|
|
Post by dodgydave on Nov 1, 2022 1:36:15 GMT
The Maastricht Treaty was never put to the people of the UK, and it was signed before the 1992 GE. In fact, it was only put to a couple of countries. In France it scrapped through, and the others had to run a second referendum because they didn't get the answer they wanted lol.
Freedom of Movement is just a bad idea. Tens of millions of people wandering around the EU in an unplanned manner, lowering wages, causing housing shortages, straining public services, and limiting the opportunities of our young people.
|
|
|
|
Post by totheleft3 on Nov 1, 2022 4:10:42 GMT
And yet we still have increased immigration since Fom stopped.
What effects all the points you mentioned.
|
|
|
|
Post by jonksy on Nov 1, 2022 6:14:09 GMT
It did NOT make it clear. I see you avoided to state that it never mentioned the loss of UK sovereignty along with theour own identity. maybe you the one who should throw the dice. You know full well that people would not have voted for it if they were told the truth. As they wouldn't have voted to join on the shirtlifters bullshit. know we never lost our sovereignty. They know for a start we had the ability to leave the EU Maybe you don't qualify Grown ups. Would accept that we left the EUSSR by a democratic means. So what is your excuse? |
|
|
|
Post by steppenwolf on Nov 1, 2022 7:07:15 GMT
Don't be silly. We're out of the ECJ. But we remain subject to the judgements of the ECHR - by choice apparently. I meant exactly what I said. As always people who wanted to remain in the EU tend not to know what it is. So you totally understand that the ECHR is absolutely nothing to do with the EU? Oh FFS. EVERYONE knows that. If they only know one thing about the EU it's this. It has nothing to do with what I was talking about. |
|
|
|
Post by steppenwolf on Nov 1, 2022 7:24:45 GMT
It did NOT make it clear. I see you avoided to state that it never mentioned the loss of UK sovereignty along with theour own identity. maybe you the one who should throw the dice. You know full well that people would not have voted for it if they were told the truth. As they wouldn't have voted to join on the shirtlifters bullshit. Grown ups know we never lost our sovereignty. They know for a start we had the ability to leave the EU Maybe you don't qualify That's an old defence of the EU - "the EU is democratic because you can leave it". Bollocks. It's actually very, very difficult to leave the EU as we've shown. It's designed to make it as hard as possible - and the EU had the cheek to demand massive payment for the right to leave (originally set at £80 billion) and to agree a "Wthdrawal Agreement" before they would negotiate trade. They made it as difficult as possible, and Martin Selmayr said that the price of the UK leaving the EU would be the breakup of the UK. So they weaponised Northern Ireland with the NI Protocol, where basically NI stays in the Single Market and has a hard border with Britain. And for any country that's in the EU and has adopted the euro it is virtually impossible to leave. |
|
|
|
Post by Steve on Nov 1, 2022 12:03:45 GMT
Just the lefties double standards as per usual mate. Well if you consider the EU to be a good thing by default , all good roads lead to it and any road leading away must be bad. And just who do you suppose considers the well flawed EU to be a good thing by default? It was a least worst option and only a conditional one at that. |
|
|
|
Post by Steve on Nov 1, 2022 12:05:12 GMT
The Maastricht Treaty was never put to the people of the UK, and it was signed before the 1992 GE. In fact, it was only put to a couple of countries. In France it scrapped through, and the others had to run a second referendum because they didn't get the answer they wanted lol. Freedom of Movement is just a bad idea. Tens of millions of people wandering around the EU in an unplanned manner, lowering wages, causing housing shortages, straining public services, and limiting the opportunities of our young people. BS ^ The Maastricht treaty was provisionally signed before that GE. It was not approved and then ratified until 1993 by the government that stood in that 1992 election on a platform of planning to ratify it. |
|
|
|
Post by Steve on Nov 1, 2022 12:08:20 GMT
Grown ups know we never lost our sovereignty. They know for a start we had the ability to leave the EU Maybe you don't qualify That's an old defence of the EU - "the EU is democratic because you can leave it". Bollocks. It's actually very, very difficult to leave the EU as we've shown. It's designed to make it as hard as possible - and the EU had the cheek to demand massive payment for the right to leave (originally set at £80 billion) and to agree a "Wthdrawal Agreement" before they would negotiate trade. They made it as difficult as possible, and Martin Selmayr said that the price of the UK leaving the EU would be the breakup of the UK. So they weaponised Northern Ireland with the NI Protocol, where basically NI stays in the Single Market and has a hard border with Britain. And for any country that's in the EU and has adopted the euro it is virtually impossible to leave. Rubbish Legally it was was easy to leave. We had full sovereignty. Leaving and not having an economic disaster from the consequences was the difficult thing. You seem to be another that believes you can divorce a wife calling her fat and ugly and still have some imagined right for her to do your ironing. |
|
|
|
Post by Steve on Nov 1, 2022 12:09:38 GMT
Grown ups know we never lost our sovereignty. They know for a start we had the ability to leave the EU Maybe you don't qualify Grown ups. Would accept that we left the EUSSR by a democratic means. So what is your excuse? Since 'the EUSSR' is something that only exists in the imagination of the deranged I'll ignore that stupid question. |
|
|
|
Post by Steve on Nov 1, 2022 12:12:09 GMT
But the fact is it was always more than a free trade area and had programmes such as CAP from the very early days to directly support other objectives. It is just false to say 'we only joined a free trade area' That said your frog analogy isn't a bad one. The EU was allowed to grow too many ambitions, too many non convergent countries and too many areas of competence without too much thought. But it never was the big oppressive 'we run you' ogre uber Brexiters pretend it was. As I outlined, its areas of law making were actually relatively insignificant. The BIG problem was always freedom of movement and that idiot Blair allowing non convergent economy countries to join without limits on their free movement to us. Tbh I can’t totally disagree but I think it’s a bit rich to say that the plebs should of read the small print before the vote to join then claim that the plebs weren’t shown the small print when before the vote to leave . Not sure I understand that point you're making. Where have I claimed 'the plebs weren’t shown the small print when before the vote to leave .'? |
|
|
|
Post by jonksy on Nov 1, 2022 12:35:27 GMT
Grown ups. Would accept that we left the EUSSR by a democratic means. So what is your excuse? Since 'the EUSSR' is something that only exists in the imagination of the deranged I'll ignore that stupid question. I feel your pain....LOL |
|
|
|
Post by see2 on Nov 1, 2022 13:43:18 GMT
The Maastricht Treaty was never put to the people of the UK, and it was signed before the 1992 GE. In fact, it was only put to a couple of countries. In France it scrapped through, and the others had to run a second referendum because they didn't get the answer they wanted lol. Freedom of Movement is just a bad idea. Tens of millions of people wandering around the EU in an unplanned manner, lowering wages, causing housing shortages, straining public services, and limiting the opportunities of our young people. AFAIA second referendums benefited from explanations that corrected false beliefs that had been accepted and had helped create the result of the first referendum. EU freedom of movement, providing it is used in the way it was originally intended is a very reasonable way of proceeding in a united European and associated countries. IT SHOULD not be confused with the problems CAUSED by ASYLUM SEEKERS or ILEGAL MIGRATION. SEE BELOW. "__If you want to remain in an EU, EEA state or Switzerland for more than 90 days, you may be asked to show that you are: In employment Self-employed A full time student with health insurance and money to support yourself You have money to support yourself and health insurance (for you and your family) without state assistance Qualifying family members of EU citizens, EEA nationals and Swiss citizens from these categories also have a right to live in another state for more than 90 days. See ‘Family members’ below for more information. If you stay in another EU or EEA state or Switzerland for over 90 days and are not in any of the above categories, you could be given a Removal Order."__ __"Your right to stay in an EU, EEA country or Switzerland for up to 90 days could be cancelled if you become an unreasonable burden on the social assistance system of the member state. If you have recently moved to Ireland, have not been able to find work, and have no money to support yourself, the Irish state does not have to pay you social assistance. See ‘Restrictions on freedom of movement' below."__ www.citizensinformation.ie/en/government_in_ireland/european_government/european_union/freedom_of_movement_in_the_eu.html |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2022 13:45:40 GMT
Grown ups know we never lost our sovereignty. They know for a start we had the ability to leave the EU Maybe you don't qualify Grown ups. Would accept that we left the EUSSR by a democratic means. So what is your excuse? You mention 'Grown ups' and the liken the EU to Russia.  |
|
|
|
Post by jonksy on Nov 1, 2022 14:00:08 GMT
Grown ups. Would accept that we left the EUSSR by a democratic means. So what is your excuse? You mention 'Grown ups' and the liken the EU to Russia. And REAL grownups would know where I was coming from. |
|
|
|
Post by Steve on Nov 1, 2022 14:03:47 GMT
You mention 'Grown ups' and the liken the EU to Russia. And REAL grownups would know where I was coming from. La la land? |
|
