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Post by zanygame on Nov 3, 2023 21:02:35 GMT
I doubt it. Most people want a nice retirement and don't base that on the basic state pension It depends on the terms . If you need to have a million pound pension pot then it might not matter . If it’s 100K then it will . Trouble is that governments change goalposts . I disagree. People save for a pension because they want to be able to retire and enjoy life. Its not an investment option. Its the same silly argument that says people wont expand businesses if they have to pay higher tax when they make it big. |
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Post by borchester on Nov 3, 2023 21:07:42 GMT
Are you saying that businesses in the UK can only survive by importing cheap labour? I think it is more a matter of only employing Labour that works, something that zanygame and Co considers the ultimate four letter word |
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Post by Bentley on Nov 3, 2023 21:07:44 GMT
It depends on the terms . If you need to have a million pound pension pot then it might not matter . If it’s 100K then it will . Trouble is that governments change goalposts . I disagree. People save for a pension because they want to be able to retire and enjoy life. Its not an investment option. Its the same silly argument that says people wont expand businesses if they have to pay higher tax when they make it big. Yes they invest for the future and that means looking at what they will receive . You are in no position to disagree because you can’t tell me the terms that you disagree with . |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 3, 2023 21:15:37 GMT
Are you saying that businesses in the UK can only survive by importing cheap labour? I think it is more a matter of only employing Labour that works, something that zanygame and Co considers the ultimate four letter word Sorry I don't understand that insult? |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 3, 2023 21:19:10 GMT
I disagree. People save for a pension because they want to be able to retire and enjoy life. Its not an investment option. Its the same silly argument that says people wont expand businesses if they have to pay higher tax when they make it big. Yes they invest for the future and that means looking at what they will receive . You are in no position to disagree because you can’t tell me the terms that you disagree with . Perhaps you could fill me in a bit, if you'd like to discuss it. I feel from your reaction I haven't quite understood you. |
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Post by Bentley on Nov 3, 2023 21:38:40 GMT
Yes they invest for the future and that means looking at what they will receive . You are in no position to disagree because you can’t tell me the terms that you disagree with . Perhaps you could fill me in a bit, if you'd like to discuss it. I feel from your reaction I haven't quite understood you. I repeat ..It depends on the terms . If you need to have a million pound pension pot then it might not matter . If it’s 100K then it will . Trouble is that governments change goalposts . |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 3, 2023 21:52:43 GMT
Perhaps you could fill me in a bit, if you'd like to discuss it. I feel from your reaction I haven't quite understood you. I repeat ..It depends on the terms . If you need to have a million pound pension pot then it might not matter . If it’s 100K then it will . Trouble is that governments change goalposts . Sorry for being a bit thick here. How does unreliable government pensions effect how much you want to save for your private pensions? Or have I missed the point again. |
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Post by Bentley on Nov 3, 2023 21:55:43 GMT
I repeat ..It depends on the terms . If you need to have a million pound pension pot then it might not matter . If it’s 100K then it will . Trouble is that governments change goalposts . Sorry for being a bit thick here. How does unreliable government pensions effect how much you want to save for your private pensions? Or have I missed the point again. ? The point was about future means tested state pensions . |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 3, 2023 22:26:50 GMT
Sorry for being a bit thick here. How does unreliable government pensions effect how much you want to save for your private pensions? Or have I missed the point again. ? The point was about future means tested state pensions . Fine lets leave it. To cryptic for me, can't e bothered. |
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Post by Bentley on Nov 3, 2023 22:28:56 GMT
? The point was about future means tested state pensions . Fine lets leave it. To cryptic for me, can't e bothered. Means tested state pensions ..If you need to have a million pound pension pot then it might not matter . If it’s 100K then it will.. How is that cryptic ? |
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Post by Bentley on Nov 4, 2023 11:07:30 GMT
The UK state pension currently provides retirees with a maximum of £802.32 monthly. However, in comparison, the average pensioner in Spain receives a generous £2,287.24. Belgium, which has living costs very close to the UK at £720.45 monthly, grants a monthly state pension of £2,709.93 for those with a 45-year work history. This amount is a staggering 376 per cent above the breakeven mark, according to data from Almond Financial. euroweeklynews.com/2023/11/01/spanish-pensioners-get-double-uk-amount/ |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 4, 2023 12:12:16 GMT
The UK state pension currently provides retirees with a maximum of £802.32 monthly. However, in comparison, the average pensioner in Spain receives a generous £2,287.24. Belgium, which has living costs very close to the UK at £720.45 monthly, grants a monthly state pension of £2,709.93 for those with a 45-year work history. This amount is a staggering 376 per cent above the breakeven mark, according to data from Almond Financial. euroweeklynews.com/2023/11/01/spanish-pensioners-get-double-uk-amount/Obviously our state pension is nothing more than a catchall. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2023 13:00:38 GMT
zanygame ... "I'm a leftie Sid, but I have to pick you up here. The Minimum wage is a low wage. So if a factory couldn't get minimum wage EU workers they would need to pay more than minimum wage. Thus EU workers theoretically hold wages at the minimum"
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Before the National Minimum Wage was THANKFULLY introduced by a Labour government ( opposed by the opposition Conservatives ), the wage regulation framework was a complete mess, some industries were regulated by "Wages Councils", providing you were of a certain age.
Other areas of employment had no cover or regulation at all, and employers could literally pay as little as they saw fit, and to a degree it was a Free For All.
The National Minimum Wage lifted the wages of hundreds of thousands of low paid employees, and the Minimum Wage rises every year. It was without doubt one of the best things that the last Labour government did.
The NMW was first introduced in 1998 - the year in which large numbers of European workers first came to the UK was 2004.
In 2003 most shop workers were on the NMW, almost all workers in the hospitality industry were on the NMW, most people in the leisure and tourist industry were on the NMW, as were a large percentage of unskilled factory and production workers and those in the care sector.
No matter which way anyone looks at it, these sectors will only pay what they must, but they wont pay what they do not have to. Then there s the economic reality, all over the world, labour shortages are fixed by bringing in people - Latino's in the USA, it was the Turks and Portugese who rebuilt West Germany after the war, it was Caribbean workers who kept the London tube running in the aftermath of the war. The same people filled vaccancies on buses, in hospitals, in factories and in sorting offices.
I have a part time job in a catering establishment, I suspect my employer begrudgingly put up wages, but had no option to raise the pay of those on NMW, the menu prices all went up at the same time. The number of complaints from customers was high, and this is another economic problem for any sector which competes for customers, particularly from continental producers / manufacturers / growers or exporters - its called "pricing yourself out of the market".
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Post by zanygame on Nov 4, 2023 14:34:36 GMT
zanygame ... "I'm a leftie Sid, but I have to pick you up here. The Minimum wage is a low wage. So if a factory couldn't get minimum wage EU workers they would need to pay more than minimum wage. Thus EU workers theoretically hold wages at the minimum" ------------------------------------------------------------------ Yes agreed. Yes time moves on, by 2004 the world was a different place, the increasing use of automation meant that very many semi skilled jobs had gone. People were willing to work to survive and this lead to many service companies that simply could not survive on anything higher than the minimum wage. Move forward another 19 years and the situation is at breaking point. Increases in minimum pay now mean businesses shutting their doors. Yep. They are driven by what the public will pay for non essential services. They don't pay more because the public wont pay more, its a very cut throat industry. If you doubt that just look how many pubs and restaurants have closed since energy prices rose. They couldn't just put their prices up like those not in business seem to think. My business is in leisure, I employ nearly 140 people now. We find if we put our prices up the number of people attending falls accordingly. We have a sweet spot price, (more than that less customers less money) less than that (more customers but less money) We put wages up by an average of 12% this year to keep good staff, but to offset this cost we introduced another level of automation and reduced our workforce by nearly 8%. This I fear is the future. Its a tough world. |
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Post by ratcliff on Nov 5, 2023 17:44:01 GMT
The OAP pension is funded from the national pot and is somewhere around £200 a week ie £10000 a year , lefties like you apparently think this makes them well off , normal people know it is peanuts- private sector pensions are not funded from the national pot so bugger all to do with government spending Or maybe if you are goalpost moving in true leftie style ,we should include the cash bundles that many benefit spongers trouser from cash jobs whilst supposedly unemployed/job hunting /crotch goblin keeping on top of getting fortunes in out of work benefits? You talk about spongers trousering cash without for a moment acknowledging all the taxpayer dosh being shovelled your way. I guess everyone's a sponger unless its you doing it, when suddenly you aint getting the chance to trouser nearly enough. Pensioners have never been as well off as they are now. Taxpayer dosh shovelled at me? Pray tell where I can find it (there you go again with the Pensioners have never been as well off as they are now.on about £200 a week-? yeah sure they're booking Barbados for Christmas) |
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