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Post by sheepy on Jun 9, 2024 16:32:20 GMT
I just don't believe all this if only we could stay in the EU, we can change it from within, I personally think the problems created by and via the EU are terminal.
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Post by see2 on Jun 9, 2024 17:23:15 GMT
The longstanding effort to keep extremist forces out of government in Europe is officially over. For decades, political parties of all kinds joined forces to keep the hard-right far from the levers of power. Today, this strategy — known in France as a cordon sanitaire (or firewall) — is falling apart, as populist and nationalist parties grow in strength across the Continent. Six EU countries — Italy, Finland, Slovakia, Hungary, Croatia and the Czech Republic — have hard-right parties in government. In Sweden, the survival of the executive relies on a confidence and supply agreement with the nationalist Sweden Democrats, the second-largest force in parliament. In the Netherlands, the anti-Islamic firebrand Geert Wilders is on the verge of power, having sealed a historic deal to form the most right-wing government in recent Dutch history Meanwhile, hard-right parties are dominating the polls across much of Europe. In France, far-right leader Marine Le Pen’s National Rally is cruising at over 30 percent, far ahead of President Emmanuel Macron’s Renaissance party, according to POLITICO’s Poll of Polls. Across the Rhine, Alternative for Germany, a party under police surveillance for its extremist views, is polling second, head-to-head with the Social Democrats. As we approach next month’s European Parliament election, these parties may use their momentum to form a powerful political bloc — if they can maintain their unity. www.politico.eu/article/mapped-europe-far-right-government-power-politics-eu-italy-finalnd-hungary-parties-elections-polling/What did the unelected presidents and commissioners expect? You can ignore some of the people some of the time, but if you ignore the majority of people all the time you must expect consequences. This is the problem with the unelected Brussels elite, they are arrogant, they look down their nose at anyone who disagrees with their globalist agenda, and dismiss them as 'far right extremists'. Well now, hopefully, their pigeons are comming home to roost. Back in 2016 I posted my major concern over the EU, which was that it could be taken over by Right wing politicians. I still hope there are enough sensible people in the EU to stop the Ideas of the EU being destroyed by Right-Wing politics.
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Post by wapentake on Jun 9, 2024 17:45:50 GMT
The longstanding effort to keep extremist forces out of government in Europe is officially over. For decades, political parties of all kinds joined forces to keep the hard-right far from the levers of power. Today, this strategy — known in France as a cordon sanitaire (or firewall) — is falling apart, as populist and nationalist parties grow in strength across the Continent. Six EU countries — Italy, Finland, Slovakia, Hungary, Croatia and the Czech Republic — have hard-right parties in government. In Sweden, the survival of the executive relies on a confidence and supply agreement with the nationalist Sweden Democrats, the second-largest force in parliament. In the Netherlands, the anti-Islamic firebrand Geert Wilders is on the verge of power, having sealed a historic deal to form the most right-wing government in recent Dutch history Meanwhile, hard-right parties are dominating the polls across much of Europe. In France, far-right leader Marine Le Pen’s National Rally is cruising at over 30 percent, far ahead of President Emmanuel Macron’s Renaissance party, according to POLITICO’s Poll of Polls. Across the Rhine, Alternative for Germany, a party under police surveillance for its extremist views, is polling second, head-to-head with the Social Democrats. As we approach next month’s European Parliament election, these parties may use their momentum to form a powerful political bloc — if they can maintain their unity. www.politico.eu/article/mapped-europe-far-right-government-power-politics-eu-italy-finalnd-hungary-parties-elections-polling/What did the unelected presidents and commissioners expect? You can ignore some of the people some of the time, but if you ignore the majority of people all the time you must expect consequences. This is the problem with the unelected Brussels elite, they are arrogant, they look down their nose at anyone who disagrees with their globalist agenda, and dismiss them as 'far right extremists'. Well now, hopefully, their pigeons are comming home to roost. Back in 2016 I posted my major concern over the EU, which was that it could be taken over by Right wing politicians. I still hope there are enough sensible people in the EU to stop the Ideas of the EU being destroyed by Right-Wing politics. Not a chance see2 the die has been cast, the paralysis of the politicians in the face of mass migration has seen to that also their inability to see what’s happening in the wider world whilst they dreamed of their political union. And what's happening? the rise of AFD and others who admire Putin if people aren’t alarmed by that they should be but they and this has all come to pass because of people like Merkel,Blair and the apparatchik in Brussels.
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Post by Dan Dare on Jun 9, 2024 18:27:24 GMT
I just don't believe all this if only we could stay in the EU, we can change it from within, I personally think the problems created by and via the EU are terminal. I don't think Britain on its own had any realistic prospect of accomplishing that, but with allies in the EU-15 it could have done it. Unfortunately by the time the UK got around to even proposing reform - in the run-up to Brexit - it was very much an isolated outsider since many years of 'antics' had alienated all its potential allies, and the reforms it proposed were of relevance only to Tory politicians who were trying to fend off the Farageists and completely failed to embrace the bigger picture.
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Post by see2 on Jun 9, 2024 20:18:24 GMT
Back in 2016 I posted my major concern over the EU, which was that it could be taken over by Right wing politicians. I still hope there are enough sensible people in the EU to stop the Ideas of the EU being destroyed by Right-Wing politics. Not a chance see2 the die has been cast, the paralysis of the politicians in the face of mass migration has seen to that also their inability to see what’s happening in the wider world whilst they dreamed of their political union. And what's happening? the rise of AFD and others who admire Putin if people aren’t alarmed by that they should be but they and this has all come to pass because of people like Merkel,Blair and the apparatchik in Brussels. Yes they do tend to do things according to the laws they sign up to. Righties might ignore such laws, but they are also liable to ignore laws that no decent individual want to ignore. Nothing stops them seeing that which is going on in the wider world, wherever did you get that idea from? The rise of the AFD, like all other moves to the right is the product of excessive but legal migration and slow moving economic movement across the world. It follows perhaps to a lesser extent, the reality that Germany already in economic trouble in the 1920s, gave Hitler the push into power on the back of the 1930s Depression. Typically, Righties slide out of the woodwork when difficulties appear. It is totally untrue to blame "Merkel, Blair and the apparatchik in Brussels" for those problems, that is just unprovable political nonsense.
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Post by wapentake on Jun 9, 2024 20:52:49 GMT
Not a chance see2 the die has been cast, the paralysis of the politicians in the face of mass migration has seen to that also their inability to see what’s happening in the wider world whilst they dreamed of their political union. And what's happening? the rise of AFD and others who admire Putin if people aren’t alarmed by that they should be but they and this has all come to pass because of people like Merkel,Blair and the apparatchik in Brussels. Yes they do tend to do things according to the laws they sign up to. Righties might ignore such laws, but they are also liable to ignore laws that no decent individual want to ignore. Nothing stops them seeing that which is going on in the wider world, wherever did you get that idea from? The rise of the AFD, like all other moves to the right is the product of excessive but legal migration and slow moving economic movement across the world. It follows perhaps to a lesser extent, the reality that Germany already in economic trouble in the 1920s, gave Hitler the push into power on the back of the 1930s Depression. Typically, Righties slide out of the woodwork when difficulties appear. It is totally untrue to blame "Merkel, Blair and the apparatchik in Brussels" for those problems, that is just unprovable politicalOn the contrary if you continue to fail to listen to ordinary peoples concerns as they have done then sh** will happen,as for it being legal migration causing the problem who do you think all those people the other side of the channel wanting to jump in to a dinghy are?
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Post by Red Rackham on Jun 10, 2024 8:06:53 GMT
Back in 2016 I posted my major concern over the EU, which was that it could be taken over by Right wing politicians. I still hope there are enough sensible people in the EU to stop the Ideas of the EU being destroyed by Right-Wing politics. Why do you think right wing parties are gaining ground across Europe?
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Post by Red Rackham on Jun 10, 2024 8:10:53 GMT
You stubbornly refuse to accept the fact, and it is a fact, that the EU impose fines of €250,000 per migrant for EU states that refuse EU imposed migrant quotas. See previous links provided. That was a proposal from 2016 - never fully implemented. The actually implemented fine is €20,000 - LINK
All The Best LOL, ahh right, that's OK then.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2024 9:58:30 GMT
Not a chance see2 the die has been cast, the paralysis of the politicians in the face of mass migration has seen to that also their inability to see what’s happening in the wider world whilst they dreamed of their political union. And what's happening? the rise of AFD and others who admire Putin if people aren’t alarmed by that they should be but they and this has all come to pass because of people like Merkel,Blair and the apparatchik in Brussels. Yes they do tend to do things according to the laws they sign up to. Righties might ignore such laws, but they are also liable to ignore laws that no decent individual want to ignore. Nothing stops them seeing that which is going on in the wider world, wherever did you get that idea from? The rise of the AFD, like all other moves to the right is the product of excessive but legal migration and slow moving economic movement across the world. It follows perhaps to a lesser extent, the reality that Germany already in economic trouble in the 1920s, gave Hitler the push into power on the back of the 1930s Depression. Typically, Righties slide out of the woodwork when difficulties appear. It is totally untrue to blame "Merkel, Blair and the apparatchik in Brussels" for those problems, that is just unprovable political nonsense. It is totally true to blame "Merkel, Blair and the apparatchik in Brussels" for those problems. Fixed it for you. How are Macron, Merkel and Blair getting on, now?
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Post by ProVeritas on Jun 10, 2024 17:16:06 GMT
That was a proposal from 2016 - never fully implemented. The actually implemented fine is €20,000 - LINK
All The Best LOL, ahh right, that's OK then. No, its not OK at all. Sovereign nations should have full control over who they allow or don't allow in to their territory. But it is also not OK to build an argument upon a demonstrably false premise. All The Best
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Post by Red Rackham on Jun 10, 2024 17:41:02 GMT
No, its not OK at all. Sovereign nations should have full control over who they allow or don't allow in to their territory. It is also not OK to build an argument upon a demonstrably false premise. All The Best We are in complete agreement. Sovereign nations should indeed have control over who they allow into their country, and unless they're in the EU, they do. You see many years ago, 1964 I believe, the EU realised that 'sovereign' nation states may threaten the supremacy of EU law and that would never do. Therefore the EU decided, even though the EU is not sovereign or indeed a nation state, that EU law is supreme and has precedence over national laws in member states (See Primacy of EU Law) Which is why member states of the EU are not sovereign states. Getting back to the origional point, the unelected EU commission are defacto masters of the EU, and the EU issue huge fines to member states who refuse to accept EU migrant quotas. Here to help.
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Post by Vinny on Jun 10, 2024 22:26:29 GMT
The Commission and Parliament. From what I see there is overwhelming consensus for the goal of ever closer union - and, at no point in the last 50 years, has that goal been rejected. You forgot the European Council whose members are democratically elected by the 440 million and who, when push comes to shove, are really in charge of the entire show.
They are elected on domestic issues not EU issues. Next. Blair was once on that council, did you see what happened to him at every EU election his party contested whilst he was PM? He lost every fucking EU election. Gordon Brown who succeeded him lost in 1999 too. What mandate does someone have at the EU if they fucking lose the EU election? See what's happening in France right now with Macron now he's lost their EU election.
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Post by Vinny on Jun 10, 2024 22:29:57 GMT
You stubbornly refuse to accept the fact, and it is a fact, that the EU impose fines of €250,000 per migrant for EU states that refuse EU imposed migrant quotas. See previous links provided. That was a proposal from 2016 - never fully implemented. The actually implemented fine is €20,000 - LINK
All The Best 1.265 million illegal immigrants were recognised as having arrived in the EU in 2023. So, the fines would have been €25,300,000,000.
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Post by Vinny on Jun 10, 2024 22:31:37 GMT
No, its not OK at all. Sovereign nations should have full control over who they allow or don't allow in to their territory. It is also not OK to build an argument upon a demonstrably false premise. All The Best We are in complete agreement. Sovereign nations should indeed have control over who they allow into their country, and unless they're in the EU, they do. You see many years ago, 1964 I believe, the EU realised that 'sovereign' nation states may threaten the supremacy of EU law and that would never do. Therefore the EU decided, even though the EU is not sovereign or indeed a nation state, that EU law is supreme and has precedence over national laws in member states (See Primacy of EU Law) Which is why member states of the EU are not sovereign states. Getting back to the origional point, the unelected EU commission are defacto masters of the EU, and the EU issue huge fines to member states who refuse to accept EU migrant quotas. Here to help. Ahem, the EU didn't exist until 1993, the EEC existed in 1964. I'm a pedantic git at times.
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Post by see2 on Jun 11, 2024 13:07:39 GMT
Yes they do tend to do things according to the laws they sign up to. Righties might ignore such laws, but they are also liable to ignore laws that no decent individual want to ignore. Nothing stops them seeing that which is going on in the wider world, wherever did you get that idea from? The rise of the AFD, like all other moves to the right is the product of excessive but legal migration and slow moving economic movement across the world. It follows perhaps to a lesser extent, the reality that Germany already in economic trouble in the 1920s, gave Hitler the push into power on the back of the 1930s Depression. Typically, Righties slide out of the woodwork when difficulties appear. It is totally untrue to blame "Merkel, Blair and the apparatchik in Brussels" for those problems, that is just unprovable politicalOn the contrary if you continue to fail to listen to ordinary peoples concerns as they have done then sh** will happen,as for it being legal migration causing the problem who do you think all those people the other side of the channel wanting to jump in to a dinghy are? This shit is happening because the leaders are hog tied by the ECHR. Many people have called for leaving the ECHR and many others like myself have favoured changes be made. But it appears to be the case that the ramifications of such a moves could lead to more dangerous and damaging events in the world. Like encouraging dictators and extremists. They claim to be asylum seekers and as such the law state that they should be given asylum. So at least put the blame where it belongs.
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