia past the point of recovery. Putin has already reached the point that he's losing men and equipment faster than he can replace it.
He's unable to launch a successful counter attack in Kursk and Ukraine are expanding their buffer zone.
He's foolishly wasting his most powerful weapons on civilian targets rather than military and Ukraine keep bombing his airfields, fuel depots, oil refineries, ammunition warehouses, and logistics.
He's had to suspend fuel sales to the outside world he's lost so many refineries.
He's haemorrhaging men and equipment in Donbas.
His air defence is being pummeled in Crimea.
He is being defeated and the Oligarchs are openly starting to question the war without being killed for it.
He's losing his grip.
A coup in Russia is inevitable.
As things deteriorate more for Putin, the likelihood of him being killed increases. He surrounded himself with murderers and an Et Tu Brute moment will come, because they will not want to go down with him.
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Post by Bentley on Aug 27, 2024 17:14:47 GMT
Nonsense, Ukraine have started manufacturing their own smart cruise missiles. Ukraine have already pushed Russia past the point of recovery. Putin has already reached the point that he's losing men and equipment faster than he can replace it. He's unable to launch a successful counter attack in Kursk and Ukraine are expanding their buffer zone. He's foolishly wasting his most powerful weapons on civilian targets rather than military and Ukraine keep bombing his airfields, fuel depots, oil refineries, ammunition warehouses, and logistics. He's had to suspend fuel sales to the outside world he's lost so many refineries. He's haemorrhaging men and equipment in Donbas. His air defence is being pummeled in Crimea. He is being defeated and the Oligarchs are openly starting to question the war without being killed for it. He's losing his grip. A coup in Russia is inevitable. As things deteriorate more for Putin, the likelihood of him being killed increases. He surrounded himself with murderers and an Et Tu Brute moment will come, because they will not want to go down with him. Oh that’s alright then. Maybe Ukraine should give our weapons back , if they are doing ok . IIRC Zelensky is begging the US to let them use the weapons the US gave them to attack Russia. Hardly the actions of an independent military. And we get the usual bollocks about an imminent coup . You was posting this two years ago iirc. Putin is going to die of old age at this rate |
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Post by Vinny on Aug 27, 2024 17:21:53 GMT
The best defence is a good offensive. Ukraine have done what was necessary. Putin can have Kursk back when he gives Ukraine Donbas and Crimea back and cuts the Kerch bridges.
If he doesn't, Ukraine will destroy his means to sustain the illegal occupation and your misguided opinion doesn't matter.
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Post by Bentley on Aug 27, 2024 17:26:01 GMT
The best defence is a good offensive. Ukraine have done what was necessary. Putin can have Kursk back when he gives Ukraine Donbas and Crimea back and cuts the Kerch bridges. If he doesn't, Ukraine will destroy his means to sustain the illegal occupation and your misguided opinion doesn't matter. Until Ukraine can knock out its own super weapons it will rely on the US to keep it in the war . Until then the US will effectively control the progress of the war . |
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Post by Vinny on Aug 27, 2024 17:49:11 GMT
The best defence is a good offensive. Ukraine have done what was necessary. Putin can have Kursk back when he gives Ukraine Donbas and Crimea back and cuts the Kerch bridges. If he doesn't, Ukraine will destroy his means to sustain the illegal occupation and your misguided opinion doesn't matter. Until Ukraine can knock out its own super weapons it will rely on the US to keep it in the war . Until then the US will effectively control the progress of the war . Neptune missile modifications allow it to hit ground targets at greater range than that of a HIMARS with equivalent accuracy and with greater stopping power. It is already happening. And you cannot explain why Putin is unable to counter attack forces in the Kursk buffer zone. I can. He's already too short of men and equipment. The untrained conscripts he keeps sending in keep getting slaughtered. They lack tanks, infantry fighting vehicles and artillery support. Ukraine have already destroyed so much Russian armour Putin can't replace it, and has even resorted to dragging out T-55s. The Turtle Tank is now a thing too.  But Ukraine are destroying those as well.  Putin thought this war would be like the others, he gets his way, the west does nothing, keeps buying his oil, keeps allowing Oligarch gangsters to launder his money. He was wrong. We realised our mistakes, our appeasement of him encouraged him. Now we help his victims instead, because the alternative is to sit back and watch full on genocide begin and go unpunished. |
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Post by Bentley on Aug 27, 2024 17:56:52 GMT
Until Ukraine can knock out its own super weapons it will rely on the US to keep it in the war . Until then the US will effectively control the progress of the war . Neptune missile modifications allow it to hit ground targets at greater range than that of a HIMARS with equivalent accuracy and with greater stopping power. It is already happening. And you cannot explain why Putin is unable to counter attack forces in the Kursk buffer zone. I can. He's already too short of men and equipment. The untrained conscripts he keeps sending in keep getting slaughtered. They lack tanks, infantry fighting vehicles and artillery support. Ukraine have already destroyed so much Russian armour Putin can't replace it, and has even resorted to dragging out T-55s. The Turtle Tank is now a thing too. But Ukraine are destroying those as well. Putin thought this war would be like the others, he gets his way, the west does nothing, keeps buying his oil, keeps allowing Oligarch gangsters to launder his money. He was wrong. We realised our mistakes, our appeasement of him encouraged him. Now we help his victims instead, because the alternative is to sit back and watch full on genocide begin and go unpunished. Well if Ukraine doesnt need the US , they should give back the weapons and Zelensky should stop begging the west to let them use the weapons on Russia. He doesn’t need the weapons or permission to use them , does he ?. |
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Post by thomas on Aug 27, 2024 18:01:33 GMT
Ah. Whatever is not your narrative must be Putins narrative ….therefore anyone not posting your narrative is a Kremlin bot and brainwashed idiot . Got it 👍 pretty much this Bentley. Wasting your time on any Ukraine thread vinny has either started or is participating in. you won't get any coherent discussion about this war from vinny. As we see in most threads , its not about debate with vinny , he merely want a platform to lecture from without any disagreement or debate. It never occurs to him there might be wider global politics at play here. Its simply good versus bad , toy soldier stuff. |
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Post by Bentley on Aug 27, 2024 18:03:34 GMT
Ah. Whatever is not your narrative must be Putins narrative ….therefore anyone not posting your narrative is a Kremlin bot and brainwashed idiot . Got it 👍 pretty much this Bentley. Wasting your time on any Ukraine thread vinny has either started or is participating in. you won't get any coherent discussion about this war from vinny. As we see in most threads , its not about debate with vinny , he merely want a platform to lecture from without any disagreement or debate. It never occurs to him there might be wider global politics at play here. Its simply good versus bad , toy soldier stuff. Yup. Every post comes with a cod history lesson and an attempt to refute something that you never said . Kiwpootin. |
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Post by Vinny on Aug 27, 2024 18:05:06 GMT
When the war is over they will be able to pay for those weapons.
And your arguments are crap.
Putin needs defeating.
That's priority one.
Once Putin is defeated, it will be necessary to engage with Russia and do a sort of Marshall plan, to help them come out of the cold and become a prosperous democracy.
The ideal situation would be for NATO to no longer be needed one day and be peacefully disbanded.
But as long as there are threats, like Putin is presently a threat, NATO is needed as much as I wish it wasn't.
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