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Post by steppenwolf on Oct 18, 2023 7:43:34 GMT
zanygame said "Electric cars are much cheaper to run and accelerate faster, they're easier to drive and quieter.
The daft heat pumps work incredibly well and convert 1500watts of input into 3,500watts of output. How does your old boiler (not the wife) compare to that".
Electric cars are better in many ways. They're much simpler than ICE cars mechanically, so they should be more reliable and cheaper to service, and they have more torque. The problem is the decision to power them with a battery - rather than, say, hydrogen fuel cells. The battery is very heavy, very expensive, very dangerous, highly toxic, environmentally damaging, take too long to charge, require a completely new infrastructure to charge and a huge increase in the capacity of the National Grid, which will cost hundreds of billions to deliver. It's the battery that's the problem but the govt is ploughing blindly ahead - just like they did with diesels.
As if that isn't bad enough they're not actually cheaper to run. The insurance industry have been giving their opinions on these cars in the huge premiums that they demand to insure them - if they will even insure them at all. And the cost of electricity has gone up so much that they're now more expensive to run than a petrol car. They also depreciate massively because any problem with the battery means that the car is a write off. Even small accidents cause them to be scrapped because the battery is so vulnerable.
But the really clincher is that they don't even do the thing that was meant to be their whole raison d'etre - cut CO2.
As for heat pumps it's true that they're more efficient - i.e. they're more efficient than using the electricity directly to heat a radiator. But the heat pump is noisy and can't generate the temperature that's needed to heat water to a sufficient temperature, so you need bigger radiators and better insulation. They also cost more to run than a gas boiler. And they're not suitable for most of the houses/flats in the country. They're also big and ugly.
I don't know why you swallow all this green nonsense, zany. It's just so obviously bollocks (and I include climate change) yet you just lap it up.
BTW - I was listening to an interview on Rip off Britain with a London fire brigade officer. He said that the were being called out every other day for a serious Li-ion battery fire. Apparently 9 people have died so far this year in these fires. They had a video of a fire in an e-bike starting. Thhe guy had just left it in his utility room when it started apparently smoking. Then it burst into flames and exploded. Within seconds the whole room was ablaze and he had to run for his life. And that was a small battery in a bike (about 1% of the capacity of a car battery). It wasn't so long ago that the number of fires were going down and the fire brigade were underworked. Not any more.
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Post by steppenwolf on Oct 18, 2023 8:11:05 GMT
Your article seems decidedly ambivalent on which is better for the planet zany. Did you read it? It's also a lot of bollocks: " The biggest advantage of EVs is that they do not emit harmful emissions into the atmosphere, simply because they don't burn any fuel and don't have a tailpipe. Your typical ICE vehicle releases all sorts of dangerous substances, such as carbon monoxide, carbon dioxide, methane, nitrous oxide, and particulates. These all have a negative effect on the planet, with the sheer number of cars on the road today producing mammoth amounts of emissions every minute." Carbon dioxide is not a dangerous substance. And a petrol engine car emits only CO2 and water so it doesn't pollute the atmosphere. Most new cars also have particulate filters so the only particulates emitted are from the tyres - and BEVs are very bad in this respect because they're so heavy. |
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Post by Pacifico on Oct 18, 2023 9:24:21 GMT
I did - take 10 years as an example and out of the cars being sold today the EV with the most mileage (100,000 - which happens to be 10k a year, the UK average) has a range of 40 miles. A 10 year old ICE car with 100,000 miles will have the same range as the day it came out of the showroom - it will have the same range when it gets to 20 years old. The amount of people who would buy a car with a range of 40 miles is measurable on the fingers of one hand. |
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Post by Bentley on Oct 18, 2023 9:32:09 GMT
So far EVs are toys for the wealthy virtue signallers and eco worriers .
One day they might be a practical way to travel for the masses but not now.
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Post by steppenwolf on Oct 18, 2023 13:05:35 GMT
Have you got an electric car zany? Because you don't seem to know much about them.
If you have I seriously advise you to park as far away from your house as you can. There was a guy on the local BBC news a few weeks ago who had an electric van which he parked at the front of his terraced house. It was a about 5 foot from the front door. When it exploded at about midnight he had to get out very quickly because the heat from the fire demolished his front door and burnt out the whole house. He and his family now live in the local Travel Lodge.
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Post by johnofgwent on Oct 19, 2023 6:44:38 GMT
Have you got an electric car zany? Because you don't seem to know much about them. If you have I seriously advise you to park as far away from your house as you can. There was a guy on the local BBC news a few weeks ago who had an electric van which he parked at the front of his terraced house. It was a about 5 foot from the front door. When it exploded at about midnight he had to get out very quickly because the heat from the fire demolished his front door and burnt out the whole house. He and his family now live in the local Travel Lodge. the first thing i did after buying the secondhand leaf was to fit an infrared sensor on the front of the house pointing right at where i parked it and wired it into the house’s smoke alarm network. It was not needed during the time i owned the car but then again the only times in the past 40 years i’ve had a smoke alarm go off is when Moira’s burned toast but i still replace them every five years or so in case i get the same arsonist trouble my daughter had ….. |
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Post by steppenwolf on Oct 19, 2023 7:04:58 GMT
The trouble is that a smoke alarm won't help because of the sheer speed at which the fire develops and the extreme temperatures these fires generate. At least you'll be able to get out of the house but there's absolutely SFA that you can do to control the fire - even the fire brigade have trouble with that.
I can't understand why there's so little concern about this. It's like a slow motion car crash. We know how dangerous these batteries are because of many recent severe fires caused by them, but, apart from the insurance companies whose premiums are skyrocketing, there seems to be no realisation that this is a huge accident waiting to happen. I think the government will only wake up when one of these time-bombs explodes with a family aboard and everyone is killed - because that's what's going to happen. I certainly wouldn't like to get caught up in one of these motorway pile-ups with a BEV amongst the crumpled cars.
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Post by zanygame on Oct 19, 2023 7:08:25 GMT
Have you got an electric car zany? Because you don't seem to know much about them. If you have I seriously advise you to park as far away from your house as you can. There was a guy on the local BBC news a few weeks ago who had an electric van which he parked at the front of his terraced house. It was a about 5 foot from the front door. When it exploded at about midnight he had to get out very quickly because the heat from the fire demolished his front door and burnt out the whole house. He and his family now live in the local Travel Lodge. Key Electric Car Fire Statistics Electric-powered vehicles have the least risk of catching fire according to data from NTSB.
Per 100,000 vehicles.
Hybrid-powered vehicles are at the highest risk of catching fire. (because of the two types of fuel.) Battery- electric vehicles are only 0.03% likely to ignite, compared to 1.5% for gas-powered vehicles and 3.4% for hybrid vehicles.
In all cases the risk is very small. |
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Post by zanygame on Oct 19, 2023 7:12:37 GMT
So far EVs are toys for the wealthy virtue signallers and eco worriers . One day they might be a practical way to travel for the masses but not now. How many plug-in cars are there in the UK? As of the end of September 2023, there were more than 1,450,000 plug-in cars, BEVs are expected to achieve an overall 22.6% market share next year reaching 440,000 units. That's a lot of virtue signalling. Perhaps you should read the signals. |
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Post by Orac on Oct 19, 2023 7:16:31 GMT
No need for the government to force the issue then by decommissioning an entire technological tier
They aren't qualified or capable of making those kinds of decisions and it should be taken out of their hands before these idiots / scam artists break everything.
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Post by zanygame on Oct 19, 2023 7:25:40 GMT
No need for the government to force the issue then by decommissioning an entire technological tier They aren't qualified or capable of making those kinds of decisions and it should be taken out of their hands before these idiots / scam artists break everything. The government are banning smoke puffing monsters. Not promoting electric vehicles because they are better. Stop making this stupid claim, you sound like a cracked record. |
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Post by steppenwolf on Oct 19, 2023 8:35:41 GMT
Have you got an electric car zany? Because you don't seem to know much about them. If you have I seriously advise you to park as far away from your house as you can. There was a guy on the local BBC news a few weeks ago who had an electric van which he parked at the front of his terraced house. It was a about 5 foot from the front door. When it exploded at about midnight he had to get out very quickly because the heat from the fire demolished his front door and burnt out the whole house. He and his family now live in the local Travel Lodge. Key Electric Car Fire Statistics Electric-powered vehicles have the least risk of catching fire according to data from NTSB.
Per 100,000 vehicles.
Hybrid-powered vehicles are at the highest risk of catching fire. (because of the two types of fuel.) Battery- electric vehicles are only 0.03% likely to ignite, compared to 1.5% for gas-powered vehicles and 3.4% for hybrid vehicles.
In all cases the risk is very small. Have you got a link for those figures? And do they take account of mileage? Most pure electric cars are driven low mileages. What about the Fremantle Highway fire that destroyed about 4000 cars and a ship? Did that count as 1 car fire? Or the Luton Airport fire that destroyed 1500 cars and a multi-storey car park? I'd need to look at the data in more detail. The problem with Li-ion fires is that they're disastrous - unlike a petrol or diesel car fire which tends to be localised and easily put out. And I think it's time to stop pretending that hybrid cars are electric. They're not. Most of these plug-in cars are NEVER plugged in. They're the most inefficient and most polluting cars on the road. |
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Post by Bentley on Oct 19, 2023 9:19:42 GMT
So far EVs are toys for the wealthy virtue signallers and eco worriers . One day they might be a practical way to travel for the masses but not now. How many plug-in cars are there in the UK? As of the end of September 2023, there were more than 1,450,000 plug-in cars, BEVs are expected to achieve an overall 22.6% market share next year reaching 440,000 units. That's a lot of virtue signalling. Perhaps you should read the signals. Yes it is a lot of virtue signalling . The signals tell me that there are a lot of wealthy virtue signallers and quite a few not so wealthy suckers around too. |
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Post by Orac on Oct 19, 2023 9:52:59 GMT
Luxury belief systems play a large part here
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Post by steppenwolf on Oct 19, 2023 12:25:48 GMT
zanygame said: "BEVs are expected to achieve an overall 22.6% market share next year reaching 440,000 units."
I think the govt REQUIRE BEVs to achieve a 22% of market share next year - which is not the same as "expect" them to. The word from the industry is that BEVs are proving very hard to sell because of huge running costs and minimal infrastructure. But if the manufacturers can't achieve 20% BEV sales (out of their range) they have to stop selling ICE cars.
It could get interesting.
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