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Post by Ripley on Sept 23, 2023 15:20:12 GMT
Très intéressant! Can you envisage a future time when the Auld Alliance, or somethin akin to it, might be rekindled? i dont think its ever been extinguished ripley. we have the consulate general of france based in scotland , the good professor makes the claim the formal auld alliance has never been formally ended , and there are still strong ties between the two countries today , culturally lingusitically , and in business and politics. The french military uses scottish songs , and there are statues all over france to scottish soldiers who have died fighting for france all over the centuries. My own grandfather was one of them.
I mean, even if an independent Scotland is never granted EU membership, the possibility that an independent Scotland could some day ally with France/EU against England must weigh heavily on Westminster, which only strengthens their aversion to another indyref. |
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Post by thomas on Sept 23, 2023 15:26:19 GMT
one of the oldest regiments in the french army was the gardes eccosaise. They were still issuing commands in gaelic to the troopers until they were disbanded in the 19th century. tam muir of hunterhill was the first non frenchman to become a citizen of the new french republic after the french revolution. French universities were full of scottish students across the centuries , and of course it was a 700 year old law , only rescinded (arguably) in 1906 during the entente coridale negotiations between britian and france that all scottish men woman and children were automatically french citizens.
Franco-Scottish alliance against England one of longest in history
A University of Manchester historian has uncovered evidence which shows how a defensive alliance against England between Scotland and France might never have formally ended – potentially making it the longest in history.
J. Macpherson, published in Scottish Field in 1967, says Dr Talbott, showed that France refused to accept Westminster’s abrogation of the Scottish side of the Auld Alliance in 1906, following the Entente Cordiale between Britain and France. By French law, a Scotsman born before 1907 still possesses the full rights and privileges of Franco-Scottish nationality.
The 716-year-old citizenship and trading privileges enjoyed by Scots in France, she suggests, are possibly intact today.
Scottish merchants paid less or no customs at some French ports, whereas some ports would not trade with the English at all.
Très intéressant! Can you envisage a future time when the Auld Alliance, or somethin akin to it, might be rekindled? from the horses mouth ripley ......
Auld Alliance unbroken by Brexit, says French diplomat
FRANCE’S consul general to Scotland, Laurence Pais, is thankful that people from her country are “really welcomed and loved” by Scots
and i loved this bit from the good consul general ripley , in what can only be described as a clear diplomatic dig at les anglais....
Departing the post this month, she has had time to reflect on her time here. Pais said: “As French citizens, we are really welcomed and loved in Scotland. We are never criticised. I have not read an article against the French while in Scotland and I know this is not always the case everywhere in the UK.”
and of course the french maintain consulates in scotland .
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Post by thomas on Sept 23, 2023 15:33:14 GMT
i dont think its ever been extinguished ripley. we have the consulate general of france based in scotland , the good professor makes the claim the formal auld alliance has never been formally ended , and there are still strong ties between the two countries today , culturally lingusitically , and in business and politics. The french military uses scottish songs , and there are statues all over france to scottish soldiers who have died fighting for france all over the centuries. My own grandfather was one of them.
I mean, even if an independent Scotland is never granted EU membership, the possibility that an independent Scotland could some day ally with France/EU against England must weigh heavily on Westminster, which only strengthens their aversion to another indyref. i think the eu question worries the london elite extremely. They have a large anti european population in england , entirely through the fault of succesive british governments who were happy to take the credit for when the eu/eec done good , but quick to blame the eu / eec when they themselves did things bad. The tony blair mass immigration fiasco post 2004 is a clear example of this.
Not to mention as i have said englands historical aversion to europeans. They have fought countless times against many european nations , while scotland and ireland have largely been on friendly terms with europe.
An independent scotland would be granted eu membership. The current snp policy of immediate rejoin is a nonsense though. First of all , we have to navigate independence. The snp are sitting wating on the mountian coming to them , then by all accounts , experts are saying a timescale of roughly 5 years is exepcted to rejoin post indy.
Salmond and alba have a more coherent short term policy of eu membership by their three month EFTA proposal which would give us access to the single market immediately. Most scots in polls would be happy to have a hard eu border from gretna to berwick as a price to rejoin .
The thought of little england being surrounded by eu member states terrifies the london elite. You can clearly see all efforts are being made to put starmer into government by the estblishment and i believe many pro european tories would happily lose the next election to let labour take the blame of taking england/uk back into the EU.
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Post by Bentley on Sept 23, 2023 15:34:07 GMT
Quote from William Wallace pretending to be Mel Gibson
“Aye, fight and you may die. Run and you'll live – at least a while. And dying in your beds many years from now, would you be willing to trade all the days from this day to that for one chance, just one chance to come back here and tell our enemies that they may take our lives, but they'll never take our freedom!”
Willie lied . They did.
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Post by walterpaisley on Sept 23, 2023 15:55:55 GMT
It's a great speech.
And every inch as ficticious as the St Crispin's Day crowd pleaser that Shakespeare gave his Henry V (before he trot's merrily off to commit one of the worst war crimes of the Hundred Years War..).
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Post by Ripley on Sept 23, 2023 15:56:59 GMT
I mean, even if an independent Scotland is never granted EU membership, the possibility that an independent Scotland could some day ally with France/EU against England must weigh heavily on Westminster, which only strengthens their aversion to another indyref. i think the eu question worries the london elite extremely. They have a large anti european population in england , entirely through the fault of succesive british governments who were happy to take the credit for when the eu/eec done good , but quick to blame the eu / eec when they themselves did things bad. The tony blair mass immigration fiasco post 2004 is a clear example of this.
Not to mention as i have said englands historical aversion to europeans. They have fought countless times against many european nations , while scotland and ireland have largely been on friendly terms with europe.
An independent scotland would be granted eu membership. The current snp policy of immediate rejoin is a nonsense though. First of all , we have to navigate independence. The snp are sitting wating on the mountian coming to them , then by all accounts , experts are saying a timescale of roughly 5 years is exepcted to rejoin post indy.
Salmond and alba have a more coherent short term policy of eu membership by their three month EFTA proposal which would give us access to the single market immediately. Most scots in polls would be happy to have a hard eu border from gretna to berwick as a price to rejoin .
The thought of little england being surrounded by eu member states terrifies the london elite. You can clearly see all efforts are being made to put starmer into government by the estblishment and i believe many pro european tories would happily lose the next election to let labour take the blame of taking england/uk back into the EU.
I was unaware of that. Do you by any chance have a link for that? I can see Scotland regaining EU membership, but what are the chances the UK could be welcomed back after all the Brexit shenanigans? When N.I. leaves, and Scotland leaves, England will still have Wales for company. Don't you think it unlikely that Wales could leave? I know they want to, but they don't have Scotland's resources. |
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Post by thomas on Sept 23, 2023 16:01:04 GMT
It's a great speech. And every inch as ficticious as the St Crispin's Day crowd pleaser that Shakespeare gave his Henry V (before he trot's merrily off to commit one of the worst war crimes of the Hundred Years War..). i preferred charles de gaulles speech in edinburgh myself . About the only authentic part of wallaces speech in the film might have been the bit where he cries alba gu brath in scottish. (scotland for ever) 
Speech delivered by General de Gaulle at Edinburgh, 23rd June 1942
I do not think that a Frenchman could have come to Scotland at any time without being sensible of a special emotion. Scarcely can he set foot in this ancient and glorious land before he finds countless natural affinities between your country and ours dating from the very earliest times. In the same moment, awareness of the thousand links, still living and cherished, of the Franco-Scottish Alliance, the oldest alliance in the world, leaps to his mind.
When I say "Franco-Scottish Alliance," I am thinking, firstly, of course, of that close political and military entente which, in the Middle Ages, was established between our ancient monarchy and yours.
I am thinking of the Scottish blood which flowed in the veins of our kings and of the French blood which flowed in the veins of your kings, of glory shared on past battlefields, from the siege of Orleans, raised by Joan of Arc, to Valmy, where Goethe recognised that a new age was dawning for the world.
In every combat where for five centuries the destiny of France was at stake, there were always men of Scotland to fight side by side with men of France, and what Frenchmen feel is that no people has ever been more generous than yours with its friendship.
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Post by Bentley on Sept 23, 2023 16:06:22 GMT
Oh dear. Despite having the French as besties for centuries the Scot’s were still subject to English oppression ( according to snats).
They both share the same shoulder chip 😁
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Post by thomas on Sept 23, 2023 16:07:34 GMT
i think the eu question worries the london elite extremely. They have a large anti european population in england , entirely through the fault of succesive british governments who were happy to take the credit for when the eu/eec done good , but quick to blame the eu / eec when they themselves did things bad. The tony blair mass immigration fiasco post 2004 is a clear example of this.
Not to mention as i have said englands historical aversion to europeans. They have fought countless times against many european nations , while scotland and ireland have largely been on friendly terms with europe.
An independent scotland would be granted eu membership. The current snp policy of immediate rejoin is a nonsense though. First of all , we have to navigate independence. The snp are sitting wating on the mountian coming to them , then by all accounts , experts are saying a timescale of roughly 5 years is exepcted to rejoin post indy.
Salmond and alba have a more coherent short term policy of eu membership by their three month EFTA proposal which would give us access to the single market immediately. Most scots in polls would be happy to have a hard eu border from gretna to berwick as a price to rejoin .
The thought of little england being surrounded by eu member states terrifies the london elite. You can clearly see all efforts are being made to put starmer into government by the estblishment and i believe many pro european tories would happily lose the next election to let labour take the blame of taking england/uk back into the EU.
I was unaware of that. Do you by any chance have a link for that? I can see Scotland regaining EU membership, but what are the chances the UK could be welcomed back after all the Brexit shenanigans? When N.I. leaves, and Scotland leaves, England will still have Wales for company. Don't you think it unlikely that Wales could leave? I know they want to, but they don't have Scotland's resources. 
According to our recent Panelbase poll, it turns out that a hard border at Berwick and Gretna is a price that Scottish voters are – by a margin of more than two to one – willing to pay to stay in the EU.
i think there is a high chance of the uk going back in at the next election under starmer , but with humiliating consequences. no more opt outs , or brussells putting up with the former anglo wayward child like i nthe past. The precedence will have been set , england cannot cope on its own without brussells , and the new relationship will clearly be master and servant.
im not sure that wales will stay. Indepdnence support is slowly growing , i think from meory its around a third now in support. The problem for the london elite is similar to what happend in the empire , once one goes , the others all want to follow. I think northern ireland will go in the next few years , and possibly start the house of cards falling .
The future is very bleak for the british . They are either going to split apart , or be swallowed whole by the much larger powerfull EU.
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Post by thomas on Sept 23, 2023 16:12:05 GMT
Oh dear. Despite having the French as besties for centuries the Scot’s were still subject to English oppression ( according to snats). They both share the same shoulder chip 😁 you are hilarious ben e. you , a man of faith who believes in talking snakes laughing at scottish history , while slagging off the french despite canonising a french man in your signature. 
you do know voltaire was a frenchman surely? As they always say , the englishman looks up to the frenchman for sophistication .Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
isnt their some english philosopher you could have championed instead my slow witted friend?
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Post by Bentley on Sept 23, 2023 16:17:22 GMT
Oh dear. Despite having the French as besties for centuries the Scot’s were still subject to English oppression ( according to snats). They both share the same shoulder chip 😁 you are hilarious ben e. you , a man of faith who believes in talking snakes laughing at scottish history , while slagging off the french despite canonising a french man in your signature.
you do know voltaire was a frenchman surely? As they always say , the englishman looks up to the frenchman for sophistication .Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
isnt their some english philosopher you could have championed instead my slow witted friend?
That’s funny coming from a sweatie who believes supergran is real, toomy. The French are a remarkable people but where are they when their Scottish besties need them? Hiding it seems . Still the snats need as many friends as they can muster. |
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Post by Ripley on Sept 23, 2023 16:26:17 GMT
I was unaware of that. Do you by any chance have a link for that? I can see Scotland regaining EU membership, but what are the chances the UK could be welcomed back after all the Brexit shenanigans? When N.I. leaves, and Scotland leaves, England will still have Wales for company. Don't you think it unlikely that Wales could leave? I know they want to, but they don't have Scotland's resources.
According to our recent Panelbase poll, it turns out that a hard border at Berwick and Gretna is a price that Scottish voters are – by a margin of more than two to one – willing to pay to stay in the EU.
Thanks for that.
i think there is a high chance of the uk going back in at the next election under starmer , but with humiliating consequences. no more opt outs , or brussells putting up with the former anglo wayward child like i nthe past. The precedence will have been set , england cannot cope on its own without brussells , and the new relationship will clearly be master and servant.
If you thought Brexit was a drama, imagine what it would be like watching Westminster kicking against the sort of terms the EU would demand.
im not sure that wales will stay. Indepdnence support is slowly growing , i think from meory its around a third now in support. The problem for the london elite is similar to what happend in the empire , once one goes , the others all want to follow. I think northern ireland will go in the next few years , and possibly start the house of cards falling .
The future is very bleak for the british . They are either going to split apart , or be swallowed whole by the much larger powerfull EU.
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Post by thomas on Sept 23, 2023 18:46:29 GMT
you are hilarious ben e. you , a man of faith who believes in talking snakes laughing at scottish history , while slagging off the french despite canonising a french man in your signature.
you do know voltaire was a frenchman surely? As they always say , the englishman looks up to the frenchman for sophistication .Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
isnt their some english philosopher you could have championed instead my slow witted friend?
That’s funny coming from a sweatie who believes supergran is real, toomy. The French are a remarkable people but where are they when their Scottish besties need them? Hiding it seems . Still the snats need as many friends as they can muster. looking up to a french philosopher in your signature while self mocking your own country and faith. lower than a snakes belly ben e.
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Post by Bentley on Sept 23, 2023 18:53:38 GMT
That’s funny coming from a sweatie who believes supergran is real, toomy. The French are a remarkable people but where are they when their Scottish besties need them? Hiding it seems . Still the snats need as many friends as they can muster. looking up to a french philosopher in your signature while self mocking your own country and faith. lower than a snakes belly ben e.
SuperGran is on YouTube toomy. Fill you boots .😁 |
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Post by thomas on Sept 23, 2023 18:54:13 GMT
According to our recent Panelbase poll, it turns out that a hard border at Berwick and Gretna is a price that Scottish voters are – by a margin of more than two to one – willing to pay to stay in the EU.
Thanks for that.
i think there is a high chance of the uk going back in at the next election under starmer , but with humiliating consequences. no more opt outs , or brussells putting up with the former anglo wayward child like i nthe past. The precedence will have been set , england cannot cope on its own without brussells , and the new relationship will clearly be master and servant.
If you thought Brexit was a drama, imagine what it would be like watching Westminster kicking against the sort of terms the EU would demand.
im not sure that wales will stay. Indepdnence support is slowly growing , i think from meory its around a third now in support. The problem for the london elite is similar to what happend in the empire , once one goes , the others all want to follow. I think northern ireland will go in the next few years , and possibly start the house of cards falling .
The future is very bleak for the british . They are either going to split apart , or be swallowed whole by the much larger powerfull EU.
i think the many many problems of the uk are to do with the end of empire , and the hard reality facing many people of britains situation in the 21st century as a mere regional and former world power. everywhere you look , in every aspect of society , its managed decline , failure upon failure of all aspects of governance , simplistic notions being put forward by desperate people to solve major issues , and great anger at the status quo as it stands.
Three hundred years ago , there was a purpose to the uk , wether people like me agreed with the original union or not , its undeniable england was setting out on a voyage to plunder the world and carve an empire and some scots wanted in on it rightly or wrongly , especially among the elite.
Even 40 , 50 years ago , there were great british institutions , a sort of glue that held the fraying uk nations together . Now? Nothing.
The uk originally had a purpose. Now? There is no purpose. Its redundant. Scotland either wants to be an indy nation , or of it feels the need to be part of something larger , the eu sits on our doorstep. Either way , the question keeps propping up among scots and i suspect the other nations of what is the point of the uk apart from nostaglic navel gazing rubbish of a past long gone never to return.
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