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Post by sheepy on Nov 17, 2023 9:36:18 GMT
Oh right so basically we just throw them out, I see a bit of a problem with that as well, don't you? Jeez, you are so fuckin clueless it's almost laughable. Listen, I'm from the school of thought that says, when in Rome. When I was in other countries I respected other cultures other religions other peoples way of life. When other people come to the UK I expect them to show me the same respect. Of course I'm laughing as I write this because thanks to clueless lefties like you minorities can do more or less what they please and if I complain, I'm shouted down as a nasty racist, a far right extremist but not to worry, it's all adding to the pressure. Far from clueless Red, I wouldn't put that label on you just yet, your school of thought is your own, I am not shouting you down as a racist, just pointing out your ideas are full of holes when it comes right down to it. |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 17, 2023 9:37:04 GMT
I think that part of the solution is to work with the Muslim community rather than against them and making Muslims feel part of the wider British community giving them a sense of belonging and making them stakeholders. We can a play a part in that. The other and main part is giving the security and intelligence agencies everything they need to do their thing. Hi HH. I don't think this country has much option other than to follow your suggested path to the future. BUT, as you are no doubt aware, I have serious concerns about Islam the Religion. It is a highly over self indoctrinating religion, thus giving, as far as religion is concerned, the emotional area of the brain greater control of the 'logical area' of the brain. Which is all very well until ideas get distorted along the way. That the religion has the longest dispute ever between the two main sects doesn't help. I'm pretty sure that the recent mass demonstrations over what is going in Garza has as much do with a cult like hatred of the Jews/Israelis by the Arabs, as it has to do with the deaths and destruction taking place in Gaza. It is the almost complete absence of serious concern by the Palestinian Arabs and the Arab world over 7/10 that feeds into my concerns. My personal suspicion is that as the percentage of Muslims in the population increases the call for Sharia Law will grow. Again, there appears to be more than one version of Sharia Law, with some version seeking increased Islamic law and control of people, not just help with personal problems. Islam is on the increase claimed by some to be because Muslims tend to have large families. I personally would not like to even sense the possibility that the UK could one day become just another Muslim country. These are my own personal concerns which may or may not be of any value. Personally I am at odds with significant chunks of Islamic beliefs, same with all the other major religions, I don't see that as a justification for criminalising them, apart from anything else that would be plainly narcissistic. I'm also at odds with a lot of the political ideology of the people who are currently in power and that's a much more immediate concern than distant future demographic hypotheticals. |
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Post by om15 on Nov 17, 2023 9:37:33 GMT
But they haven't, one thing strikes me about those lefties on here and those we see on telly is that it comes across that they haven't been anywhere or done anything.
Our opinions are shaped by our experiences, it is telling that now young children are being taken out of school to chant anti semitic rubbish, but eventually when they work, travel and live in other countries they may change their views.
Dhahran was pretty cosmopolitan compared to some bits of the Kingdom, down the south west you are entering the 16th century, but the people were much more friendly than around the Gulf. My mate injured his hand, I visited him in hospital, outside the goats were eating all the used dressings and bandages, not even the NHS does that.
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 17, 2023 9:38:28 GMT
Oh right so basically we just throw them out, I see a bit of a problem with that as well, don't you? Jeez, you are so fuckin clueless it's almost laughable. Listen, I'm from the school of thought that says, when in Rome. When I was in other countries I respected other cultures other religions other peoples way of life. When other people come to the UK I expect them to show me the same respect. Of course I'm laughing as I write this because thanks to clueless lefties like you minorities can do more or less what they please and if I complain, I'm shouted down as a nasty racist, a far right extremist but not to worry, it's all adding to the pressure. Our way of life includes religious tolerance. Seems you need to take your own advice, when in Rome. |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 17, 2023 9:39:44 GMT
Again, persecuting a religious minority would make us more like an islamic theocracy. Get a grip you muppet. The fact that all you can come back with is playground insults says a lot. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Nov 17, 2023 9:40:21 GMT
Jeez, you are so fuckin clueless it's almost laughable. Listen, I'm from the school of thought that says, when in Rome. When I was in other countries I respected other cultures other religions other peoples way of life. When other people come to the UK I expect them to show me the same respect. Of course I'm laughing as I write this because thanks to clueless lefties like you minorities can do more or less what they please and if I complain, I'm shouted down as a nasty racist, a far right extremist but not to worry, it's all adding to the pressure. Far from clueless Red, I wouldn't put that label on you just yet, your school of thought is your own, I am not shouting you down as a racist, just pointing out your ideas are full of holes when it comes right down to it. OK fair enough. I have a greater problem then you could possibly imagine, oh dear. Toodle pip. |
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Post by andrewbrown on Nov 17, 2023 9:40:59 GMT
Oh right so basically we just throw them out, I see a bit of a problem with that as well, don't you? Jeez, you are so fuckin clueless it's almost laughable. Listen, I'm from the school of thought that says, when in Rome. When I was in other countries I respected other cultures other religions other peoples way of life. When other people come to the UK I expect them to show me the same respect. Of course I'm laughing as I write this because thanks to clueless lefties like you minorities can do more or less what they please and if I complain, I'm shouted down as a nasty racist, a far right extremist but not to worry, it's all adding to the pressure. That's because you see things as very back and white. Sometimes that's helpful, but oftentimes not. For example one of the British values that you claim to defend is tolerance, but yet you have zero tolerance to anyone who doesn't agree with your way on things. |
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Post by sandypine on Nov 17, 2023 10:06:09 GMT
Interesting question. You can however consider the figures in another way if 90% of terror suspects are coming from a community that comprises about 6% ( approx 4 million people) of the population and 10% is coming from the other 95% (approx 62 million people) do you think there is a problem within a specific community? Do you think treating an entire community with fear and suspicion makes them more or less likely to sympathise with the extremists in their community? That is not the observation, there is a problem within a specific community which is a reality to be faced no matter how unpleasant for those within that community. You seem to say ignoring the root cause is not to be considered yet if you do not then it will only become worse for the rest of us. |
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Post by sandypine on Nov 17, 2023 10:16:34 GMT
He asked you a question first. Perhaps you could do him the courtesy of answering it. I think there is a problem with certain communities with regards to terrorism, the Muslim community being one of them. I think demonising those communities makes the problem worse not better. If we treated all right wingers like far right terrorists would that make you more or less sympathetic to far right terrorists? Look at that answer logically. The terrorists arising in greater numbers from the Muslim community are a distinct problem. That does not 'demonise' all within a community it recognise a problem that those within the community should help us address. Now your inferring RW has a problem with terrorism to similar sort of levels. What is RW I suppose you may say Tory in which case it is about 10 million people and still accounts for only 10% of the terrorist suspect problem. So it it is still not a significant danger when compared to that which arises from the Muslim community. There is the fact also that Right Winger is a term not descriptive of any group as its attribution to anyone is subjective. Muslim is a discrete and self identifying group of people. |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 17, 2023 10:19:55 GMT
Do you think treating an entire community with fear and suspicion makes them more or less likely to sympathise with the extremists in their community? That is not the observation, there is a problem within a specific community which is a reality to be faced no matter how unpleasant for those within that community. You seem to say ignoring the root cause is not to be considered yet if you do not then it will only become worse for the rest of us. I've acknowledged the problem within the specific Muslim community (Just not exclusive to that community). I've never said we should ignore it. |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 17, 2023 10:22:22 GMT
I think there is a problem with certain communities with regards to terrorism, the Muslim community being one of them. I think demonising those communities makes the problem worse not better. If we treated all right wingers like far right terrorists would that make you more or less sympathetic to far right terrorists? Look at that answer logically. The terrorists arising in greater numbers from the Muslim community are a distinct problem. That does not 'demonise' all within a community it recognise a problem that those within the community should help us address. Now your inferring RW has a problem with terrorism to similar sort of levels. What is RW I suppose you may say Tory in which case it is about 10 million people and still accounts for only 10% of the terrorist suspect problem. So it it is still not a significant danger when compared to that which arises from the Muslim community. There is the fact also that Right Winger is a term not descriptive of any group as its attribution to anyone is subjective. Muslim is a discrete and self identifying group of people. I never said RW terrorism was at similar levels, it isn't, although I understand it is the fastest growing terrorist threat in the UK. My point is in either case demonising the entire community will only make the problem worse. |
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Post by sandypine on Nov 17, 2023 10:26:40 GMT
That is not the observation, there is a problem within a specific community which is a reality to be faced no matter how unpleasant for those within that community. You seem to say ignoring the root cause is not to be considered yet if you do not then it will only become worse for the rest of us. I've acknowledged the problem within the specific Muslim community (Just not exclusive to that community). I've never said we should ignore it. Then what is the best route and several things stand out as desperately urgent. 1) Stop all Muslim immigration as the evidence is it will only increase the problem. 2) Remove all illegal migrants as most are from Islamic countries and are an obvious higher risk. 3) Apply the hate laws to religions and any preaching and quoting of hate texts in a public place prosecuted in the same way ordinary people would be prosecuted. If not what is your solution? |
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Post by sandypine on Nov 17, 2023 10:28:59 GMT
Look at that answer logically. The terrorists arising in greater numbers from the Muslim community are a distinct problem. That does not 'demonise' all within a community it recognise a problem that those within the community should help us address. Now your inferring RW has a problem with terrorism to similar sort of levels. What is RW I suppose you may say Tory in which case it is about 10 million people and still accounts for only 10% of the terrorist suspect problem. So it it is still not a significant danger when compared to that which arises from the Muslim community. There is the fact also that Right Winger is a term not descriptive of any group as its attribution to anyone is subjective. Muslim is a discrete and self identifying group of people. I never said RW terrorism was at similar levels, it isn't, although I understand it is the fastest growing terrorist threat in the UK. My point is in either case demonising the entire community will only make the problem worse. You are not demonising all, you are recognising a problem. Just as the left are very keen to attribute whiteness as a problem you have also take into account that in which there is much more evidence. |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 17, 2023 10:38:23 GMT
I've acknowledged the problem within the specific Muslim community (Just not exclusive to that community). I've never said we should ignore it. Then what is the best route and several things stand out as desperately urgent. 1) Stop all Muslim immigration as the evidence is it will only increase the problem. 2) Remove all illegal migrants as most are from Islamic countries and are an obvious higher risk. 3) Apply the hate laws to religions and any preaching and quoting of hate texts in a public place prosecuted in the same way ordinary people would be prosecuted. If not what is your solution? I don't think that stopping all Muslim immigration is practical or morally justifiable and more importantly would be a propaganda gold mine for islamic extremists. Removing all illegal immigrants is like arresting, trying and imprisoning all criminals, we all want to see it but it's not that simple. As I understand it hate laws do apply religions. |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 17, 2023 10:39:25 GMT
I never said RW terrorism was at similar levels, it isn't, although I understand it is the fastest growing terrorist threat in the UK. My point is in either case demonising the entire community will only make the problem worse. You are not demonising all, you are recognising a problem. Just as the left are very keen to attribute whiteness as a problem you have also take into account that in which there is much more evidence. My contribution started with on this thread challenging RR conflating Muslims with Hamas supporters. |
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