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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2024 14:48:23 GMT
Do any of you Tory supporters have anything to say about the Tories? All I see is you trying to downplay Labour. There has been plenty of story supporters ‘ downplaying ‘ the Tories . You need to look harder . I doubt you'll find many supporters of this Tory government. Labour's supreme leader is being handed the torch voluntarily by the lying lefty Tory leader. The last I heard Sunak was hiding in his cave. I think people accept that Starmer is to be the first person to win an election without having to convince anyone of anything. It's such a sham that even the illusion of democracy will crumble, which as far as I'm concerned is a good thing |
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Post by Bentley on May 27, 2024 14:57:28 GMT
There has been plenty of story supporters ‘ downplaying ‘ the Tories . You need to look harder . I'm sure there are, most of the country tbh. But that wasn't my question. My apologies. My autocorrect says ‘ story’ and I meant ‘ Tory’. Your question was “ Do any of you Tory supporters have anything to say about the Tories?“ My answer is ..there has been plenty of Tory supporters’ downplaying ‘ the Tories …on here . You need to look harder. |
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Post by Red Rackham on May 27, 2024 15:06:49 GMT
You conveniently ignore my reckoning that Starmer judged Corbyn's rapid rise in popularity to be a possible vehicle for Labour to regain power. Supporting the party leader while electioneering is hardly a capital offence — especially if there's a chance of gaining power (a Johnson tactic, if I recall correctly).
Starmer changed his views of Corbyn's usefulness after voters' thumping rejection of Corbyn.
I'm not convinced that Starmer as a non-student adult (say since aged 25), was ever a fully "left wing socialist". Did Starmer ever voice those Corbyn views you cite...? That ^ is mostly your opinion, not fact. Apart from one point; You claim to be unconvinced that Starmer ever was, a left wing socialist. You are obviously unaware that Starmer was not only a member of, but the secretary of the Haldane Society of Socialist Lawyers. I say again, anyone who thinks Starmer is not a left wing socialist, is not paying attention. |
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Post by zanygame on May 27, 2024 15:09:12 GMT
I'm sure there are, most of the country tbh. But that wasn't my question. My apologies. My autocorrect says ‘ story’ and I meant ‘ Tory’. Your question was “ Do any of you Tory supporters have anything to say about the Tories?“ My answer is ..there has been plenty of Tory supporters’ downplaying ‘ the Tories …on here . You need to look harder. Tory supporters down playing the Tories. Isn't that an anathema? Can you be a supporter that doesn't support? Anyway, The right wing think the Tories are lefties. The Lefties think they look after the rich. Hard to imagine how they managed to make both sides despise them. |
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Post by Red Rackham on May 27, 2024 15:10:52 GMT
Pillock. In the biggest democratic vote in British political history the majority voted to leave the EU. Starmer then spent two or three years desperately trying to overturn that vote, and in 2023 he said if Labour are elected he would "rewrite Brexit" and "seek a closer relationship with the EU". I think the majority who voted for Brexit have every reason to be very worried at the prospect of a pro EU Labour government. Unlike the Tory Pro EU Government? Well yes indeed, I agree the Tories have not exactly promoted Brexit. On the other hand, they haven't pledged to accept EU migrant quotas, have an illegal immigrant amnesty, or to have closer relations with the EU. So on this point, I think the Tories are ahead. |
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Post by zanygame on May 27, 2024 15:13:02 GMT
You conveniently ignore my reckoning that Starmer judged Corbyn's rapid rise in popularity to be a possible vehicle for Labour to regain power. Supporting the party leader while electioneering is hardly a capital offence — especially if there's a chance of gaining power (a Johnson tactic, if I recall correctly).
Starmer changed his views of Corbyn's usefulness after voters' thumping rejection of Corbyn.
I'm not convinced that Starmer as a non-student adult (say since aged 25), was ever a fully "left wing socialist". Did Starmer ever voice those Corbyn views you cite...? That ^ is mostly your opinion, not fact. Apart from one point; You claim to be unconvinced that Starmer ever was, a left wing socialist. You are obviously unaware that Starmer was not only a member of, but the secretary of the Haldane Society of Socialist Lawyers. I say again, anyone who thinks Starmer is not a left wing socialist, is not paying attention. He is left wing, just not as far left as Corbyn. Left of centre. |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on May 27, 2024 15:17:08 GMT
That's obviously true and borne out by history — time and again the silent majority UK electorate has shown that it is mostly conservative. Corbyn was an aberration (as was Truss) and Starmer's rapid realisation — after Labour's record trouncing — that the growing anti-Semitism and Left pro-terrorist stances of Corbynism would not allow it to gain power before reforming, I consider to his credit. I don't see that Starmer, returning the Labour Party to the values most of the electorate can be comfortable with, is anything for any balanced citizen to worry about. Hopefully, Corbyn is now as relevant as Galloway. My preferred scenario is Labour in for two terms, while the Tories ditch their dalliances with the Far Right, and regain their One Nation outlook and plan how to grow and maintain the country's health and wealth of its residents once it regains power. Fingers crossed the Tories are not in for a Canadian-style wipe-out... You are of course, conveniently perhaps, forgetting that Starmer supported and promoted Corbyns left wing agenda. Indeed if you have a moment... Corbyn said amongst other things: a) It would be wonderful if the UK abolished the armed forces. b) He would abolish the UK nuclear deterrent. c) He would pull the UK out of NATO. d) He said NATO should 'close down'. e) He described the terrorist organisations of Hamas and Hezbollah as his friends. f) He voted against every single peice of anti terror legislation, and bragged about it. Ans as I said, Starmer fully supported Corbyn, indeed in a 2019 BBC interview Starmer said, and I quote "Jeremy Corbyn would make a great prime minister". However, we are supposed to forget all that. We are supposed to believe that Starmer has changed, that he is no longer a lifelong left wing socialist. Call me a doubting Thomas, but anyone who thinks Starmer is no longer a left wing socialist is not paying attention. Excellent point.
Starmer is not to be trusted.
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Post by zanygame on May 27, 2024 15:18:26 GMT
Unlike the Tory Pro EU Government? Well yes indeed, I agree the Tories have not exactly promoted Brexit. On the other hand, they haven't pledged to accept EU migrant quotas, have an illegal immigrant amnesty, or to have closer relations with the EU. So on this point, I think the Tories are ahead. But they have let thousands of illegal immigrants stay here for years unchecked and disappear into the woodwork. And they do let foreign students stay on for another two years after they graduate to find jobs here. And only in January 2024 did they stop them bringing their families to "study" with them. Oh and Cameron was offered a moratorium on FoM, but chose not to take it. |
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Post by Bentley on May 27, 2024 15:21:31 GMT
My apologies. My autocorrect says ‘ story’ and I meant ‘ Tory’. Your question was “ Do any of you Tory supporters have anything to say about the Tories?“ My answer is ..there has been plenty of Tory supporters’ downplaying ‘ the Tories …on here . You need to look harder. Tory supporters down playing the Tories. Isn't that an anathema? Can you be a supporter that doesn't support? Anyway, The right wing think the Tories are lefties. The Lefties think they look after the rich. Hard to imagine how they managed to make both sides despise them. Of course it isnt an anathema . Tories on here are downplaying the Tory leadership . |
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Post by Red Rackham on May 27, 2024 15:24:18 GMT
Well yes indeed, I agree the Tories have not exactly promoted Brexit. On the other hand, they haven't pledged to accept EU migrant quotas, have an illegal immigrant amnesty, or to have closer relations with the EU. So on this point, I think the Tories are ahead. But they have let thousands of illegal immigrants stay here for years unchecked and disappear into the woodwork. And they do let foreign students stay on for another two years after they graduate to find jobs here. And only in January 2024 did they stop them bringing their families to "study" with them. Oh and Cameron was offered a moratorium on FoM, but chose not to take it. Oh indeed, the Tories record on immigration illegal or otherwise is shameful. But, considering Starmer has pledged to... a) Accept EU migrant quotas. b) Hold an illegal migrant amnesty. c) Have closer relations with the EU. Do you envisage immigration illegal or otherwise will be better or worse under a pro EU Labour government?.. |
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Post by zanygame on May 27, 2024 15:46:24 GMT
But they have let thousands of illegal immigrants stay here for years unchecked and disappear into the woodwork. And they do let foreign students stay on for another two years after they graduate to find jobs here. And only in January 2024 did they stop them bringing their families to "study" with them. Oh and Cameron was offered a moratorium on FoM, but chose not to take it. Oh indeed, the Tories record on immigration illegal or otherwise is shameful. But, considering Starmer has pledged to... a) Accept EU migrant quotas. b) Hold an illegal migrant amnesty. c) Have closer relations with the EU. Do you envisage immigration illegal or otherwise will be better or worse under a pro EU Labour government?.. Yes but you forget Labour were processing asylum seekers far faster. And is an amnesty any worse than just pretending they aren't here. |
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Post by Red Rackham on May 27, 2024 15:59:07 GMT
Oh indeed, the Tories record on immigration illegal or otherwise is shameful. But, considering Starmer has pledged to... a) Accept EU migrant quotas. b) Hold an illegal migrant amnesty. c) Have closer relations with the EU. Do you envisage immigration illegal or otherwise will be better or worse under a pro EU Labour government?.. Yes but you forget Labour were processing asylum seekers far faster. And is an amnesty any worse than just pretending they aren't here. What do you mean when you say 'Labour were processing asylum claims faster'? When are you talking about. An amnesty is another way of the government giving up. Amnesties do nothing other than to send out a green light to illegals who aren't already here. Look at the Spanish experience. They have had several amnesties all of which were supposedly to clear up 'asylum' backlogs, but the backlogs just got bigger and bigger because as soon as illegals know there's even the suggestion of an amnesty they all head for that country. ZG, appeasment does not work, never has never will. |
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Post by om15 on May 27, 2024 17:12:25 GMT
This public service film clip may help the undecided voter,
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Post by Red Rackham on May 27, 2024 17:16:09 GMT
Hahaaaaaaaaaaaaa superb. Excellent clip om 15.
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Post by patman post on May 27, 2024 17:39:00 GMT
That's obviously true and borne out by history — time and again the silent majority UK electorate has shown that it is mostly conservative.
Corbyn was an aberration (as was Truss) and Starmer's rapid realisation — after Labour's record trouncing — that the growing anti-Semitism and Left pro-terrorist stances of Corbynism would not allow it to gain power before reforming, I consider to his credit.
I don't see that Starmer, returning the Labour Party to the values most of the electorate can be comfortable with, is anything for any balanced citizen to worry about. Hopefully, Corbyn is now as relevant as Galloway.
My preferred scenario is Labour in for two terms, while the Tories ditch their dalliances with the Far Right, and regain their One Nation outlook and plan how to grow and maintain the country's health and wealth of its residents once it regains power.
Fingers crossed the Tories are not in for a Canadian-style wipe-out...
Trouble is the extreme left and right are more active and make more noise, thus they appear to represent a larger audience. Have you ever met one who thinks their views are a minority? To be honest, I think both extremes just make more noise. The bulk of the population and voters are usually sat firmly in the middle. I'm hoping that'll be the case on July 4, with a slight overbalancing to the Left, just to get this lot of Johnson/Farage contaminated parliamentarians out of office... |
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