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Post by zanygame on Dec 23, 2023 7:46:05 GMT
No more fishy than voting for a Conservative Party who continually promise to cut immigration while constantly increasing it. They are not - hence the Tory Party sitting at 25% in the polls. And Labour making similar promises is at 40%. Perhaps its not all about immigration, just as it wasn't all about Brexit in 2019. |
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Post by Pacifico on Dec 23, 2023 8:05:41 GMT
They are not - hence the Tory Party sitting at 25% in the polls. And Labour making similar promises is at 40%. Perhaps its not all about immigration, just as it wasn't all about Brexit in 2019. Which is the point I made - immigration is an issue that right-wing voters care about and left-wing voters dont.  |
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Post by zanygame on Dec 23, 2023 8:30:06 GMT
And Labour making similar promises is at 40%. Perhaps its not all about immigration, just as it wasn't all about Brexit in 2019. Which is the point I made - immigration is an issue that right-wing voters care about and left-wing voters dont. So following the logic path less people are concerned about immigration than are. And the idea that right wing parties are growing across Europe because of overwhelming pressure to reduce immigration is wrong. |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Dec 23, 2023 8:42:28 GMT
So following the logic path less people are concerned about immigration than are. Yes. And the idea that right wing parties are growing across Europe because of overwhelming pressure to reduce immigration is wrong. That is not supported by the data provided. |
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Post by zanygame on Dec 23, 2023 9:51:10 GMT
So following the logic path less people are concerned about immigration than are. Yes. And the idea that right wing parties are growing across Europe because of overwhelming pressure to reduce immigration is wrong. That is not supported by the data provided. I actually agree Squeezy. I was trying to point out the inconsistences in Pacifico's claim. IMO. There is a great desire among voters of either side to see immigration slowed, both right and left wing parties are claiming they want it slowed. But as with Brexit a few parties are stating they will carry out the wishes of the people without any explanation of the consequences, relying on that blind desire to get them elected. I would like to dramatically slow immigration into the UK, but if this forum is anything to go by no one wants to know why we have it in the first place and any attempt to discuss the why's are dismissed as a desire to keep em coming in. I suspect there are a large percentage of voters across the UK and EU who don't want the detail, they just want it done (As happened with Brexit where polls show 57% of the population would re-join if asked and nearly 40% of those who voted for it regret their decision). |
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Post by Pacifico on Dec 23, 2023 11:37:27 GMT
So following the logic path less people are concerned about immigration than are. For those on the right, it is the second most important issue. For those on the left it barely resonates - they would rather be refighting the same old tired arguments around Brexit. Feel free to believe that but the facts on the ground prove you wrong. |
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Post by bancroft on Dec 23, 2023 12:39:10 GMT
Mostly Labour run councils going bankrupt is likely to harm Labour going into any election.
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Post by zanygame on Dec 23, 2023 16:24:20 GMT
Mostly Labour run councils going bankrupt is likely to harm Labour going into any election. Of course most poor people vote for councils that care about them, which is why Labour councils tend to exist in poor areas where money is tight. Add to that 13 years of Tories reducing the help from central government, obviously to create a level playing field  , and you get more labour councils on the brink. Just saying. |
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Post by bancroft on Dec 24, 2023 13:48:39 GMT
Mostly Labour run councils going bankrupt is likely to harm Labour going into any election. Of course most poor people vote for councils that care about them, which is why Labour councils tend to exist in poor areas where money is tight. Add to that 13 years of Tories reducing the help from central government, obviously to create a level playing field , and you get more labour councils on the brink. Just saying. Well that would be how they market themselves as the caring councils, it would be good to have some sort of comparison on differences between services offered under each. |
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Post by bancroft on Dec 24, 2023 13:59:03 GMT
I used to get the train through Brixton where a statue was built on the train platform of a Black woman in I think Bronze, then we have in Wales reducing the speed limit to just 20mph on most roads.
This adds to the political distrust that Labour are putting council money into pet projects that increase their branding rather than providing decent services.
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Post by zanygame on Dec 24, 2023 14:06:20 GMT
Of course most poor people vote for councils that care about them, which is why Labour councils tend to exist in poor areas where money is tight. Add to that 13 years of Tories reducing the help from central government, obviously to create a level playing field , and you get more labour councils on the brink. Just saying. Well that would be how they market themselves as the caring councils, it would be good to have some sort of comparison on differences between services offered under each. Its less about services offered and more about services required compared to income. Both might offer the housing but one might have twice as many needing it than the other. Equally they both collect council tax, but one might have more exemptions than the other. It seems to be the case that people needing help tend to view Labour as more likely to give that help, if this forum is a microcosm of the real world I would say its probably true. |
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Post by zanygame on Dec 24, 2023 14:09:17 GMT
I used to get the train through Brixton where a statue was built on the train platform of a Black woman in I think Bronze, then we have in Wales reducing the speed limit to just 20mph on most roads. This adds to the political distrust that Labour are putting council money into pet projects that increase their branding rather than providing decent services. Were the statue of Churchill would you still see it as wasteful? I've often wondered how much cheaper everything might be if it was all utilitarian. Wales speed limit is the vision of a mad man. But I don't think you can pin that on Labour. |
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Post by bancroft on Dec 24, 2023 14:26:57 GMT
I used to get the train through Brixton where a statue was built on the train platform of a Black woman in I think Bronze, then we have in Wales reducing the speed limit to just 20mph on most roads. This adds to the political distrust that Labour are putting council money into pet projects that increase their branding rather than providing decent services. Were the statue of Churchill would you still see it as wasteful? I've often wondered how much cheaper everything might be if it was all utilitarian. Wales speed limit is the vision of a mad man. But I don't think you can pin that on Labour. The statues in Central London were built under the government of the British Empire I think that is different. Your real gripe seem to be around councils not providing sufficient housing. In a time when we have tens of thousands of foreigners needing it as well as children of recently allowed immigration, Labour court this vote and anyone that questions the system is daubed by being racist or xenophobic and people wonder why Labour cannot win to date. In our neck about a year ago people on housing benefit came on to FB asking for help, their post was being rifled and communal front door broken by foreign looking guys that slept on the floors of the hall. They had a relationship with one of the official tenants. They were scared. More than likely a drugs operation. |
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Post by zanygame on Dec 25, 2023 8:31:30 GMT
Were the statue of Churchill would you still see it as wasteful? I've often wondered how much cheaper everything might be if it was all utilitarian. Wales speed limit is the vision of a mad man. But I don't think you can pin that on Labour. The statues in Central London were built under the government of the British Empire I think that is different. Your real gripe seem to be around councils not providing sufficient housing. In a time when we have tens of thousands of foreigners needing it as well as children of recently allowed immigration, Labour court this vote and anyone that questions the system is daubed by being racist or xenophobic and people wonder why Labour cannot win to date. In our neck about a year ago people on housing benefit came on to FB asking for help, their post was being rifled and communal front door broken by foreign looking guys that slept on the floors of the hall. They had a relationship with one of the official tenants. They were scared. More than likely a drugs operation. Certainly immigration is the subject of the year. Personally I don't know anyone who thinks the current level is OK and we're mostly Labour or Lib dem voters. Saying you want immigration cut will not get you accused of racism, saying you don't want certain types here might. Both main parties are claiming they are going to build more homes, both are claiming they will cut immigration. All we have seen is the conservatives version of this which seems to be blaming immigrants for needing houses while bringing in another half a million each year. I wonder if any government should embrace xenophobic views as these seem quite prevalent among the elderly generation in the UK. How many would welcome immigration restrictions based on colour or religion. Finally I find this sentence strange. This is what we face after 13 years of Tory rule. Its not something Labour had anything to do with, yet you seem to want to pin the blame for it on Labour. |
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Post by johnofgwent on Dec 26, 2023 12:53:25 GMT
I used to get the train through Brixton where a statue was built on the train platform of a Black woman in I think Bronze, then we have in Wales reducing the speed limit to just 20mph on most roads. This adds to the political distrust that Labour are putting council money into pet projects that increase their branding rather than providing decent services. the welsh wanker has made it his life’s mission to squander billions on vanity projects. He bought the airport to enable his Plaid pals to commute and no sooner had he done so, all the economy carriers that used to fly out of it shut down. As an example i just tried to find a flight from cardiff to belfast. Can’t be that hard i thought, after all i used BMI Baby to fly there from Cardiff to sort out the geographic mapping app used by Northern Ireland Electricity a few years back …. Cost me less than £100 return back then with one hold bag. How fucking wrong can you be … Bristol to Belfast - direct flight sadly with fucking Ryanair £54 Cardiff to Belfast - two legs via some European Hub and a six hour layover Lufthansa and some outfit i’ve never heard of £574 |
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, and you get more labour councils on the brink.
