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Post by Bentley on May 22, 2023 9:47:28 GMT
Nevertheless, what do you think the reaction would be if a theatre company announced a 'Whiteout' event at which persons of colour would be asked not to attend in order that the predominantly or wholly white audience would not be subjected to the 'coloured gaze'? First of all, the surrounding influences would be very different. White people were never taken in their hundreds of thousands into slavery by coloured people where there was beating abuse and rape and more, that their white descendants had to deal with mentally. If it was a satirical show based upon American experiences where people of colour were 'urged' not to attend, I suspect people of colour would probably just take the advice. Not true Slave markets flourished on the Barbary Coast of North Africa, in what is modern-day Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, and western Libya, between the 15th and middle of the 19th century. These markets prospered while the states were nominally under Ottoman suzerainty, though, in reality, they were mostly autonomous. The North African slave markets traded in European slaves which were acquired by Barbary pirates in slave raids on ships and by raids on coastal towns from Italy to Spain, Portugal, France, England, the Netherlands, and as far afield as the Turkish Abductions in Iceland. Men, women, and children were captured to such a devastating extent that vast numbers of sea coast towns were abandoned. According to Robert Davis, between 1 million and 1.25 million Europeans were captured by Barbary pirates and sold as slaves in North Africa and Ottoman Empire between the 15th and 19th centuries.[17][18] However, to extrapolate his numbers, Davis assumes the number of European slaves captured by Barbary pirates was constant for a 250-year period, stating: There are no records of how many men, women and children were enslaved, but it is possible to calculate roughly the number of fresh captives that would have been needed to keep populations steady and replace those slaves who died, escaped, were ransomed, or converted to Islam. On this basis it is thought that around 8,500 new slaves were needed annually to replenish numbers – about 850,000 captives over the century from 1580 to 1680. By extension, for the 250 years between 1530 and 1780, the figure could easily have been as high as 1,250,000."[19] WIKI. |
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Post by see2 on May 22, 2023 9:52:20 GMT
The ancestors of some of the white people in attendance may well also have endured cruel treatment and horrendous conditions during the early stages of the industrial revolution. Yes, but that would be self inflicted by our own people, not based upon race. |
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Post by Fairsociety on May 22, 2023 9:58:01 GMT
Both white and black people have fought for fair equality, but now black people are being unfair, they want to be black supremacy, it wasn't BLM it was Black Lives Supremacy, they want to have their own segregation and black space, with white faces excluded, but they also want to be in charge of white spaces with black space.
They are taking us back to the Malcolm X and Martin Luther King era, this isn't progress this is history repeating itself.
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Post by see2 on May 22, 2023 10:01:02 GMT
First of all, the surrounding influences would be very different. White people were never taken in their hundreds of thousands into slavery by coloured people where there was beating abuse and rape and more, that their white descendants had to deal with mentally. If it was a satirical show based upon American experiences where people of colour were 'urged' not to attend, I suspect people of colour would probably just take the advice. Not true Slave markets flourished on the Barbary Coast of North Africa, in what is modern-day Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, and western Libya, between the 15th and middle of the 19th century. These markets prospered while the states were nominally under Ottoman suzerainty, though, in reality, they were mostly autonomous. The North African slave markets traded in European slaves which were acquired by Barbary pirates in slave raids on ships and by raids on coastal towns from Italy to Spain, Portugal, France, England, the Netherlands, and as far afield as the Turkish Abductions in Iceland. Men, women, and children were captured to such a devastating extent that vast numbers of sea coast towns were abandoned. According to Robert Davis, between 1 million and 1.25 million Europeans were captured by Barbary pirates and sold as slaves in North Africa and Ottoman Empire between the 15th and 19th centuries.[17][18] However, to extrapolate his numbers, Davis assumes the number of European slaves captured by Barbary pirates was constant for a 250-year period, stating: There are no records of how many men, women and children were enslaved, but it is possible to calculate roughly the number of fresh captives that would have been needed to keep populations steady and replace those slaves who died, escaped, were ransomed, or converted to Islam. On this basis it is thought that around 8,500 new slaves were needed annually to replenish numbers – about 850,000 captives over the century from 1580 to 1680. By extension, for the 250 years between 1530 and 1780, the figure could easily have been as high as 1,250,000."[19] WIKI. The Barbary coast? tell us something new. I have posted many comments on it, BUT IT HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the present discussion on coloured people in the UK or white / UK taking coloureds from Africa into slavery in America. In short you are miles out of context. But I don't expect that to get beyond your fixed opinions. |
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Post by Dan Dare on May 22, 2023 10:02:37 GMT
The ancestors of some of the white people in attendance may well also have endured cruel treatment and horrendous conditions during the early stages of the industrial revolution. Yes, but that would be self inflicted by our own people, not based upon race. During the period in question the white working class were widely perceived by the bourgeoisie as forming a separate race, the more so if they were Irish. |
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Post by see2 on May 22, 2023 10:05:57 GMT
Yes, but that would be self inflicted by our own people, not based upon race. During the period in question the white working class were widely perceived by the bourgeoisie as forming a separate race, the more so if they were Irish. Maybe, but that doesn't alter the fact that it was done in our own country by our own people. I suspect the Irish thing is overplayed, could be wrong. |
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Post by Dan Dare on May 22, 2023 10:16:40 GMT
But, as I understand it, the proposed exclusion of white people from the audience for the event in question was not prompted by concerns about historical slavery but rather by the need to create a “safe, private” space and allow an “all-black-identifying audience” to explore race relations. "The director of Tambo & Bones, Matthew Xia, argued it was imperative the theatre “created a space” where black theatregoers could “explore complex, nuanced race-related issues”. He was backed by Sir Trevor Phillips, former chairman of the Equality and Human Rights Commission, who described it as “fine” and “lawful”. “If I’m around, I think I might go along to see how it works,” he said." www.thetimes.co.uk/article/london-theatres-black-only-night-faces-backlash-wk87rmcv0Slavery didn't appear on the agenda of the organisers until you added it. PS I searched for an article exploring this topic in the Guardian but didn't find one. Strange that, it's almost as if they're avoiding the subject. |
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Post by Bentley on May 22, 2023 10:17:14 GMT
Not true Slave markets flourished on the Barbary Coast of North Africa, in what is modern-day Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, and western Libya, between the 15th and middle of the 19th century. These markets prospered while the states were nominally under Ottoman suzerainty, though, in reality, they were mostly autonomous. The North African slave markets traded in European slaves which were acquired by Barbary pirates in slave raids on ships and by raids on coastal towns from Italy to Spain, Portugal, France, England, the Netherlands, and as far afield as the Turkish Abductions in Iceland. Men, women, and children were captured to such a devastating extent that vast numbers of sea coast towns were abandoned. According to Robert Davis, between 1 million and 1.25 million Europeans were captured by Barbary pirates and sold as slaves in North Africa and Ottoman Empire between the 15th and 19th centuries.[17][18] However, to extrapolate his numbers, Davis assumes the number of European slaves captured by Barbary pirates was constant for a 250-year period, stating: There are no records of how many men, women and children were enslaved, but it is possible to calculate roughly the number of fresh captives that would have been needed to keep populations steady and replace those slaves who died, escaped, were ransomed, or converted to Islam. On this basis it is thought that around 8,500 new slaves were needed annually to replenish numbers – about 850,000 captives over the century from 1580 to 1680. By extension, for the 250 years between 1530 and 1780, the figure could easily have been as high as 1,250,000."[19] WIKI. The Barbary coast? tell us something new. I have posted many comments on it, BUT IT HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the present discussion on coloured people in the UK or white / UK taking coloureds from Africa into slavery in America. In short you are miles out of context. But I don't expect that to get beyond your fixed opinions. You made a factually incorrect statement. White people have been victims of systematic slavery by Africans , possibly over a million . Your false claim has nothing to do with what you perceive as fixed opinions , it has everything to do with your claim being wrong . |
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Post by andrewbrown on May 22, 2023 10:26:49 GMT
Ah I see its seen as a revenge then. It’s a desperate attempt to justify racism against white people . I'm not trying to justify any racism. I'm AGAINST All racism of any form. I'm against the black only audience the same as I would be against a white only audience. I hope that's clear. |
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Post by Bentley on May 22, 2023 10:30:17 GMT
It’s a desperate attempt to justify racism against white people . I'm not trying to justify any racism. I'm AGAINST All racism of any form. I'm against the black only audience the same as I would be against a white only audience. I hope that's clear. When was that, about 1600 or so? It is nonsense like that statement that eggs on the black people and gives them a sense of grievance that doesn't help anyone, least of all them. YOU…”1970s. No blacks, Irish or dogs was commonplace.” You seem to be making excuses for it . |
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Post by see2 on May 22, 2023 10:36:28 GMT
But, as I understand it, the proposed exclusion of white people from the audience for the event in question was not prompted by concerns about historical slavery but rather by the need to create a “safe, private” space and allow an “all-black-identifying audience” to explore race relations. "The director of Tambo & Bones, Matthew Xia, argued it was imperative the theatre “created a space” where black theatregoers could “explore complex, nuanced race-related issues”. He was backed by Sir Trevor Phillips, former chairman of the Equality and Human Rights Commission, who described it as “fine” and “lawful”. “If I’m around, I think I might go along to see how it works,” he said." www.thetimes.co.uk/article/london-theatres-black-only-night-faces-backlash-wk87rmcv0Slavery didn't appear on the agenda of the organisers until you added it. PS I searched for an article exploring this topic in the Guardian but didn't find one. Strange that, it's almost as if they're avoiding the subject. One cannot dismiss the mental knowledge of slavery or the knock-on effects upon the way some people think, which IMO would have influenced a satirical by coloureds for coloureds especially in America. Which is where the show comes from. |
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Post by Dan Dare on May 22, 2023 10:45:34 GMT
Most blacks in London hail from Africa, not N.America, and will have no mental knowledge of slavery or its knock-on effects (unless their ancestors were enslaved by other Africans). You're offering a particularly thin and threadbare rationale for something you know would be immediately banned if a white theatre group tried it on.
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Post by see2 on May 22, 2023 10:47:33 GMT
The Barbary coast? tell us something new. I have posted many comments on it, BUT IT HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the present discussion on coloured people in the UK or white / UK taking coloureds from Africa into slavery in America. In short you are miles out of context. But I don't expect that to get beyond your fixed opinions. You made a factually incorrect statement. White people have been victims of systematic slavery by Africans , possibly over a million . Your false claim has nothing to do with what you perceive as fixed opinions , it has everything to do with your claim being wrong . The show is about a satirical by the descendants of coloured slaves in America now being shown in the UK. It is not about European slaves taken into Muslim slave markets. CONTEXT !It was factually correct in context, but your closed mind and fixed opinions rule you once again, and allow you to convince / delude yourself which you find quite easy to do. BYE. |
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Post by see2 on May 22, 2023 10:49:31 GMT
Most blacks in London hail from Africa, not N.America, and will have no mental knowledge of slavery or its knock-on effects (unless their ancestors were enslaved by other Africans). You're offering a particularly thin and threadbare rationale for something you know would be immediately banned if a white theatre group tried it on. I am not getting through to you, that is made obvious by your comments that misrepresent my posts. |
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Post by Bentley on May 22, 2023 10:50:13 GMT
You made a factually incorrect statement. White people have been victims of systematic slavery by Africans , possibly over a million . Your false claim has nothing to do with what you perceive as fixed opinions , it has everything to do with your claim being wrong . The show is about a satirical by the descendants of coloured slaves in America now being shown in the UK. It is not about European slaves taken into Muslim slave markets. CONTEXT !It was factually correct in context, but your closed mind and fixed opinions rule you once again, and allow you to convince / delude yourself which you find quite easy to do. BYE. You made a factuality incorrect statement and are trying to mitigate it with a plea that your incorrect statement is ok because its within context ? Durr..🙄 |
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