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Post by zanygame on Aug 6, 2023 15:30:26 GMT
No. I'm not. The problem is the exact opposite, I keep trying to separate them, others keep muddling them. I stated ULEZ has little to do with climate change and much about local pollution. Only to have someone post that Sadiq Khan is claiming exactly that. I set out my position and get back a thing about the underground being more polluted. Sigh. Right - but then we have the underpopulated and its particulate pollution Sorry? |
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Post by Orac on Aug 6, 2023 16:03:54 GMT
Right - but then we have the underpopulated and its particulate pollution Sorry? Right - but then we have the underground and its particulate pollution autocomplete got me |
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Post by oracle75 on Aug 6, 2023 16:22:13 GMT
You have an overblown political London centric problem.
The rest of the country doesnt care.
I doubt if your average voter who lives outside London cares a toss and frankly i am sick of hearing about it.
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Post by zanygame on Aug 6, 2023 16:45:07 GMT
Right - but then we have the underground and its particulate pollution autocomplete got me Yes indeed, we also have avian flu. |
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Post by Pacifico on Aug 6, 2023 17:04:28 GMT
Well if you are worried purely about carbon emissions you wouldnt have a scrappage scheme for old cars - you would be encouraging people to hang onto their cars for as long as possible. Save the planet - drive an old car. I'm not worried purely about Carbon emissions, I just want people to recognise they are separate things. As for keeping cars as long as possible, there are very many variables defining that calculation. I assume you are one of those saying we should not foist EV's on people. How do you feel about telling them they aren't allowed to replace their car at all? I'm not particularly in favour of telling anyone to do anything. However what I see as the future is that cars will become simply another consumer appliance like a TV or microwave (especially if we are inundated with cheap Chinese rubbish) that will be ditched and end up in landfill after just a few years simply because consumer tastes change and nobody can be bothered to repair them. So if that is the future then the rush to EV's to reduce emissions is going to leave an awful lot of people with egg on their faces. |
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Post by zanygame on Aug 6, 2023 17:42:41 GMT
I'm not worried purely about Carbon emissions, I just want people to recognise they are separate things. As for keeping cars as long as possible, there are very many variables defining that calculation. I assume you are one of those saying we should not foist EV's on people. How do you feel about telling them they aren't allowed to replace their car at all? I'm not particularly in favour of telling anyone to do anything. However what I see as the future is that cars will become simply another consumer appliance like a TV or microwave (especially if we are inundated with cheap Chinese rubbish) that will be ditched and end up in landfill after just a few years simply because consumer tastes change and nobody can be bothered to repair them. So if that is the future then the rush to EV's to reduce emissions is going to leave an awful lot of people with egg on their faces. So assuming we need to stop pumping Co2 into the atmosphere and we don't want to tell people they can't replace their car, the only course I see is to make future cars not pump out Co2. The EU share your concerns about a throw away society, they now insist all goods be accessible and repairable. No more of those crazy headed screws you can't undo. I think cars are a long way from being disposable, most people still go to great lengths to ensure a good resale value on their vehicles. |
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Post by Orac on Aug 6, 2023 17:48:36 GMT
Right - but then we have the underground and its particulate pollution autocomplete got me Yes indeed, we also have avian flu. I take it you aren't in favuor of closing the Undeground down because it creates pollution |
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Post by Pacifico on Aug 6, 2023 17:52:39 GMT
I'm not particularly in favour of telling anyone to do anything. However what I see as the future is that cars will become simply another consumer appliance like a TV or microwave (especially if we are inundated with cheap Chinese rubbish) that will be ditched and end up in landfill after just a few years simply because consumer tastes change and nobody can be bothered to repair them. So if that is the future then the rush to EV's to reduce emissions is going to leave an awful lot of people with egg on their faces. So assuming we need to stop pumping Co2 into the atmosphere and we don't want to tell people they can't replace their car, the only course I see is to make future cars not pump out Co2. The EU share your concerns about a throw away society, they now insist all goods be accessible and repairable. No more of those crazy headed screws you can't undo. I think cars are a long way from being disposable, most people still go to great lengths to ensure a good resale value on their vehicles. Modern EV's are totally reliant on software - just like mobile phones and as soon as the manufacturers decide to stop supporting that software on old EV's they will be just as much of a brick as old mobile phones. |
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Post by jonksy on Aug 6, 2023 17:55:55 GMT
Sadiq Khan accused of letting slip Labour's secret plot to roll out ULEZ across Britain Sadiq Khan has been accused of letting slip Labour's secret plans to roll out ULEZ across Britain if the party comes to power next year. The London Mayor said on Friday that authorities in the Home Counties should set up their own ULEZ schemes adding to the expansion he has overseen for the whole of London. The £12.50-a-day driver tax comes into force for all areas of the capital from August 29. Mayor Khan defeated the Tory-run London boroughs of Bromley, Bexley, Harrow and Hillingdon, as well as Surrey County Council, at the High Court last month in their bid to stop ULEZ expansion. Despite victory in the courts, Labour suffered in the polls with the party failing to beat the Conservatives in the by-election in Boris Johnson's former seat of Uxbridge and South Ruislip.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 6, 2023 19:44:17 GMT
You have an overblown political London centric problem. The rest of the country doesnt care. I doubt if your average voter who lives outside London cares a toss and frankly i am sick of hearing about it. It matters to the rest of us because things often happen in London first and, if seen as a success or as popular, tends to be repeated elsewhere. So London today but maybe a city near you tomorrow. So everyone who would like to see something similar to ULEZ where they live, should have an interest in seeing it work in London. Everyone who would not like to see something like ULEZ where they live should have an interest in seeing it not work in London. So to dismiss it as of no significance because you don't live in or near London is very short sighted if there is a major city anywhere near you. |
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Post by oracle75 on Aug 6, 2023 21:11:58 GMT
Are you trying to suggest that what is happening in London will happen in northampton or Lincoln or Nottingham or Durham or St.Austell or East Anglia or Cornwall or Scotland or Wales anywhere north of the red wall ( god it sounds like Game of Thrones).
This is a political pre election windup.
Instead if the Tories or Labour really wanted to control emissions they would offer proper scrappage and deals on EV's.
This is putting people out of work and filling London's coffers.
And what are they doing with it? Subsidising businesses? Providing laws that prevent landlords from ignoring mould and shiit housing? Providing parks and clean open spaces?
No. Clobbering and taxing the self employed van driver who instead of paying taxes, will now need benefits.
Do Uber and Just Eat have to pay ULEZ?
This is simply a tax like the old window tax, covered in the pretty colours of "we are saving lives."
What ever happened to the catalytic converter? Is is now beyond the wit of man to remove most of the particulates etc that are the problem?
How many businesses will it take to balance off the new carbon released into the air by Labour's new coal mine??
Joined up thinking stops at the borders of UK government. Maybe there should be a tax on localised bordered "thinking".
THERE IS NO JOINED UP THINKING OR PLAN .
It is chaos and as usual, the little guy pays.
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Post by oracle75 on Aug 6, 2023 21:47:34 GMT
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Post by zanygame on Aug 7, 2023 6:18:24 GMT
Yes indeed, we also have avian flu. I take it you aren't in favuor of closing the Undeground down because it creates pollution No. |
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Post by zanygame on Aug 7, 2023 6:24:25 GMT
So assuming we need to stop pumping Co2 into the atmosphere and we don't want to tell people they can't replace their car, the only course I see is to make future cars not pump out Co2. The EU share your concerns about a throw away society, they now insist all goods be accessible and repairable. No more of those crazy headed screws you can't undo. I think cars are a long way from being disposable, most people still go to great lengths to ensure a good resale value on their vehicles. Modern EV's are totally reliant on software - just like mobile phones and as soon as the manufacturers decide to stop supporting that software on old EV's they will be just as much of a brick as old mobile phones. Modern vehicles are totally reliant on software. Everything has thousands of chips these days. They are more reliable and longer lasting than they've ever been. Your comparison to mobile phones is flawed. The reason mobile phones go out of date is the software keeps getting upgraded to the latest version. They carry lots of personal information which makes them vulnerable to hacking and that software keeps changing. None of those things applies to your car. A better comparison would be your TV. |
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Post by zanygame on Aug 7, 2023 6:25:54 GMT
You have an overblown political London centric problem. The rest of the country doesnt care. I doubt if your average voter who lives outside London cares a toss and frankly i am sick of hearing about it. It matters to the rest of us because things often happen in London first and, if seen as a success or as popular, tends to be repeated elsewhere. So London today but maybe a city near you tomorrow. So everyone who would like to see something similar to ULEZ where they live, should have an interest in seeing it work in London. Everyone who would not like to see something like ULEZ where they live should have an interest in seeing it not work in London. So to dismiss it as of no significance because you don't live in or near London is very short sighted if there is a major city anywhere near you. Its being pushed through in Cambridge. |
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