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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2022 11:22:06 GMT
Has see2 stopped squirming yet and named the wars where no lies were told? I think not. He probably thinks you are an extremist, along with most of the rest of us who disagree with him. An ideologically totalitarian mindset so typical of Blairites. Anyone who opposes them is seen as an extremist to be put down.
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Post by see2 on Dec 16, 2022 11:23:22 GMT
Stop making up lies about me. Such a plea would carry much more moral weight if you stopped making up lies about others. LIAR.
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Post by see2 on Dec 16, 2022 11:24:36 GMT
Has see2 stopped squirming yet and named the wars where no lies were told? I think not. He probably thinks you are an extremist, along with most of the rest of us who disagree with him. An ideologically totalitarian mindset so typical of Blairites. Anyone who opposes them is seen as an extremist to be put down. Are you claiming to be less extreme in your politics than Thatcher was in hers ?
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Post by sheepy on Dec 16, 2022 11:29:44 GMT
Has see2 stopped squirming yet and named the wars where no lies were told? I think not. He probably thinks you are an extremist, along with most of the rest of us who disagree with him. An ideologically totalitarian mindset so typical of Blairites. Anyone who opposes them is seen as an extremist to be put down. I don't much care what he thinks the squirming says it all, Labour central lying through its back teeth as usual and sending out morons to do its dirty work.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2022 11:38:45 GMT
Again an assumption based upon how you think things must have been because otherwise it does not compute or fit your assumptions. I never saw any examples of genuine antisemitism in my local party, though I did see one or two left wingers being falsely accused of it for being critical of Israel's behaviour in the west bank. Often the accusations were blatantly false, designed to make it impossible for the accused to stand for elected party positions. By the time they were exonerated, the elections were over. A favourite tactic was to quote parts of sentences out of context to make it appear falsely sinister at a stretch. One local Blairite councillor was notorious for spending far more time trawling the social media pages of his political enemies in the party than he ever spent attending to his council duties. Antisemitism might have existed amongst a relatively small minority of members in some parts of the country - it exists in other parties too - but I never encountered it locally. Which just lends credence to my suspicion that the extent of the problem has been exaggerated for dubious political motivations. To believe otherwise is to believe the lack of it in my local party was untypical. I have encountered antisemitism outside the party on the doorstep but not often. Never inside the party though.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2022 11:40:59 GMT
Such a plea would carry much more moral weight if you stopped making up lies about others. LIAR. You lied about me being an extremist for holding views that were once mainstream in your party, and without evidence you insinuated that I was an antisemite. That makes you the liar in my book.
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Post by totheleft3 on Dec 16, 2022 11:42:40 GMT
Where is your local labour party?
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Post by Toreador on Dec 16, 2022 11:48:17 GMT
Where is your local labour party? Intrusion alert!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2022 11:49:09 GMT
He probably thinks you are an extremist, along with most of the rest of us who disagree with him. An ideologically totalitarian mindset so typical of Blairites. Anyone who opposes them is seen as an extremist to be put down. Are you claiming to be less extreme in your politics than Thatcher was in hers ? My politics are of course vastly different from hers. But I an not claiming either of us are extremists. It is you throwing that lie around. I save that allegation for the genuine extremists who believe in some form of totalitarianism and oppose freedom and democracy and the rule of law. Extremists of note in the past hundred years have included Hitler, Stalin, Lenin, Trotsky, Mussolini, Mao, Pol Pot, Franco, Saddam Hussein, Ayatollah Khomeini, etc. People of that ilk. They demonstrate what real extremism is. It is not anyone who disagrees with Tony Blair, lol.
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Post by Toreador on Dec 16, 2022 11:50:13 GMT
The invasion was, according to the UN, legitimate and legal and within International Law. There are plenty of reasons to hate or to feel uncomfortable about the Iraq war, not least because events suggested that Bush was not really interested in 1441, his real interest was revenge for 9/11. However, Saddam Hussein made the invasion inevitable, all he had to do in order to avoid the invasion was to fully comply with UN Res 1441. 1441 included all the UN Resolutions on the need to comply with the Ceasefire agreement he signed in 1991 and which he had refused to comply with for 12 years. If you wish to put a bloggers opinion and insinuations over UN resolutions, that's prerogative. But to use it as a base for your accusation that I have no moral legitimacy is just pure bias on your part. It's that sort of strong bias that puts you as being as much of an extremist on the left as Thatcher was extremist on the Right. Both fall short of total extremism. Do you think that may have been due to the US withholding its UN contributions?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2022 11:56:33 GMT
Where is your local labour party? Being the Blairite that you are, and knowing how they tend to conduct themselves, I don't trust you with that information. You might via party contacts seek to discover my identity and then to make trouble for me in my real life. Such things have been known to happen before when people give too much away. It is sadly my experience that Labour centrists have no low to which they will not stoop when it comes to fighting the left. Apologies if that is not your intent but I do not intend to take the chance.
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Post by sheepy on Dec 16, 2022 11:58:35 GMT
Where is your local labour party? Being the Blairite that you are, and knowing how they tend to conduct themselves, I don't trust you with that information. You might via party contacts seek to discover my identity and then to make trouble for me in my real life. Such things have been known to happen before when people give too much away. It is sadly my experience that Labour centrists have no low to which they will not stoop when it comes to fighting the left. Apologies if that is not your intent but I do not intend to take the chance. That is one thing whatever anyone says about the Corbyn, he did get it under control somewhat when in the Blairs years he used them like a private army.
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Post by see2 on Dec 16, 2022 12:13:32 GMT
So not just one but two Blairite centrist twits are insisting upon calling me an extremist, as if I am on a par with Lenin, Stalin and Trotsky. And the fact is, which neither Blairite seems to get, is that my politics were once mainstream for decades in their own party, so calling that extreme is goalpost shifting on their part with dubious motivations in an attempt to establish a false narrative. When all dissent from the status quo is regarded as extreme by definition, that is very close to a totalitarian mindset. You have been compared to Thatcher, not Stalin or Trotsky. "my politics were once mainstream for decades" yes, based on old Labour, that's why the Tories have dominated parliament over the last 70 odd years. You have failed to grasp the significance of the sunshine and fresh air introduced by New Labour. Years in office since 1951: Old Labour. 11 years. New Labour. 13 years. Conservatives. 49 years. Even Thatcher was in office for as long as long Old Labour. It really doesn't appears to make any sense to press for Old Labour policies.
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Post by see2 on Dec 16, 2022 12:17:30 GMT
Where is your local labour party? Being the Blairite that you are, and knowing how they tend to conduct themselves, I don't trust you with that information. You might via party contacts seek to discover my identity and then to make trouble for me in my real life. Such things have been known to happen before when people give too much away. It is sadly my experience that Labour centrists have no low to which they will not stoop when it comes to fighting the left. Apologies if that is not your intent but I do not intend to take the chance. IIRC there was lots of action being taken at local level on getting rid of moderate Labour candidates during Corbyn's hay days.
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Post by see2 on Dec 16, 2022 12:25:52 GMT
You lied about me being an extremist for holding views that were once mainstream in your party, and without evidence you insinuated that I was an antisemite. That makes you the liar in my book. It makes you pretty dumb in my book. I have not accused you of being a far left extremist. Only that your position is the Lefts equivalent in extremism as was Thatcher's on the right. Do you agree that Thatcher's politics were extreme without her being a far right fascist?
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