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Post by Pacifico on Jul 25, 2024 14:40:45 GMT
Robert Jenrick has thrown his hat in the ring: www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clmypvr4p49oSome serious barrel scraping going on here. Robert Jenrick: would leave the ECHR James Cleverly (least appropriately named MP ever): would leave the ECHR Tom Tugendhat: would leave the ECHR All we need now is Suella Braverman and we have the top table a the Conservative Party Hitler Appreciated Society. Anyone who even remotely cares about their own human rights needs to make sure none of these nutjobs are ever put in charge of the Tory Party All The Best It strikes me that the Conservatives aren't yet ready to have a proper, unflinching reflection on why they lost the election. They went through a similar process after 97. They lost because they were too left-wing and their core support either stayed home or voted Reform. The question is whether anyone is able to regain the lost trust of those voters. After years of talking right-wing yet lurching ever further left-wing in their policies will anyone give them another chance. |
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Post by happyhornet3 on Jul 25, 2024 16:05:18 GMT
It strikes me that the Conservatives aren't yet ready to have a proper, unflinching reflection on why they lost the election. They went through a similar process after 97. They lost because they were too left-wing and their core support either stayed home or voted Reform. The question is whether anyone is able to regain the lost trust of those voters. After years of talking right-wing yet lurching ever further left-wing in their policies will anyone give them another chance. I think this is an example of the denial I was talking about, reaching for the "they weren't right wing enough" comfort blanket. They lost 5 seats to the right of them and hundreds to the left. Take for example the blue wall seats they lost to the Lib Dems, do you think people in those constituencies voted Lib Dem because they thought they were more right wing than the Tories? Are you prepared to entertain the possibility that the state of the economy, public services, Tory incompetence and corruption might have been factors in their defeat? |
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Post by Bentley on Jul 25, 2024 16:12:35 GMT
There was plenty of right wing rhetoric from the Tories but little action .
People lost faith in the Tories commitment to a right wing agenda .
The last thing hitherto conservative voters need is a leftie telling them that they are in denial .
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Post by sandypine on Jul 25, 2024 16:14:25 GMT
They lost because they were too left-wing and their core support either stayed home or voted Reform. The question is whether anyone is able to regain the lost trust of those voters. After years of talking right-wing yet lurching ever further left-wing in their policies will anyone give them another chance. I think this is an example of the denial I was talking about, reaching for the "they weren't right wing enough" comfort blanket. They lost 5 seats to the right of them and hundreds to the left. Take for example the blue wall seats they lost to the Lib Dems, do you think people in those constituencies voted Lib Dem because they thought they were more right wing than the Tories? Are you prepared to entertain the possibility that the state of the economy, public services, Tory incompetence and corruption might have been factors in their defeat? That is a strange outlook as they lost lots of votes to the right of them and very few to the left of them. In that situation seats are meaningless. It is where your votes go that counts and with over 4 million to Reform then that should tell them something. It may do but then we will be in the old cycle of saying something to get the votes and then doing something else in government. Four times now we have seen the Tory manifesto 'down to tens of thousands' and four times we have been let down and it is 14 years now and another what 6 million more |
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Post by happyhornet3 on Jul 25, 2024 16:15:31 GMT
There was plenty of right wing rhetoric from the Tories but little action . People lost faith in the Tories commitment to a right wing agenda . The last thing hitherto conservative voters need is a leftie telling them that they are in denial . Yes that's right, dismiss the opinions of voters, that's worked out really well for them lately. |
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Post by Bentley on Jul 25, 2024 16:20:06 GMT
There was plenty of right wing rhetoric from the Tories but little action . People lost faith in the Tories commitment to a right wing agenda . The last thing hitherto conservative voters need is a leftie telling them that they are in denial . Yes that's right, dismiss the opinions of voters, that's worked out really well for them lately. Oh the irony . From a leftie telling centre right wingers that they are denial ^ Id like to know how you worked out that it was me that dismissed the opinions of voters when you dismissed the opinion of Pacifico as a ‘ comfort blanket ‘. |
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Post by happyhornet3 on Jul 25, 2024 16:21:41 GMT
I think this is an example of the denial I was talking about, reaching for the "they weren't right wing enough" comfort blanket. They lost 5 seats to the right of them and hundreds to the left. Take for example the blue wall seats they lost to the Lib Dems, do you think people in those constituencies voted Lib Dem because they thought they were more right wing than the Tories? Are you prepared to entertain the possibility that the state of the economy, public services, Tory incompetence and corruption might have been factors in their defeat? That is a strange outlook as they lost lots of votes to the right of them and very few to the left of them. In that situation seats are meaningless. It is where your votes go that counts and with over 4 million to Reform then that should tell them something. It may do but then we will be in the old cycle of saying something to get the votes and then doing something else in government. Four times now we have seen the Tory manifesto 'down to tens of thousands' and four times we have been let down and it is 14 years now and another what 6 million more I believe that four Tory cabinet ministers seats were unseated by the Lib Dems whose gains dwarfed those of Reform. Moving further to the right won't win those seats back for the Tories. Looking like a serious party of government rather than a caricature of themselves would be a good start. |
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Post by Bentley on Jul 25, 2024 16:25:36 GMT
Moving to the right will provide an alternative to the left wing government that we have.
If Labour disappoints then a move to the right might be the people’s choice .
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Post by happyhornet3 on Jul 25, 2024 16:25:40 GMT
Yes that's right, dismiss the opinions of voters, that's worked out really well for them lately. Oh the irony . From a leftie telling centre right wingers that they are denial ^ Id like to know how you worked out that it was me that dismissed the opinions of voters when you dismissed the opinion of Pacifico as a ‘ comfort blanket ‘. What am I in denial about? It's not me that needs to win back the voters. |
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Post by Bentley on Jul 25, 2024 16:29:09 GMT
Oh the irony . From a leftie telling centre right wingers that they are denial ^ Id like to know how you worked out that it was me that dismissed the opinions of voters when you dismissed the opinion of Pacifico as a ‘ comfort blanket ‘. What am I in denial about? It's not me that needs to win back the voters. Do you actually read the guff you post or are you being deliberately dishonest? YOU posted “ I think this is an example of the denial I was talking about, reaching for the "they weren't right wing enough" comfort blanket.“ No one said that you were in denial. …..YOU projected it at another poster. |
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Post by happyhornet3 on Jul 25, 2024 16:30:26 GMT
Moving to the right will provide an alternative to the left wing government that we have. If Labour disappoints then a move to the right might be the people’s choice . A sensible centre right party led by a serious grown up focusing on voters real world concerns like the economy, job security, the NHS and education would be most welcome for me personally and keep Labour on their toes. A more extreme version of the punch and judy infighting rabble we saw before focusing on culture war fringe issues and crackpot money burning schemes like Rwanda isn't going to get the Conservatives back into power. |
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Post by happyhornet3 on Jul 25, 2024 16:31:06 GMT
What am I in denial about? It's not me that needs to win back the voters. Do you actually read the guff you post or are you being deliberately dishonest? YOU posted “ I think this is an example of the denial I was talking about, reaching for the "they weren't right wing enough" comfort blanket.“ No one said that you were in denial. …..YOU projected it at another poster. So why would it be ironic for me to tell someone they are in denial? |
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Post by Bentley on Jul 25, 2024 16:32:43 GMT
Moving to the right will provide an alternative to the left wing government that we have. If Labour disappoints then a move to the right might be the people’s choice . A sensible centre right party led by a serious grown up focusing on voters real world concerns like the economy, job security, the NHS and education would be most welcome for me personally and keep Labour on their toes. A more extreme version of the punch and judy infighting rabble we saw before focusing on culture war fringe issues and crackpot money burning schemes like Rwanda isn't going to get the Conservatives back into power. So now you accept that a Tory government that was fitter to the right than the last could work . |
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Post by Bentley on Jul 25, 2024 16:34:23 GMT
Do you actually read the guff you post or are you being deliberately dishonest? YOU posted “ I think this is an example of the denial I was talking about, reaching for the "they weren't right wing enough" comfort blanket.“ No one said that you were in denial. …..YOU projected it at another poster. So why would it be ironic for me to tell someone they are in denial? I repeat. Do you actually read the guff you post or just post random replies that have nothing to do with the post you replied to? |
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Post by happyhornet3 on Jul 25, 2024 16:36:23 GMT
So why would it be ironic for me to tell someone they are in denial? I repeat. Do you actually read the guff you post or just post random replies that have nothing to do with the post you replied to? You commented on the irony of me telling someone they are in denial. Surely the only way that could be ironic is if I was in denial about something? |
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