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Post by thomas on Jan 28, 2024 13:52:28 GMT
welsh labour are simply the British Labour Party in Wales. We know this , as a succession of Scottish labour leaders , from Wendy Alexander , kezia dug dale , Johann Lamont etc etc have all complained they are not free to set devolved policy , and that they are informed from London of policy which they then have to implement. Johan Lamont even complained one of her aides was sacked by London without her knowledge or approval. So of course labour in Wales is a blueprint for labour in scotland and England. They are one and the same party , with the head of the party in London. So as I said , what a stupid fucking comment. Must try harder see 2. But you haven't even started to try. --"The Senedd, officially known as the Welsh Parliament in English and Senedd Cymru in Welsh, is the devolved, unicameral legislature of Wales. A democratically elected body, it makes laws for Wales, agrees to certain taxes, and scrutinises the Welsh Government. It is a bilingual institution, with both Welsh and English being the official languages of its business. From its creation in May 1999 until May 2020, the Senedd was known as the National Assembly for Wales. The Queen officially (re)opened the Senedd in 2021. The Welsh Government is the devolved government of Wales. The government consists of ministers and deputy ministers. It is led by the first minister, usually the leader of the largest party in the Senedd, who selects ministers and deputy ministers with the approval of the Senedd. The government is responsible for tabling policy in devolved areas for consideration by the Senedd and implementing policy that has been approved by it. I dont need to try see 2. After nearly a quarter of a century of devolution , it seems you have finally discovered the welsh parliament. That's nice. Now how does your discovering the devolved welsh parliament contradict what I wrote in my earlier post? Are you unaware that drake ford in Wales( or whoever his successor now is) and sardar in scotland , are what people mock as labour branch managers , because as I said in my earlier post they take orders from their boss in London? |
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Post by thomas on Jan 28, 2024 13:54:53 GMT
welsh labour are simply the British Labour Party in Wales. We know this , as a succession of Scottish labour leaders , from Wendy Alexander , kezia dug dale , Johann Lamont etc etc have all complained they are not free to set devolved policy , and that they are informed from London of policy which they then have to implement. Johan Lamont even complained one of her aides was sacked by London without her knowledge or approval. So of course labour in Wales is a blueprint for labour in scotland and England. They are one and the same party , with the head of the party in London. So as I said , what a stupid fucking comment. Must try harder see 2. --"The following things are not devolved, and HM government remains responsible for them: the constitution international relations and defence national security nationality and immigration nuclear energy broadcasting the UK tax system employment and social security (except Northern Ireland) The devolution settlements are complex and are all different. That said, broadly speaking, the following things are devolved in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland: health and social care education and training local government and housing agriculture, forestry and fisheries the environment and planning tourism, sport and heritage economic development and internal transport im aware of all this see 2. Now going back to my earlier point , what has this to do with me pointing out devolved policy in labour run Wales is ultimately decided by starmer in London , hence why we ask why should we trust starmer in London and Edinburgh when he has made a mess of things in Cardiff? |
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Post by see2 on Jan 28, 2024 18:02:29 GMT
--"The following things are not devolved, and HM government remains responsible for them: the constitution international relations and defence national security nationality and immigration nuclear energy broadcasting the UK tax system employment and social security (except Northern Ireland) The devolution settlements are complex and are all different. That said, broadly speaking, the following things are devolved in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland: health and social care education and training local government and housing agriculture, forestry and fisheries the environment and planning tourism, sport and heritage economic development and internal transport im aware of all this see 2. Now going back to my earlier point , what has this to do with me pointing out devolved policy in labour run Wales is ultimately decided by starmer in London , hence why we ask why should we trust starmer in London and Edinburgh when he has made a mess of things in Cardiff? Oh come on, I have produced the evidence that your claim is flawed. Did you decide not to read it? |
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Post by thomas on Jan 28, 2024 18:05:06 GMT
im aware of all this see 2. Now going back to my earlier point , what has this to do with me pointing out devolved policy in labour run Wales is ultimately decided by starmer in London , hence why we ask why should we trust starmer in London and Edinburgh when he has made a mess of things in Cardiff? Oh come on, I have produced the evidence that your claim is flawed. Did you decide not to read it? I haven't seen one piece of evidence that the British labour party are anything other than a single party controlled from London , where the Scottish and welsh branch managers in the devolved parliaments do as starmer tells them. If starmer and his underlings are making a mess of Wales , where his party is in charge , how can we trust them elsewhere? Over to you? |
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Post by thomas on Jan 28, 2024 18:07:40 GMT
im aware of all this see 2. Now going back to my earlier point , what has this to do with me pointing out devolved policy in labour run Wales is ultimately decided by starmer in London , hence why we ask why should we trust starmer in London and Edinburgh when he has made a mess of things in Cardiff? Oh come on, I have produced the evidence that your claim is flawed. Did you decide not to read it? |
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Post by see2 on Jan 29, 2024 16:45:32 GMT
Oh come on, I have produced the evidence that your claim is flawed. Did you decide not to read it? I haven't seen one piece of evidence that the British labour party are anything other than a single party controlled from London , where the Scottish and welsh branch managers in the devolved parliaments do as starmer tells them. If starmer and his underlings are making a mess of Wales , where his party is in charge , how can we trust them elsewhere? Over to you? The evidence I posted shows what controls the UK government retains and what controls are passed onto the local elected Devolved governments. The obvious is there for you to see, why are you disputing the facts? Look it up for yourself, Google will give you the answers. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 29, 2024 16:57:59 GMT
I haven't seen one piece of evidence that the British labour party are anything other than a single party controlled from London , where the Scottish and welsh branch managers in the devolved parliaments do as starmer tells them. If starmer and his underlings are making a mess of Wales , where his party is in charge , how can we trust them elsewhere? Over to you? The evidence I posted shows what controls the UK government retains and what controls are passed onto the local elected Devolved governments. The obvious is there for you to see, why are you disputing the facts? Look it up for yourself, Google will give you the answers. where's the evidence that refutes my claim labour are one party , that sit at council devolved and Westminster level , controlled from London? I posted irrefutable evidence from scotland that the Scottish labour leader resigned due to lack of autonomy from London? |
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Post by see2 on Jan 29, 2024 16:58:01 GMT
Whose leg are you pulling, the article is from 2014. No mention of what was supposedly being over controlled by Labour, and nothing to do with Starmer. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 29, 2024 17:00:05 GMT
Whose leg are you pulling, the article is from 2014. No mention of what was supposedly being over controlled by Labour, and nothing to do with Starmer. how does the article from 2014 ( the next branch manager said the same) refute my claim labour are one party controlled from London? The accusations in the Scottish press are the same with starmer and sarwar as they were with Lamont and milliband , or dug dale and Corbyn. |
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Post by see2 on Jan 29, 2024 17:03:15 GMT
The evidence I posted shows what controls the UK government retains and what controls are passed onto the local elected Devolved governments. The obvious is there for you to see, why are you disputing the facts? Look it up for yourself, Google will give you the answers. where's the evidence that refutes my claim labour are one party , that sit at council devolved and Westminster level , controlled from London? I posted irrefutable evidence from scotland that the Scottish labour leader resigned due to lack of autonomy from London? Where is your evidence that Labour control all local issues that are supposed to be controlled by the Local devolved government? But what lack of autonomy? I have posted the areas where the local devolved government do have autonomy. If the local government wander into areas where they don't belong, then they will have problems. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 29, 2024 17:04:50 GMT
where's the evidence that refutes my claim labour are one party , that sit at council devolved and Westminster level , controlled from London? I posted irrefutable evidence from scotland that the Scottish labour leader resigned due to lack of autonomy from London? Where is your evidence that Labour control all local issues that are supposed to be controlled by the Local devolved government? But what lack of autonomy? I have posted the areas where the local devolved government do have autonomy. If the local government wander into areas where they don't belong, then they will have problems. The Labour Party in England scotland and Wales is one party headquartered and controlled by starmer in London .If you think otherwise , prove it? |
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Post by see2 on Jan 29, 2024 17:07:44 GMT
Whose leg are you pulling, the article is from 2014. No mention of what was supposedly being over controlled by Labour, and nothing to do with Starmer. how does the article from 2014 ( the next branch manager said the same) refute my claim labour are one party controlled from London? The accusations in the Scottish press are the same with starmer and sarwar as they were with Lamont and milliband , or dug dale and Corbyn. You have been shown the divided areas of control. Unless the claim of Labour being too controlling are posted along with the points of contention, their claims cannot be debated. So it is pointless posting one without the other. |
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Post by see2 on Jan 29, 2024 17:23:15 GMT
Where is your evidence that Labour control all local issues that are supposed to be controlled by the Local devolved government? But what lack of autonomy? I have posted the areas where the local devolved government do have autonomy. If the local government wander into areas where they don't belong, then they will have problems. The Labour Party in England scotland and Wales is one party headquartered and controlled by starmer in London .If you think otherwise , prove it? Starmer CANNOT impose anything on anyone that goes against the constitution. Your basic claim is that a Labour leader can impose whatever they want on devolved governments, and that is clearly wrong. The only thing a Party leader can have any control over is how party members behave. And that might offend some members. Your debating ability is based upon insinuation. If you could prove YOUR case, you would. I have posted facts, you have chosen to ignore them, that's your choice. My case is proven, I am offering no further evidence. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 29, 2024 17:46:52 GMT
how does the article from 2014 ( the next branch manager said the same) refute my claim labour are one party controlled from London? The accusations in the Scottish press are the same with starmer and sarwar as they were with Lamont and milliband , or dug dale and Corbyn. You have been shown the divided areas of control. Unless the claim of Labour being too controlling are posted along with the points of contention, their claims cannot be debated. So it is pointless posting one without the other. Aye. You have shown me Wales has a devolved parliament .The party that sits in that devolved parliament , and runs that country , is labour , a British party that is based in London. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 29, 2024 17:47:45 GMT
The Labour Party in England scotland and Wales is one party headquartered and controlled by starmer in London .If you think otherwise , prove it? Your basic claim is that a Labour leader can impose whatever they want on devolved governments, and that is clearly wrong. . its not my claim. It's the then leader of labour in scotland who made the claim. (and others) |
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