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Post by jonksy on Nov 12, 2024 20:44:03 GMT
Hmm, The Daily Mail again. Flat owners face £66,000 bill each for council’s new green heating....
The Telegraph....
The Times....
Climate Realists....
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Nov 12, 2024 20:46:30 GMT
This took me a couple of minutes to locate:
That should do the job.
It's for a European district heating grid baron , not a block of uk flats. the uk doesn't have district heating. Do you just randomly post gumpf passing it off as a solution? It's just a very large heat pump. That is what I think they are best off using. You can get a COP > 5 these days with domestic ones. An industrial one would likely improve on that further. It's economy of scale. |
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Post by jonksy on Nov 12, 2024 20:49:24 GMT
It's for a European district heating grid baron , not a block of uk flats. the uk doesn't have district heating. Do you just randomly post gumpf passing it off as a solution? It's just a very large heat pump. That is what I think they are best off using. You can get a COP > 5 these days with domestic ones. An industrial one would likely improve on that further. It's economy of scale. Or you could fit a small gas boiler in each flat in the knowledge that it would work Baron... |
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Post by see2 on Nov 12, 2024 20:56:21 GMT
Hmm, The Daily Mail again. Flat owners face £66,000 bill each for council’s new green heating....
The Telegraph....
The Times....
Climate Realists....
All three of your websites require 'cookies' so I won't be reading them because I refuse to give them access to my computer. The OP states the plan is not workable and has been scrapped. Facing up to something doesn't mean that something is inevitable. |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Nov 12, 2024 20:59:17 GMT
It's just a very large heat pump. That is what I think they are best off using. You can get a COP > 5 these days with domestic ones. An industrial one would likely improve on that further. It's economy of scale. Or you could fit a small gas boiler in each flat in the knowledge that it would work Baron... You could, but the fact you have 3000 all needing them and all next to one another, my intuition says, they could get a full on heat pump system for a lot cheaper than the conventional set up which runs to possible 20k for a 3 bed house. The pump alone can be over 10k, but it will pay back over time and eventuality be cheaper than installing gas. I expect the councillors are getting some backhanders though. I'd get the Germans in to sort it out. They are very good at this sort of thing. |
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Post by jonksy on Nov 12, 2024 21:02:51 GMT
Or you could fit a small gas boiler in each flat in the knowledge that it would work Baron... You could, but the fact you have 3000 all needing them and all next to one another, my intuition says, they could get a full on heat pump system for a lot cheaper than the conventional set up which runs to possible 20k for a 3 bed house. The pump alone can be over 10k, but it will pay back over time and eventuality be cheaper than installing gas. I expect the councillors are getting some backhanders though. I'd get the Germans in to sort it out. They are very good at this sort of thing. Why would they all need to be together? You just fit one to each flat.. These are not some hi rise apartment building in NY.... |
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Post by Red Rackham on Nov 12, 2024 21:10:33 GMT
All three of your websites require 'cookies' so I won't be reading them because I refuse to give them access to my computer. Wise, but you can remove cookies almost immediately.  |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Nov 12, 2024 22:12:47 GMT
You could, but the fact you have 3000 all needing them and all next to one another, my intuition says, they could get a full on heat pump system for a lot cheaper than the conventional set up which runs to possible 20k for a 3 bed house. The pump alone can be over 10k, but it will pay back over time and eventuality be cheaper than installing gas. I expect the councillors are getting some backhanders though. I'd get the Germans in to sort it out. They are very good at this sort of thing. Why would they all need to be together? You just fit one to each flat.. These are not some hi rise apartment building in NY.... It would be cheaper and quieter if you had one industrial one. I suggest you ask Siemens for the details since they seem to think it is better than thousands of individual units. You find with a lot of these devices, like say a small fridge or dehumidifier, that you get far worse energy efficiency. |
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Post by jonksy on Nov 12, 2024 23:09:17 GMT
Why would they all need to be together? You just fit one to each flat.. These are not some hi rise apartment building in NY.... It would be cheaper and quieter if you had one industrial one. I suggest you ask Siemens for the details since they seem to think it is better than thousands of individual units. You find with a lot of these devices, like say a small fridge or dehumidifier, that you get far worse energy efficiency. Heat pumps are fucking noisy Baron. Boilers are NOT.... |
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Post by thomas on Nov 13, 2024 8:46:47 GMT
It's for a European district heating grid baron , not a block of uk flats. the uk doesn't have district heating. Do you just randomly post gumpf passing it off as a solution? It's just a very large heat pump. That is what I think they are best off using. You can get a COP > 5 these days with domestic ones. An industrial one would likely improve on that further. It's economy of scale. district heating systems have been around Europe for nigh on a century. The uk has tried emulating district heating , but abandoned it uk wide because we have a mixed experience with it. In the uk , it's poorly performed , inefficient and extremely expensive. We have An abundance of natural resources that many European nations dont have , hence why we went down the oil coal and gas routes. Heat pumps work at much lower temperatures than our boilers , and our houses and flats lose too much heat. District heating in Scandinavian countries for example are monopolies run as not for profit unlike in the uk. There's a whole host of reasons baron why it doesn't work in the uk , so simply throwing off a heat pump as a solution without even reading up on the mass infrastructure needed and cost is a bit silly. There's no economy of scale to it. The costs would be completely off the board , and the idea struggling residents , never mind cash strapped councils or government are going to go down the expensive route especially in the current climate in the uk is fucking laughable. www.bioregional.com/news-and-opinion/why-cant-we-get-district-heating-right-in-the-uk. Do try and draw your eyes away from you tube for a second and actually read up on what you are gibbering about instead of tossing off simplistic solutions to complex problems. If it was as fucking easy and straight forward as throwing a heat pump at every block of flats and uk home to reach net zero , dont you think the current and past government would have done it.....or councils and homeowners? |
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Post by thomas on Nov 13, 2024 8:51:06 GMT
Hmm, The Daily Mail again. bore off see 2. Stop shooting the messenger. Would you prefer is we only used articles approved by labour hame? |
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Post by jonksy on Nov 13, 2024 8:51:26 GMT
It's just a very large heat pump. That is what I think they are best off using. You can get a COP > 5 these days with domestic ones. An industrial one would likely improve on that further. It's economy of scale. district heating systems have been around Europe for nigh on a century. The uk has tried emulating district heating , but abandoned it uk wide because we have a mixed experience with it. In the uk , it's poorly performed , inefficient and extremely expensive. We have An abundance of natural resources that many European nations dont have , hence why we went down the oil coal and gas routes. Heat pumps work at much lower temperatures than our boilers , and our houses and flats lose too much heat. District heating in Scandinavian countries for example are monopolies run as not for profit unlike in the uk. There's a whole host of reasons baron why it doesn't work in the uk , so simply throwing off a heat pump as a solution without even reading up on the mass infrastructure needed and cost is a bit silly. There's no economy of scale to it. The costs would be completely off the board , and the idea struggling residents , never mind cash strapped councils or government are going to go down the expensive route especially in the current climate in the uk is fucking laughable. www.bioregional.com/news-and-opinion/why-cant-we-get-district-heating-right-in-the-uk. Do try and draw your eyes away from you tube for a second and actually read up on what you are gibbering about instead of tossing off simplistic solutions to complex problems. If it was as fucking easy and straight forward as throwing a heat pump at every block of flats and uk home to reach net zero , dont you think the current and past government would have done it.....or councils and homeowners? It would cost under a couple of grand per flat to install a gas boiler and rads.. |
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Post by thomas on Nov 13, 2024 8:56:50 GMT
district heating systems have been around Europe for nigh on a century. The uk has tried emulating district heating , but abandoned it uk wide because we have a mixed experience with it. In the uk , it's poorly performed , inefficient and extremely expensive. We have An abundance of natural resources that many European nations dont have , hence why we went down the oil coal and gas routes. Heat pumps work at much lower temperatures than our boilers , and our houses and flats lose too much heat. District heating in Scandinavian countries for example are monopolies run as not for profit unlike in the uk. There's a whole host of reasons baron why it doesn't work in the uk , so simply throwing off a heat pump as a solution without even reading up on the mass infrastructure needed and cost is a bit silly. There's no economy of scale to it. The costs would be completely off the board , and the idea struggling residents , never mind cash strapped councils or government are going to go down the expensive route especially in the current climate in the uk is fucking laughable. www.bioregional.com/news-and-opinion/why-cant-we-get-district-heating-right-in-the-uk. Do try and draw your eyes away from you tube for a second and actually read up on what you are gibbering about instead of tossing off simplistic solutions to complex problems. If it was as fucking easy and straight forward as throwing a heat pump at every block of flats and uk home to reach net zero , dont you think the current and past government would have done it.....or councils and homeowners? It would cost under a couple of grand per flat to install a gas boiler and rads.. imagine some privatised district heating supplying heat via conduits to these flats via some centralised large heat pump source? I dread to think what the damage would be once everyone including government gets their cut , but I would imagine the cost to the flat residents would be fucking astronomical. |
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Post by Dan Dare on Nov 13, 2024 9:33:30 GMT
On the continent, where flat-dwelling is more the norm, you will hardly ever come across a block of flats where every apartment has its own heating equipment. The reason being of course that having a central system which heats the complete block makes better sense on so many levels. A big plus being only one gas line in the building rather than one for each flat. These days new builds are likely to have a central heat pump.
Individual metering is usually done by calorific meters attached to each radiator, the landlord reading them once a year and billing you accordingly. Again these days there are likely to be higher-tech solutions available which obviate the need for the meter-man to enter your apartment.
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Post by jonksy on Nov 13, 2024 9:58:13 GMT
On the continent, where flat-dwelling is more the norm, you will hardly ever come across a block of flats where every apartment has its own heating equipment. The reason being of course that having a central system which heats the complete block makes better sense on so many levels. A big plus being only one gas line in the building rather than one for each flat. These days new builds are likely to have a central heat pump. Individual metering is usually done by calorific meters attached to each radiator, the landlord reading them once a year and billing you accordingly. Again these days there are likely to be higher-tech solutions available which obviate the need for the meter-man to enter your apartment. Most US high rise apartments have a central heat and ac system on their roofs that is used for all the flats below. Theres nothing new about the system they have been using that since before the last world war. |
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