|
|
Post by zanygame on Oct 19, 2023 18:21:00 GMT
Key Electric Car Fire Statistics Electric-powered vehicles have the least risk of catching fire according to data from NTSB.
Per 100,000 vehicles.
Hybrid-powered vehicles are at the highest risk of catching fire. (because of the two types of fuel.) Battery- electric vehicles are only 0.03% likely to ignite, compared to 1.5% for gas-powered vehicles and 3.4% for hybrid vehicles.
In all cases the risk is very small. Have you got a link for those figures? And do they take account of mileage? Most pure electric cars are driven low mileages. What about the Fremantle Highway fire that destroyed about 4000 cars and a ship? Did that count as 1 car fire? Or the Luton Airport fire that destroyed 1500 cars and a multi-storey car park? I'd need to look at the data in more detail. The problem with Li-ion fires is that they're disastrous - unlike a petrol or diesel car fire which tends to be localised and easily put out. Yes of course I have links. But surely before you made your claims you took the bother to look it up yourself? No? What about the Luton airport fire that destroyed 1,400 cars, caused by a diesel? Do you fall over your feet all the time? I have never pretend my Hybrid is electric. Its Hybrid. That said on most days I hardly use petrol and my MPG is about 168. So not a petrol either. Once again your views (unchecked I'm sure as usual) are a decade out of date. Modern plugin hybrids get plugged in every night. |
|
|
|
Post by zanygame on Oct 19, 2023 18:23:11 GMT
zanygame said: "BEVs are expected to achieve an overall 22.6% market share next year reaching 440,000 units." I think the govt REQUIRE BEVs to achieve a 22% of market share next year - which is not the same as "expect" them to. The word from the industry is that BEVs are proving very hard to sell because of huge running costs and minimal infrastructure. But if the manufacturers can't achieve 20% BEV sales (out of their range) they have to stop selling ICE cars. It could get interesting. Make up any shite you want. The facts are facts. When I tried to buy an all electric car there was a 14 month waiting list. |
|
|
|
Post by Red Rackham on Oct 19, 2023 23:30:25 GMT
zanygame said: "BEVs are expected to achieve an overall 22.6% market share next year reaching 440,000 units." I think the govt REQUIRE BEVs to achieve a 22% of market share next year - which is not the same as "expect" them to. The word from the industry is that BEVs are proving very hard to sell because of huge running costs and minimal infrastructure. But if the manufacturers can't achieve 20% BEV sales (out of their range) they have to stop selling ICE cars. It could get interesting. Make up any shite you want. The facts are facts. When I tried to buy an all electric car there was a 14 month waiting list. ZG joking apart, watch this. It's only 17 minutes, come on... |
|
|
|
Post by Red Rackham on Oct 20, 2023 0:27:25 GMT
OK I may drive a diesel car, but as long as it's looked after, which it is, it will easilly be good for 250,000 miles. Not by me, I'll be long dead. Mrs R has a an 08 diesel Fiesta that easily does 60mpg it's incredibly economic and she loves it. If we binned these reliable cars for an electric car we would be adding to our carbon footprint. It would be years before we broke even, if indeed we ever did break even.
|
|
|
|
Post by steppenwolf on Oct 20, 2023 7:19:26 GMT
zanygame said: "Yes of course I have links. But surely before you made your claims you took the bother to look it up yourself? No?
What about the Luton airport fire that destroyed 1,400 cars, caused by a diesel?
Do you fall over your feet all the time?"
I've looked up various figures from insurance companies but they're all pretty meaningless. The problem is that there are very few BEVs around and they're lumped in with hybrids which vastly outnumber them. They also don't take into account age or mileage and don't mention the severity of the fire.
Fires in petrol cars are usually small and localised - they don't usually involve the petrol/diesel tank. I've been driving for decades and I've never had a fire. The fire at Luton airport may have been caused by a diesel (the fire brigade are being curiously vague about it - "it was thought to be caused by a diesel") but the fact remains that the reason that all 1500 cars in the car park have been written off and the building itself has been made structurally unsafe must have been caused by a BEV. That's the only way that this could have happened.
It's the sheer severity of the fires that Li-ion batteries cause that is the problem. And the fact that places like these multi-storey car parks have chargers in them is very worrying. So people stick their cars in the car park and leave them. This is surely insane. And people are also told to charge their cars at home overnight - which is also insane.
Putting large Li-ion batteries in cars is insane IMO - it's just BOUND to be a disaster.
|
|
|
|
Post by zanygame on Oct 20, 2023 8:09:58 GMT
Make up any shite you want. The facts are facts. When I tried to buy an all electric car there was a 14 month waiting list. ZG joking apart, watch this. It's only 17 minutes, come on... When did you suddenly start caring about Africans Red? Does this cover any other slave labour conditions apart from Lithium? Were you supporting the NGO's in the DMC when they were trying to stop poor families selling their children into the slave trade to dig Copper etc? Did you think the slave mines only started with EV's? I mean, I like this new Red. And we could talk a lot about fair trade and suppressed peoples. What we could do to help Africa and maybe even stop the economic migrants. Let me know and I'll start a thread. (Only it can't be about just stopping them coming here and how its all the EU's fault.) |
|
|
|
Post by Orac on Oct 20, 2023 8:20:01 GMT
As person with an overflow of white privilege, I think it would culturally insensitive of me to criticise homespun African trade practices.
|
|
|
|
Post by Pacifico on Oct 20, 2023 9:57:25 GMT
Seems it's not only charging that makes an EV expensive..
The average car insurance premium has hit a new record of £924 a year, having shot up by £338 (58pc) in just 12 months, according to comparison website Confused.com.
Yet while average premiums for petrol and diesel vehicles are 29pc higher than September last year, owners of electric vehicles (EV) face shelling out a hefty 72pc more.
|
|
|
|
Post by patman post on Oct 20, 2023 11:54:54 GMT
Mrs P’s Outlander hybrid kept telling her to add petrol to the tank because what was in there was getting too old and needed refreshing. She wasn’t using enough fuel even though she drives around 25 miles a day. She eventually learned that keeping the tank only half full meant that adding a few litres a month or so was all that was required. The car charges from a 13A socket at home or work.
The fast charge facility has never been used…
|
|
|
|
Post by steppenwolf on Oct 20, 2023 13:04:27 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by patman post on Oct 20, 2023 13:58:50 GMT
Mrs P’s Outlander hybrid kept telling her to add petrol to the tank because what was in there was getting too old and needed refreshing. She wasn’t using enough fuel even though she drives around 25 miles a day. She eventually learned that keeping the tank only half full meant that adding a few litres a month or so was all that was required. The car charges from a 13A socket at home or work. The fast charge facility has never been used… So why didn't you buy a pure EV? If you're using so little petrol there's very little point in: 1) Having paid a big premium to buy a hybrid 2) Carrying around the extra weight of a gearbox and a petrol engine 3) paying extra maintenance costs because you have 2 methods of propulsion You have opted for the most inefficient form of transport that there is. When you actually use the petrol that you're carrying around in your tank it means your battery is flat - so the software diverts energy to charge the battery. This is staggeringly inefficient. Did you ever think about this? If you rarely use the petrol in your tank you should have either bought a pure EV or - if you need a car that can actually drive a reasonable distance - you should have got a straight petrol car. Don't get me wrong. I like hybrids as a technology but their only sensible use is in supercars. Nearly all the people who buy hybrids to go shopping or commute short distances are better off with the petrol version of whatever hybrid they bought because they're cheaper and more efficient. BTW If you actually do have problems with petrol "going off" you can use Aspen. I use that in my classic cars because it lasts for years and it's also pretty high quality stuff. It's Mrs's car, and four years ago she wasn't certain about full EV as she/we sometimes go on longer trips and there were plenty of negative stories about charging facilities. As it's turned out, she uses battery power more often than petrol, home charging hasn't noticeably raised our electricity bill, and longer motorway/autoroute journeys don't seem more costly than petrol ICE. Round here, hybrids currently enjoy the same reduced parking charges as full EVs.
I don't see that buying petrol additives would reduce costs over adding E10 fuel when needed, even increased moisture absorption isn't a problem...
|
|
|
|
Post by zanygame on Oct 20, 2023 16:24:27 GMT
Seems it's not only charging that makes an EV expensive.. The average car insurance premium has hit a new record of £924 a year, having shot up by £338 (58pc) in just 12 months, according to comparison website Confused.com.
Yet while average premiums for petrol and diesel vehicles are 29pc higher than September last year, owners of electric vehicles (EV) face shelling out a hefty 72pc more.I'd like to know where these numbers come from. My Hybrid insurance is pretty normal between 2-300 quid. These numbers feel wrong. My guess is they are quoting worst case scenario's Young drivers with little no claims in busy areas etc |
|
|
|
Post by Pacifico on Oct 20, 2023 16:35:39 GMT
Seems it's not only charging that makes an EV expensive.. The average car insurance premium has hit a new record of £924 a year, having shot up by £338 (58pc) in just 12 months, according to comparison website Confused.com.
Yet while average premiums for petrol and diesel vehicles are 29pc higher than September last year, owners of electric vehicles (EV) face shelling out a hefty 72pc more.I'd like to know where these numbers come from. My Hybrid insurance is pretty normal between 2-300 quid. These numbers feel wrong. My guess is they are quoting worst case scenario's Young drivers with little no claims in busy areas etcSurely that would also apply to ICE cars? |
|
|
|
Post by zanygame on Oct 20, 2023 16:37:29 GMT
So why didn't you buy a pure EV? If you're using so little petrol there's very little point in: 1) Having paid a big premium to buy a hybrid 2) Carrying around the extra weight of a gearbox and a petrol engine 3) paying extra maintenance costs because you have 2 methods of propulsion You have opted for the most inefficient form of transport that there is. When you actually use the petrol that you're carrying around in your tank it means your battery is flat - so the software diverts energy to charge the battery. This is staggeringly inefficient. Did you ever think about this? If you rarely use the petrol in your tank you should have either bought a pure EV or - if you need a car that can actually drive a reasonable distance - you should have got a straight petrol car. Don't get me wrong. I like hybrids as a technology but their only sensible use is in supercars. Nearly all the people who buy hybrids to go shopping or commute short distances are better off with the petrol version of whatever hybrid they bought because they're cheaper and more efficient. BTW If you actually do have problems with petrol "going off" you can use Aspen. I use that in my classic cars because it lasts for years and it's also pretty high quality stuff. It's Mrs's car, and four years ago she wasn't certain about full EV as she/we sometimes go on longer trips and there were plenty of negative stories about charging facilities. As it's turned out, she uses battery power more often than petrol, home charging hasn't noticeably raised our electricity bill, and longer motorway/autoroute journeys don't seem more costly than petrol ICE. Round here, hybrids currently enjoy the same reduced parking charges as full EVs.
I don't see that buying petrol additives would reduce costs over adding E10 fuel when needed, even increased moisture absorption isn't a problem...
I bought my hybrid because at the time there was a 14 month wait for a full electric. But I'm so pleased with it. Like your Mrs I don't use petrol most days and when I do a long journey on both I get about 56mpg in a big 7 seater SUV. My average is 167mpg. I charge mine from a 13amp socket to, takes about 4.5 hours from zero to full. Oh and the battery doesn't weigh tons, it weighs 44kg about a 12 year old. Has your Mrs seen these supposed massive hikes in insurance? |
|
|
|
Post by zanygame on Oct 20, 2023 16:39:20 GMT
I'd like to know where these numbers come from. My Hybrid insurance is pretty normal between 2-300 quid. These numbers feel wrong. My guess is they are quoting worst case scenario's Young drivers with little no claims in busy areas etcSurely that would also apply to ICE cars? Yes all the figures would be for extreme cases. The right off cost of an EV is much higher than an ICE so the same high risk drivers would see very different hikes in their premiums between the two. |
|
