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Post by steppenwolf on Nov 18, 2022 14:36:51 GMT
Of course they have a political role, they write policy. They are the executive. . They WRITE UP what the heads of state, the Council, asks them to do. Just as the UK civil service does. One more exam0le of your mistakes. Bye. No they don't actually. The Commission determines the direction of the EU. They are effectively the executive. If the Council did it they would never be able to agree on anything.
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Post by Vinny on Nov 18, 2022 15:07:40 GMT
The civil service is not an executive. It follows orders. The Commission is an executive, like the cabinet in our country.
They are policy makers who can independently propose policies.
It would be better if the EU had a cabinet made from MEPs to do that job.
At least MEPs can be sacked by voters.
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Post by oracle75 on Nov 18, 2022 16:29:30 GMT
. They WRITE UP what the heads of state, the Council, asks them to do. Just as the UK civil service does. One more exam0le of your mistakes. Bye. No they don't actually. The Commission determines the direction of the EU. They are effectively the executive. If the Council did it they would never be able to agree on anything. There is a long series of meetings at the start of every Parliamentary election cycle in which the Council and the Commission and Parliament decide what they will legislate on. It is called the Strategic Agwnda. Look it up. It would be a complete waste of time if OTHER THAN EMERGENCY MEASURES, the Commission sprang new legislation onto the Council because chances are the Council would reject it, having not considered it beforehand. The commission works through the list of issues and priorities laid out in the strategic agenda during the 5 year period. The Council , other than emergencies, sets the rough order of issues to be dealt with. The commission then drafts legislation for further consideration and it begins its journey throughParliament,each national government and finally a vote in all three elected bodies. The commission does not vote. On any legislation. That is fact. However I don't really care if you ( or Vinny or anyone) believes it. The UK doesn't belong to the EU anymore so what you and he believe is pointless and it is a waste of time discussing it.
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Post by Steve on Nov 18, 2022 18:49:26 GMT
They haven't had a referendum on the matter, without a vote it's impossible to tell. This poll was a rather big clue Reuters: 'Overwhelming majority of Greeks want to keep euro, poll shows''A total of 84 percent of Greeks want to keep the euro, with just 12 percent favoring a return to the drachma, an opinion poll showed on Friday, as the country races to clinch a cash-for-reforms deal with its creditors'Seems Greeks ain't as stupid as 51.8% of Brits
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Post by Vinny on Nov 18, 2022 19:57:32 GMT
Poll from 2015.
And methodology not discussed.
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Post by Steve on Nov 18, 2022 20:02:21 GMT
Poll from 2015. And methodology not discussed. Feel free to show a more recent poll showing different And you rubbish Reuters if you like but it will harm your stance in other threads
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Post by Vinny on Nov 18, 2022 20:19:26 GMT
I'm just saying, we don't really know either way unless they hold a referendum. Polls can be wrong. And they don't take into account shy voters.
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Post by Steve on Nov 18, 2022 22:05:39 GMT
I'm just saying, we don't really know either way unless they hold a referendum. Polls can be wrong. And they don't take into account shy voters. feel free to show any vote that's gone against a poll showing 86:12 one way
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Post by Vinny on Nov 18, 2022 22:48:47 GMT
2015 was 7 years ago. Has there been a more recent poll showing the same result?
Times change, views change, continually. Politics is always in flux.
And yes, before you say it, it will one day be necessary for the next generation to vote on whether or not to be independent from the EU or a member of it.
Even if before that happens a poll comes out with 86% opposed to rejoining.
I am a democrat.
I believe in voting.
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Post by Steve on Nov 19, 2022 0:24:44 GMT
So not just a river in Egypt then
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Post by steppenwolf on Nov 19, 2022 8:08:22 GMT
Oracl75 said: "There is a long series of meetings at the start of every Parliamentary election cycle in which the Council and the Commission and Parliament decide what they will legislate on. It is called the Strategic Agwnda. Look it up."
Obviously the Commission talk to the Council members about the general direction of the EU, but the point is that the Commission proposes the laws - not the Council. This is normally the function of the Executive. You wouldn't get a UK govt asking the Civil Service to propose a few laws for example. And the EU Commission has control of the EU's spending, which again is the function of the Executive. The Commission can use members' budgetary contributions to buy off Council members who don't like what they they're doing. It was also the Commission that conducted all the negotiations on Brexit - the Council was very much in the background and was basically never heard from publicly.
To be fair that's exactly what Theresa May did when she handed over our negotiations to the EU fanatic and civil servant Olly Robbins who negotiated a form of BRINO that left the UK, as Guy Verhofstadt triumphantly said "relegated the UK to the status of a colony - exactly where we want them".
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Post by steppenwolf on Nov 19, 2022 8:49:02 GMT
Steve said: "But their GDP never halved and they are doing a lot better now"
Bollocks. Their GDP was 354 billion USD in 2008 and 188 billion USD in 2020. That's basically halving. And their GDP is now about 230 billion USD. If that's "doing a lot better now" then I wonder what doing badly would mean. And it's carrying vast amounts of debt now at high interest rates.
It's funny you guys are quick to whinge when we lose about 0.2% of GDP but think that losing half of your GDP is OK when it's an EU member country. You NEVER blame the EU for anything, but the EU knew perfectly well that Greece couldn't survive in the EU but still accepted them as a member for ideological reasons. Idiots.
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Post by Steve on Nov 19, 2022 11:30:00 GMT
So you know it wasn't halved but seem to not realise that a 10% GDP increase compared to 2019 is 'doing a lot better'
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