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Post by happyhornet on Nov 27, 2023 22:38:02 GMT
I've never singled you or anyone else out for special attention for being white, disabled people are equal before the law and nobody on this thread has asked them to justify their right to be here. "If parents and forebears are morally excluded from any form of culpability passing on to the following generations then each person is judged and treated as he is." You realise that's all I'm asking for? You realise that what you are asking for is all that everyone is asking for and being roundly ignored by many on the left and even worse by the law in some instances. The point about exclusion of the forebears is that that is not how it is currently working and you asking for it on moral grounds is no more than others have been asking on moral grounds and been roundly ignored. Our government apologises in our name, our Monarch apologises in our name and demands are made regularly for reparations to be paid by the British state, to whom is not clear. I am pointing out that unfairness exists in bucketfuls. I don't see how any of that relates to my point. You seem to have gone off on a tangent. |
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Post by Bentley on Nov 27, 2023 22:41:44 GMT
You realise that what you are asking for is all that everyone is asking for and being roundly ignored by many on the left and even worse by the law in some instances. The point about exclusion of the forebears is that that is not how it is currently working and you asking for it on moral grounds is no more than others have been asking on moral grounds and been roundly ignored. Our government apologises in our name, our Monarch apologises in our name and demands are made regularly for reparations to be paid by the British state, to whom is not clear. I am pointing out that unfairness exists in bucketfuls. I don't see how any of that relates to my point. You seem to have gone off on a tangent. And that’s the problem . You don’t want to see. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2023 6:56:42 GMT
We are trying to prevent it. While still trying to remain human. I have a bright idea. If we turn all the farmland into flats, we won't be able to feed ourselves either. I find it a bit odd that uniquely among all peoples, our claim to 'humanity' depends upon us giving our territory away to others. Well, dehumanising actual humans who only want to protect their interests helps the fanatics to commit to genocide. |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 28, 2023 7:17:22 GMT
I don't see how any of that relates to my point. You seem to have gone off on a tangent. And that’s the problem . You don’t want to see. It's not that I don't want to, it's just that it doesn't make any logical sense. SP seems to be saying that things have upset him and the government are ignoring him. So why not take it out on them rather than me? |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 28, 2023 7:17:58 GMT
I have a bright idea. If we turn all the farmland into flats, we won't be able to feed ourselves either. I find it a bit odd that uniquely among all peoples, our claim to 'humanity' depends upon us giving our territory away to others. Well, dehumanising actual humans who only want to protect their interests helps the fanatics to commit to genocide. What genocide? |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 28, 2023 7:22:18 GMT
No one said we could help everyone. But the opposite to everyone is not no one The problem with your view is it relies on me being high handed I.E making it my decision alone. But that is not the truth. I do not stand alone in my desire to help people. The reason we have the human rights act is not a bunch of lefty lawyers it is what the people wanted. Then answer my question - by what principle do we limit and to who? It's easy for you to rule out taking everyone and remain vague. However, i have seen nothing in your position that could (even theoretically) act as such a limit. The same argument that says that we should suffer what we are already enduring will still apply no matter what destruction is wrought - until the chaos climbs up into your garden and axes down your front door, you will remain unmoved. Under what circumstances precisely would you say 'that's enough' - when the uk is a smoking, third world wreck dominated by warlords? it looks to me very much like you simply do not accept that the people of the UK have any rights - that, if they have to give up anything to make you feel better, that they should be (if reluctant) forced to do so. This is not charity, it is a glass case example of an abusive position. If people like yourself could come up with some limit and conditions around your luxury opinions that you could be held to, perhaps that would take some heat from the discussion. However, we can all see that the very same absolutist, moral imperative type arguments you use to discount any objection, would also forbid such a limit. Of course you aren't the only person. There are a significant minority of seriously confused people. I blame the parents If you are willing to admit some are deserving, then we could try to discuss who and how we deal with it. But until then I will not try again. I have on here stated that 90% plus of those arriving at our shores should be considered to be undeserving economic migrants. You have not stated even one is deserving of help. I am not going to waste my time discussing possible cases when know you only hear Mr Strawman. |
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Post by jonksy on Nov 28, 2023 7:59:31 GMT
Well, dehumanising actual humans who only want to protect their interests helps the fanatics to commit to genocide. What genocide? The one going on all around you hh |
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Post by Orac on Nov 28, 2023 8:34:09 GMT
I have a bright idea. If we turn all the farmland into flats, we won't be able to feed ourselves either. I find it a bit odd that uniquely among all peoples, our claim to 'humanity' depends upon us giving our territory away to others. Well, dehumanising actual humans who only want to protect their interests helps the fanatics to commit to genocide. I would say that social engineering the idea that a particular group's descendants don't (can't) have exclusive access to their predecessor's territory, is a form of genocide. It's not going to be immediate, but it is going to genocide all the same. It will take a handful of generations. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2023 8:45:00 GMT
Well, dehumanising actual humans who only want to protect their interests helps the fanatics to commit to genocide. I would say that social engineering the idea that a particular group's descendants don't (can't) have exclusive access to their predecessor's territory, is a form of genocide. It's not going to be immediate, but it is going to genocide all the same. It will take a handful of generations. It's just another set of methods which lead to the same desired goal. The fact that there are people trying to condition others into dehumanising the people who resist genocide should be exposed, even if the genocidal are protected by the corruption.
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Post by Orac on Nov 28, 2023 8:49:36 GMT
Then answer my question - by what principle do we limit and to who? It's easy for you to rule out taking everyone and remain vague. However, i have seen nothing in your position that could (even theoretically) act as such a limit. The same argument that says that we should suffer what we are already enduring will still apply no matter what destruction is wrought - until the chaos climbs up into your garden and axes down your front door, you will remain unmoved. Under what circumstances precisely would you say 'that's enough' - when the uk is a smoking, third world wreck dominated by warlords? it looks to me very much like you simply do not accept that the people of the UK have any rights - that, if they have to give up anything to make you feel better, that they should be (if reluctant) forced to do so. This is not charity, it is a glass case example of an abusive position. If people like yourself could come up with some limit and conditions around your luxury opinions that you could be held to, perhaps that would take some heat from the discussion. However, we can all see that the very same absolutist, moral imperative type arguments you use to discount any objection, would also forbid such a limit. Of course you aren't the only person. There are a significant minority of seriously confused people. I blame the parents If you are willing to admit some are deserving, then we could try to discuss who and how we deal with it. But until then I will not try again. I have on here stated that 90% plus of those arriving at our shores should be considered to be undeserving economic migrants. You have not stated even one is deserving of help. I am not going to waste my time discussing possible cases when know you only hear Mr Strawman. You claim i'm using a Strawman, but also confirm my position by finding an excuse to refuse to set a limit. In any case, it's not the specific limit i'm interested, nor what I asked for, it's the moral principle you would use to set the limit.My claim to have a reason not to talk is far stronger than yours. What is the point in entering into a negotiation with someone who doesn't accept you have any rights? |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 28, 2023 8:54:11 GMT
The one going on all around you hh And what one would that be? |
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Post by jonksy on Nov 28, 2023 8:57:22 GMT
The one going on all around you hh And what one would that be? Maybe you should go around with your eyes firmly open and not firmly shut hh. |
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Post by Orac on Nov 28, 2023 9:06:19 GMT
The one going on all around you hh And what one would that be? I would say that social engineering the idea that one particular group's descendants don't (can't) have exclusive access to their predecessor's territory, is a form of genocide. Over generations this expectation of lopsided and ongoing sharing will result in this group's territory and numbers getting smaller and smaller until they disappear. |
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Post by Dan Dare on Nov 28, 2023 9:33:35 GMT
The process has only been underway for a little more than two generations and yet native Britons are already a minority in several major towns and cities, including the nation's capital. 2055 looms. Demographics is Destiny ... Redux |
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Post by Bentley on Nov 28, 2023 9:55:54 GMT
And that’s the problem . You don’t want to see. It's not that I don't want to, it's just that it doesn't make any logical sense. SP seems to be saying that things have upset him and the government are ignoring him. So why not take it out on them rather than me? Playing dumb again .. |
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