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Post by Pacifico on Jun 19, 2024 17:04:48 GMT
The Tories were like every other Party in Parliament - they consisted of a majority of MP's who wanted to remain in the EU and would rather fight to ignore the referendum than find a good leaving deal. FFS even the LibDems voted against remaining in the Single Market - that is how bonkers Parliament was at the time. Then let no one blame the opposition government for the problems on leaving, blame the divided nation. Even Farage said he would not accept such a narrow loss if Brexit had failed.And? - you think he would be more effective at getting a second run at a referendum than the Tory wets, the LibDems or Keir Starmer? |
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Post by Pacifico on Jun 19, 2024 17:14:14 GMT
Younger generations today have different attitudes, a different oulook on life, they are more internationalist and less prejudiced, more accepting and more tolerant. You almost seem to be implying that this forum is full of old men who don't like darkies in their local Tesco. Quite frankly I'd agree. The problem is that these people think that they represent everyone, when they don't. I'd say they represent the majority - it's you that is in a minority. |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Jun 19, 2024 17:17:16 GMT
Bollocks, Nulla. You talk as if Human Rights didn't exist before Blair, and that's nonsense. What has Blair got to do with the ECHR? The UK ratified the ECHR in 1951, nearly a half-century BEFORE Blair came to power! Furthermore, I never even mentioned Blair. Seems it is not me who is talking bollocks; you need to look in a mirror. All The Best Ahem: ...The real reason Farage wants out of the ECHR is because it erodes worker's rights, like a right to holiday pay, maternity leave etc, which also increases profit margins without the need to invest in improving goods and services... None of which has anything to do with the ECHR of 1951. So it seems that it is you who's talking bollocks as usual, Nulla. |
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Post by andrewbrown on Jun 19, 2024 17:27:36 GMT
You almost seem to be implying that this forum is full of old men who don't like darkies in their local Tesco. Quite frankly I'd agree. The problem is that these people think that they represent everyone, when they don't. I'd say they represent the majority - it's you that is in a minority. Of course possible, but how do you know that? |
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Post by Pacifico on Jun 19, 2024 17:29:28 GMT
I'd say they represent the majority - it's you that is in a minority. Of course possible, but how do you know that? There is no majority for joining the EU. Which seems to be a the majority view on this forum |
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Post by andrewbrown on Jun 19, 2024 17:37:12 GMT
Of course possible, but how do you know that? There is no majority for joining the EU. Which seems to be a the majority view on this forum I don’t know, as the question hasn't been asked, but that wasn't what I said. Are you confusing regulatory alignment with joining the EU? To be clear, do I think we are going to rejoin the EU in this parliament? No. Do I think we could have more alignment of regulations to improve trade? Possible and desirable. |
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Post by Pacifico on Jun 19, 2024 17:41:12 GMT
There is no majority for joining the EU. Which seems to be a the majority view on this forum I don’t know, as the question hasn't been asked, but that wasn't what I said. Are you confusing regulatory alignment with joining the EU? To be clear, do I think we are going to rejoin the EU in this parliament? No. Do I think we could have more alignment of regulations to improve trade? Possible and desirable. There has been no poll that puts joining the EU in a majority. With regards to aligning regulations of course that is possible - although a tad harder in practice than some of its advocates expect. |
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Post by Dogburger on Jun 19, 2024 18:26:37 GMT
And as I keep saying which nobody on the pro EU side has ever answered is that the wrong question is being asked . It doesn't matter if people think we were wrong to leave the EU ,it doesn't matter if 100% of people think that way . What is going to matter is when and if the time comes what will you be voting to join and under what conditions ? In say 10 years time the EU is going to look a lot different to the one we thankfully left . Who in their right mind is going to vote to give up our currency , our foreign policy , be forced to take immigration quotas ,a return of cheap foreign labour this time likely from the Baltics , Ukraine ,Moldova and so on . No rebate , less fishing quotas ect . I think you are going to need one hell of a salesman That's true, but doesn't one follow the other? We had the referendum in 2016 as a result of public pressure. Couldn't that same public pressure leas to another referendum? No I don't think it does follow .Pressure from re-join would be quickly extinguished by the fact that any UK government would have to have the terms and conditions agreed with the EU before it put the vote to the electorate .Those terms and conditions I don't think would be acceptable even to the Lib Dems . |
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Post by jonksy on Jun 19, 2024 19:17:35 GMT
Many are yet to be convinced Labour will pull this off. They don't trust the rigged Polls and the momentum is with Farage. People have had enough of lies, and enough of zero action against illegals and criminals. Time for change. Time for Reform. Nigel Farage could finally become an MP by winning Clacton with an 'unprecedented' swing from Tories - but poll shows voters prefer ALL the other party leaders and 55% say Reform chief would be a bad PM...... www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13547465/Nigel-Farage-Clacton-Tories-election.html |
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Post by andrewbrown on Jun 19, 2024 20:20:39 GMT
I don’t know, as the question hasn't been asked, but that wasn't what I said. Are you confusing regulatory alignment with joining the EU? To be clear, do I think we are going to rejoin the EU in this parliament? No. Do I think we could have more alignment of regulations to improve trade? Possible and desirable. There has been no poll that puts joining the EU in a majority. With regards to aligning regulations of course that is possible - although a tad harder in practice than some of its advocates expect. You're still talking about rejoining the EU, when I didn't say that. This polling from last year is more along the lines of the plausible. www.reuters.com/world/uk/majority-britons-support-rejoining-eu-single-market-poll-2023-11-29/ |
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Post by Pacifico on Jun 19, 2024 21:33:48 GMT
But those polls are nonsense - they are asking if you want to rejoin based on the agreement we had before which is no longer on the table. If you ask the same question but include the current rules for joining the EU every poll says no thanks. Labours ideas about regulatory alignment are rather more difficult than you seem to think. The EU have no interest in reopening the existing agreement and unilaterally implementing dynamic alignment is of trivial help to the UK. At some point people are going to have to accept we have left - and work from there. |
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Post by sheepy on Jun 20, 2024 7:06:23 GMT
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Post by ProVeritas on Jun 20, 2024 19:45:43 GMT
I genuinely do wish every poster here all the best, even the ones I vehemently disagree with. There is not a single person here who I regularly engage with who, if we were in the same pub, I would not buy a drink for. You see grown-ups can separate a "difference of opinion on a forum" from "actual hatred in the real world". All The Best , I would find such a person to be an embarrassment to try to hold a conversation with. A good job your friends don't feel the same, eh? Or you'd be billy-no-mates. All The Best |
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Post by ProVeritas on Jun 20, 2024 19:47:24 GMT
What has Blair got to do with the ECHR? The UK ratified the ECHR in 1951, nearly a half-century BEFORE Blair came to power! Furthermore, I never even mentioned Blair. Seems it is not me who is talking bollocks; you need to look in a mirror. All The Best Ahem: ...The real reason Farage wants out of the ECHR is because it erodes worker's rights, like a right to holiday pay, maternity leave etc, which also increases profit margins without the need to invest in improving goods and services... None of which has anything to do with the ECHR of 1951. So it seems that it is you who's talking bollocks as usual, Nulla. Actually all of those are enshrined in the ECHR. Do you actually ever know what it is you are talking about. All The Best |
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Post by Pacifico on Jun 20, 2024 20:57:29 GMT
Countries around the globe that are not in ECHR also have workers rights
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