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Post by Red Rackham on Jan 26, 2024 10:40:17 GMT
Whilst I understand the relatives of those killed lashing out in order to find who was at fault for this sad episode we expect too much of a service stretched to the limit,black white or whatever if someone is defined as mentally ill they are suffering as much as anyone with a physical illness,it’s all too easy to blame the cops for all societies ills and I don’t really want to repeat why we are in the position we are now other than mental health is the Cinderella service nothing changes and less than a year ago this thread looked at the police’s frustrations linkThe police are under the spotlight for apparently ignoring or forgetting to enforce an arrest warrant for Calocane for seriously assaulting a police officer nine months previously. Calocane has a more impressive rap sheet than Saint George Floyd. I mean, what the hell are the police playing at? Perhaps they were busy working on their pronouns, perish the thought they might offend someone. |
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Post by wapentake on Jan 26, 2024 10:52:51 GMT
Whilst I understand the relatives of those killed lashing out in order to find who was at fault for this sad episode we expect too much of a service stretched to the limit,black white or whatever if someone is defined as mentally ill they are suffering as much as anyone with a physical illness,it’s all too easy to blame the cops for all societies ills and I don’t really want to repeat why we are in the position we are now other than mental health is the Cinderella service nothing changes and less than a year ago this thread looked at the police’s frustrations linkThe police are under the spotlight for apparently ignoring or forgetting to enforce an arrest warrant for Calocane for seriously assaulting a police officer nine months previously. Calocane has a more impressive rap sheet than Saint George Floyd. I mean, what the hell are the police playing at? Perhaps they were busy working on their pronouns, perish the thought they might offend someone. Police numbers despite all the trumpeting of how they’ve employed so many more are iirc lower than they were in 2010 and since that time the population legally or not living here has risen by numbers that are admitted to by at the very least around 5.5 million people so bearing those numbers in mind the increase in lawlessness too and expectations demanded of a smaller workforce is there any wonder such incidents occur. The attorney general is imo grandstanding the judge said he expects the sentenced man to remain in a secure hospital for the rest of his days. |
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Post by dappy on Jan 26, 2024 10:56:51 GMT
FFS Red, the Attorney General has got involved purely to seek to manage the media firestorm. It seems to be the way these days. The judge who heard the evidence in the Mair case concluded that the evidence showed that he was sufficiently in control of his mental capacity to be held legally responsible for his actions. The evidence in Calicane's case was found to show that he wasn't. I suspect in both cases those judgements were quite close to the line. The effect is basically the same - both men will be behind bars almost certainly for the rest of their lives - they may even be held in the same secure mental health "hospital" - who knows. Honestly your attempts to concoct a racial motive for how these two offenders were dealt with shows a concerning level of paranoia - try to get some help there mate . Lets not allow ourselves to be diverted from the real issue - how we deal with seriously mentally ill people and not fall for the diversion techniques. The Attorney General has very quickly decided to review this sentence because it is so obviously lenient. I believe she has 28 days to deliberate. Calicane didn't accidentally happen upon his victims, he went looking for people to kill, he gathered weapons and planned his attacks which clearly shows intent. The trial judge should have convicted him of murder, not manslaughter. Hopefully this miscarriage of justice will be overturned. Did you listen to the judges explanation and sentencing and even try to understand it rather than just kneejerking. Based on the evidence provided (actually I dont think it was even up to the judge) it was found that Calocane mental illness was so severe that he could not be legally found to be fully responsible for his criminal actions. Its not a case of being lenient FFS. In practical terms it makes no difference whether he was found guilty of murder or manslaughter due to diminished responsibility. He has been locked up in a secure mental hospital (effectively a prison) almost certainly for the rest of his life. What on earth are you complaining about. |
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Post by Fairsociety on Jan 26, 2024 10:57:06 GMT
They do have mental health wards, problem is they are chocca, with a lot in there asking can they have their PIP forms filled in, because now you can claim lots of money for mental health issues, and be sure if there is a bandwagon to jump on people will jump on it, so now it's sorting out the genuine from the greedy.
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Post by seniorcitizen007 on Jan 26, 2024 11:08:36 GMT
Valdo Calocane is a full blown paranoid schizophrenic who denies he is ill and continues to insist that he is controlled by voices MI5 implant in his mind. Even Clozapine doesn't work for him. He appears to be "As mad as a hatter" as they say.
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Post by Orac on Jan 26, 2024 11:16:13 GMT
The Attorney General has very quickly decided to review this sentence because it is so obviously lenient. I believe she has 28 days to deliberate. Calicane didn't accidentally happen upon his victims, he went looking for people to kill, he gathered weapons and planned his attacks which clearly shows intent. The trial judge should have convicted him of murder, not manslaughter. Hopefully this miscarriage of justice will be overturned. Did you listen to the judges explanation and sentencing and even try to understand it rather than just kneejerking. Based on the evidence provided (actually I dont think it was even up to the judge) it was found that Calocane mental illness was so severe that he could not be legally found to be fully responsible for his criminal actions. Its not a case of being lenient FFS. In practical terms it makes no difference whether he was found guilty of murder or manslaughter due to diminished responsibility. He has been locked up in a secure mental hospital (effectively a prison) almost certainly for the rest of his life. What on earth are you complaining about. You are talking as if his lack of responsibility for his actions were a fact. I think you would have to be pretty naive to hold this position. I think red is complaining about the failure of the legal system to apply a proper punishment for murder |
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Post by piglet on Jan 26, 2024 11:20:41 GMT
A basic clinical mistake was made, this person was taking tablets, the responsibity for his treatment was in his hands, disaster guaranteed. He should have been on an intramuscular injection, if he failed to attend an appointment then the nurses and doctors would know and would take the nescessary steps. Any DNA is a cause for concern, medication begins to degrade in the body, the person becomes ill. To put a person like this on tablets is a rookie mistake.
He was wandering the streets for months if not years in a psychotic state, a paranoid schizophrenic, they appear normal, not disintegrated like other schizophrenics, till they act on their illness, the paranoid type is the worst of all illnesses.
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Post by jonksy on Jan 26, 2024 14:31:06 GMT
Starmer backs inquiry into failings that led to 'absolutely awful' Nottingham attacks...
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Post by jonksy on Jan 26, 2024 17:20:57 GMT
Labour: Gaps in mental health system must be looked at.....
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Post by wapentake on Jan 26, 2024 19:16:21 GMT
Labour: Gaps in mental health system must be looked at.....
More grandstanding like the attorney general,gaps between politicians ears need looking at if they think we swallow their fake concern. |
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Post by Totheleft on Jan 27, 2024 5:48:54 GMT
It was actually Margret Thatcher that phased out institutionalised care and put the responsibility in the hands of the local community in the early 80'sThat did see many thousands allowed to participate in society without any degree of harm either to themselves or anybody else . The failure in this case is that those responsible for making sure this person wasn't a danger to anyone failed in their duty to do so . Care in the community means exactly that ,care and nobody it seems took enough of it . Yes it was. Thatcher closed all the mental health facilities and threw the patients onto the street and called "care in the community,,,
My gripe is that blair opened the floodgates and the lefty bleading heart lawyers made/and making a fortune from those who should not been allowed to come here in the first place. And as for social services we here time after time where infants and adults have been let down byy the system. Blair was supposedly going to increase funds and give more backing to "community care" instead of that it became another behemoth that answers to no one..
So you post is faux care . You just wanted to post your Racism again You truly are a idiot. Jekyll and Hyde' assassin was a loner who scoured himself with Brillo pads because of cleanliness obsession and spent his life on mental health drugs |
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Post by Totheleft on Jan 27, 2024 6:00:18 GMT
Interesting comparison: In 2016 Thomas Mair murdered Labour MP Jo Cox. Mair had a history of mental health problems, at the time of the murder he was on medication and was also a patient of the Mirfield-based Pathways Day Centre for adults with mental illness. Mair was a white man who was described as a supporter of the 'far right'. In spite of Mair's history of mental health problems the trial judge decided that when he murdered Jo Cox, he was sane.  Valdo Calicane killed three people and had a history of mental health problems. However on this occasion the trial judge accepted a plea of diminished responsibility due to mental health problems and found Calicone guilty of manslaughter. In other words, Calicane has litterally got away with murder, for the time being anyway.  Another case of an inconsistent judiciary? I suppose we will have to see what the Attorney General decides of Calicane's unduly lenient sentence. You do know that Meir the Far Right supporter killed Mrs COX for her Political Views. And he didn't have a Serious Mental health issues where he's a threat to him Selve or other people. That's the Difference. Jekyll and Hyde' assassin was a loner who scoured himself with Brillo pads because of cleanliness obsession and spent his life on mental health drugs |
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Post by Totheleft on Jan 27, 2024 6:04:55 GMT
They do have mental health wards, problem is they are chocca, with a lot in there asking can they have their PIP forms filled in, because now you can claim lots of money for mental health issues, and be sure if there is a bandwagon to jump on people will jump on it, so now it's sorting out the genuine from the greedy. What on earth you on about from the Greedy ? No.wonder I call you a Man of No Moral Standing with a Moronic Statement like that. |
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Post by jonksy on Jan 27, 2024 6:57:47 GMT
Yes it was. Thatcher closed all the mental health facilities and threw the patients onto the street and called "care in the community,,,
My gripe is that blair opened the floodgates and the lefty bleading heart lawyers made/and making a fortune from those who should not been allowed to come here in the first place. And as for social services we here time after time where infants and adults have been let down byy the system. Blair was supposedly going to increase funds and give more backing to "community care" instead of that it became another behemoth that answers to no one..
You just wanted to post your Racism again You truly are a idiot. Jekyll and Hyde' assassin was a loner who scoured himself with Brillo pads because of cleanliness obsession and spent his life on mental health drugs More bollocks from the boards pet idiot.
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Post by Totheleft on Jan 27, 2024 7:05:40 GMT
So you post is faux care .
You just wanted to post your Racism again You truly are a idiot. Jekyll and Hyde' assassin was a loner who scoured himself with Brillo pads because of cleanliness obsession and spent his life on mental health drugs More bollocks from the boards pet idiot.
Is this from the man who Said that British Ethnic minorities are Foreigners? You made your racism very Clear on Several occasions. |
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