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Post by Fairsociety on Dec 12, 2023 17:48:53 GMT
There was a period when these gangs were pleasing themselves. Are you claiming that they are still there and are still pleasing themselves today? Have you some evidence to suggest otherwise? Have you some evidence to suggest otherwise? Please try answering my question first. Do you mean 'pleasing' or pleasuring themselves? |
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Post by see2 on Dec 12, 2023 19:43:00 GMT
Have you some evidence to suggest otherwise? Please try answering my question first. Do you mean 'pleasing' or pleasuring themselves? "pleasing" themselves. |
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Post by Pacifico on Dec 13, 2023 8:41:58 GMT
Remember - Diversity is a strength....  |
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Post by wapentake on Dec 13, 2023 9:04:56 GMT
I don't want to delve too deeply into this, because the subject has been done to death, but before we condemn the police and other authorities too harshly it's worth considering the victims: They largely came from broken homes, care homes and criminal backgrounds. Runaways, waifs & strays, drug addicts. The very people, in other words, who were least likely to speak to the police, the least likely to cooperate with prosecutions and the least likely to be believed/make credible witnesses if they did. Which is exactly why they were targeted in the first place. These days we'd call them “Vulnerable” but I'm not sure that the system would be any more sympathetic to such people now. All that reminds me of a tv programme some years ago before all this kicked off that followed the police who were returning young girls they found out and about on the streets late at night to care homes. The police lectured them on the dangers they faced,the kids laughed at them and said as soon as you’re gone we’re off out again. The care home staff shrugged their shoulders and said they couldn’t lock them in because it infringed their human rights,the cops frustrated because they kept returning the same faces obviously gave up. Something was at fault but it can’t all be laid the police’s door. |
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Post by steppenwolf on Dec 13, 2023 9:07:53 GMT
Victim blaming. It reminds me of a BBC R4 Enquiry program about one of the abused girls (Rochdale IIRC) who had agreed to help the police with prosecution of a muslim gang who had abused her, provided she was given protection. The gang got off (which is quite common) and the police didn't give her any protection. These monsters found out where she lived and came round and smashed her flat up. For good measure one of them held her hand over a lit gas hob burning her severely. She called the police who came round and took her to hospital.
Very good of them. But then the police decided to section her under the mental health act. No action was taken against the Pakistanis of course. This is hard to believe of course, but it's probably still on the iPlayer (or Sounds).
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Post by happyhornet on Dec 13, 2023 9:12:33 GMT
The single case you eventually found ^ is not a 'grooming gang' who were charged with type 1 CSE offences. They are certainly low life scum who should, in my opinion, have received far harsher sentences. However, gangs of low life scum who are charged with type 1 CSE offences tend to be entirely or predominantly made up of men of Pakistani heritage, who incidentally make up just 2.7% of the UK population. In other words, when it comes to Child Sexual Exploitation offences, men of Pakistani heritage are prolific offenders. "The majority of child sexual abuse gangs are made up of white men under the age of 30, an official paper has said. The report, which covers England, Scotland and Wales and summarises a range of studies on the issue of group-based child sexual exploitation (CSE), also known as grooming gangs, said there was not enough evidence to conclude that child sexual abuse gangs were disproportionately made up of Asian offenders." www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/dec/15/child-sexual-abuse-gangs-white-men-home-office-report |
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Post by steppenwolf on Dec 13, 2023 9:12:51 GMT
I don't want to delve too deeply into this, because the subject has been done to death, but before we condemn the police and other authorities too harshly it's worth considering the victims: They largely came from broken homes, care homes and criminal backgrounds. Runaways, waifs & strays, drug addicts. The very people, in other words, who were least likely to speak to the police, the least likely to cooperate with prosecutions and the least likely to be believed/make credible witnesses if they did. Which is exactly why they were targeted in the first place. These days we'd call them “Vulnerable” but I'm not sure that the system would be any more sympathetic to such people now. All that reminds me of a tv programme some years ago before all this kicked off that followed the police who were returning young girls they found out and about on the streets late at night to care homes. The police lectured them on the dangers they faced,the kids laughed at them and said as soon as you’re gone we’re off out again. The care home staff shrugged their shoulders and said they couldn’t lock them in because it infringed their human rights,the cops frustrated because they kept returning the same faces obviously gave up. Something was at fault but it can’t all be laid the police’s door. I wonder if that's actually true. Which TV program was it? It sounds like something a policeman might make up but you need to hear both sides of the story. |
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Post by wapentake on Dec 13, 2023 9:24:22 GMT
All that reminds me of a tv programme some years ago before all this kicked off that followed the police who were returning young girls they found out and about on the streets late at night to care homes. The police lectured them on the dangers they faced,the kids laughed at them and said as soon as you’re gone we’re off out again. The care home staff shrugged their shoulders and said they couldn’t lock them in because it infringed their human rights,the cops frustrated because they kept returning the same faces obviously gave up. Something was at fault but it can’t all be laid the police’s door. I wonder if that's actually true. Which TV program was it? It sounds like something a policeman might make up but you need to hear both sides of the story. Can’t remember the actual prog but as said it was years before all this came to light,it was nothing a copper made up it was a tv crew following ordinary cops but it was on the issue of kids in care homes and how they were left to their own devices. The cops on a roundabout of returning the same kids night after night,the care home staffs action tied by human rights,it only came back to me after reading Squeezeds post. The point being made that you can’t pile all the blame on the cops,and it’s not victim blaming either but isn’t there something wrong with the system that allowed this to happen |
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Post by wapentake on Dec 13, 2023 9:33:23 GMT
Victim blaming. It reminds me of a BBC R4 Enquiry program about one of the abused girls (Rochdale IIRC) who had agreed to help the police with prosecution of a muslim gang who had abused her, provided she was given protection. The gang got off (which is quite common) and the police didn't give her any protection. These monsters found out where she lived and came round and smashed her flat up. For good measure one of them held her hand over a lit gas hob burning her severely. She called the police who came round and took her to hospital. Very good of them. But then the police decided to section her under the mental health act. No action was taken against the Pakistanis of course. This is hard to believe of course, but it's probably still on the iPlayer (or Sounds). Is this the program you were thinking of? www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000kvUpdate there was this also www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/b01rg231 |
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Post by sandypine on Dec 13, 2023 9:57:17 GMT
The single case you eventually found ^ is not a 'grooming gang' who were charged with type 1 CSE offences. They are certainly low life scum who should, in my opinion, have received far harsher sentences. However, gangs of low life scum who are charged with type 1 CSE offences tend to be entirely or predominantly made up of men of Pakistani heritage, who incidentally make up just 2.7% of the UK population. In other words, when it comes to Child Sexual Exploitation offences, men of Pakistani heritage are prolific offenders. "The majority of child sexual abuse gangs are made up of white men under the age of 30, an official paper has said. The report, which covers England, Scotland and Wales and summarises a range of studies on the issue of group-based child sexual exploitation (CSE), also known as grooming gangs, said there was not enough evidence to conclude that child sexual abuse gangs were disproportionately made up of Asian offenders." www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/dec/15/child-sexual-abuse-gangs-white-men-home-office-report Every report tries its hardest to downplay the problem by misrepresentation and concentrate on overall child abuse and highlight most child abusers are white, in a land with over 80% of men being white this is not surprising. What they tend to ignore is the factors as regards the Asian grooming gangs that makes then a specific problem. Most child abuse is family and/or same ethnic group related. In the case of the Pakistan gangs it is quite specific that the victims are obtained from outside their own ethno-religious group and that the age of the girls is close to the age of consent. In areas where varied ethnic groups exist side by side the gangs are usually Asian. The preponderance of the Asian gangs recently convicted is enormous when related to the proportion in the wider community. These are facts that everyone tries their best to downplay but exist as an uncomfortable fact within the Multicultural dream. |
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Post by happyhornet on Dec 13, 2023 11:00:15 GMT
"The majority of child sexual abuse gangs are made up of white men under the age of 30, an official paper has said. The report, which covers England, Scotland and Wales and summarises a range of studies on the issue of group-based child sexual exploitation (CSE), also known as grooming gangs, said there was not enough evidence to conclude that child sexual abuse gangs were disproportionately made up of Asian offenders." www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/dec/15/child-sexual-abuse-gangs-white-men-home-office-report Every report tries its hardest to downplay the problem by misrepresentation and concentrate on overall child abuse and highlight most child abusers are white, in a land with over 80% of men being white this is not surprising. What they tend to ignore is the factors as regards the Asian grooming gangs that makes then a specific problem. Most child abuse is family and/or same ethnic group related. In the case of the Pakistan gangs it is quite specific that the victims are obtained from outside their own ethno-religious group and that the age of the girls is close to the age of consent. In areas where varied ethnic groups exist side by side the gangs are usually Asian. The preponderance of the Asian gangs recently convicted is enormous when related to the proportion in the wider community. These are facts that everyone tries their best to downplay but exist as an uncomfortable fact within the Multicultural dream. "The report said there was not enough evidence to conclude that child sexual abuse gangs were disproportionately made up of Asian offenders." |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Dec 13, 2023 11:09:29 GMT
I don't want to delve too deeply into this, because the subject has been done to death, but before we condemn the police and other authorities too harshly it's worth considering the victims: They largely came from broken homes, care homes and criminal backgrounds. Runaways, waifs & strays, drug addicts. The very people, in other words, who were least likely to speak to the police, the least likely to cooperate with prosecutions and the least likely to be believed/make credible witnesses if they did. Which is exactly why they were targeted in the first place. These days we'd call them “Vulnerable” but I'm not sure that the system would be any more sympathetic to such people now. All that reminds me of a tv programme some years ago before all this kicked off that followed the police who were returning young girls they found out and about on the streets late at night to care homes. The police lectured them on the dangers they faced,the kids laughed at them and said as soon as you’re gone we’re off out again. The care home staff shrugged their shoulders and said they couldn’t lock them in because it infringed their human rights,the cops frustrated because they kept returning the same faces obviously gave up. Something was at fault but it can’t all be laid the police’s door. It's a societal issue which the grooming gangs have exploited.
The police and authorities may not have covered themselves in glory, but they didn't put these girls into positions of vulnerability in the first place.
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Post by sandypine on Dec 13, 2023 16:28:27 GMT
Every report tries its hardest to downplay the problem by misrepresentation and concentrate on overall child abuse and highlight most child abusers are white, in a land with over 80% of men being white this is not surprising. What they tend to ignore is the factors as regards the Asian grooming gangs that makes then a specific problem. Most child abuse is family and/or same ethnic group related. In the case of the Pakistan gangs it is quite specific that the victims are obtained from outside their own ethno-religious group and that the age of the girls is close to the age of consent. In areas where varied ethnic groups exist side by side the gangs are usually Asian. The preponderance of the Asian gangs recently convicted is enormous when related to the proportion in the wider community. These are facts that everyone tries their best to downplay but exist as an uncomfortable fact within the Multicultural dream. "The report said there was not enough evidence to conclude that child sexual abuse gangs were disproportionately made up of Asian offenders." There is never enough evidence if one does not actively seek it nor allow its proper collection. It is just another aspect of the attempt to downplay problems with both Multiculturalism and Islam. The public in general no longer trust any report that finds that everyone is to blame. Over the years, and the antics of many trying to keep the problems from public view, is bringing into stark view the determination with which cohesion is much more important than truth. Not a good look. |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Dec 13, 2023 17:10:40 GMT
Remember - Diversity is a strength.... Good action by the police. |
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Post by sandypine on Dec 13, 2023 19:17:20 GMT
Every report tries its hardest to downplay the problem by misrepresentation and concentrate on overall child abuse and highlight most child abusers are white, in a land with over 80% of men being white this is not surprising. What they tend to ignore is the factors as regards the Asian grooming gangs that makes then a specific problem. Most child abuse is family and/or same ethnic group related. In the case of the Pakistan gangs it is quite specific that the victims are obtained from outside their own ethno-religious group and that the age of the girls is close to the age of consent. In areas where varied ethnic groups exist side by side the gangs are usually Asian. The preponderance of the Asian gangs recently convicted is enormous when related to the proportion in the wider community. These are facts that everyone tries their best to downplay but exist as an uncomfortable fact within the Multicultural dream. "The report said there was not enough evidence to conclude that child sexual abuse gangs were disproportionately made up of Asian offenders." Of course it did, the evidence of 'the look test' in most of the recent cases indicates something completely different and if you can find a preponderance of white grooming gangs behaving as these gangs are doing then we can consider the 'not enough evidence' scenario but most people know the 'lack of evidence' is just a load of bollox to try and protect the multicultural project. There was a time I would take reports seriously but since McPherson published they have all become a bit of a produce what the government wants. I can recall several reports that stated 'not finding enough evidence' when their own stats were awash with it. |
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