|
|
Post by sandypine on Nov 17, 2022 22:00:37 GMT
I can find it I think everyone is interested in what you use to base your belief in a climate crisis on and why you believe that is uncontested fact which it is not. Just consider the NOAA quoted as the reference group for proving that surface temperatures have been increasing at the rate stated . Their results have been queried regularly as containing too much Urban Heat Island data which is forcing the temperatures artificially higher. So on information point one the whole edifice has some significant questions as regards its accuracy yet these are the values used to create the concept of the crisis. There is a link and I suggest you look at the photgraph even if you do not wish to read the article as that is a weather station that is used in the global warming data. wattsupwiththat.com/2019/05/03/big-news-verified-by-noaa-poor-weather-station-siting-leads-to-artificial-long-term-warming/To be clear again I am not saying that man made global warming does not exist I am asking for some form of accurate data upon which to base our emergencies on. As an aside it seems pertinent that the UK's highest temperature records are frequently set at airports of some sort where obviously vast areas of concrete and large engine heat emissions will have no effect. Watts is a blogger and a climate change denier. Then Pacifico is right and you are basing your belief on faith as alternative information that specifically and factually debunks some aspects of the temperature rise as recorded and presented as a crisis is just denied by you, and I am called the denialist. It is a topsy turvy world. Watt was confirmed by NOAA as being correct in what he highlighted. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2022 5:49:25 GMT
Watts is a blogger and a climate change denier. Then Pacifico is right and you are basing your belief on faith as alternative information that specifically and factually debunks some aspects of the temperature rise as recorded and presented as a crisis is just denied by you, and I am called the denialist. It is a topsy turvy world. Watt was confirmed by NOAA as being correct in what he highlighted. Local v global? |
|
|
|
Post by Toreador on Nov 18, 2022 7:32:57 GMT
As an aside it seems pertinent that the UK's highest temperature records are frequently set at airports of some sort where obviously vast areas of concrete and large engine heat emissions will have no effect. The following is from: www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/learn-about/how-forecasts-are-made/observations/weather-stationsOf course the Met Offiice personnel may be lazy, lying, or just mistaken, but it seems the chance that the local environment affects meteorological readings has been accounted for… Weather station sites are selected to ensure that the observations are representative of the wider area around the station and not unduly influenced by local effects. Ideal site Level ground. No trees; buildings, or steep ground nearby that might influence the measurements. Undesirable site Warming effect of buildings on the measurement of temperature Sheltering or shading effects of trees on the measurement of sunshine and wind. Frost hollow where overnight temperatures on still clear nights may be far lower than at neighbouring locations. Top of a hill or steep escarpment where winds will be unrepresentative of the wider area. Norwich is frequently shown as the coldest place in East Anglia, they're obviously scared of taking a thermometer to Cromer or Sheringham lest they freeze to death. |
|
|
|
Post by sandypine on Nov 18, 2022 9:43:36 GMT
Then Pacifico is right and you are basing your belief on faith as alternative information that specifically and factually debunks some aspects of the temperature rise as recorded and presented as a crisis is just denied by you, and I am called the denialist. It is a topsy turvy world. Watt was confirmed by NOAA as being correct in what he highlighted. Local v global? This I have to say is the idiocy and corrupt thinking that epitomises the crisis manufacturers and their acolytes. Local temperatures are fed into the models to bring about a global temperature. If some local temperatures are being measured higher now than in the past due to local heat island effects then the models are using incorrect data to come to their findings. We see it every day that local events (like our record temperatures) are presented as definitive evidence that global warming is occurring irrespective of global pauses in temperatures. So in the warmists playbook there is no happy medium; a global pause is largely ignored and assumed to be the oceans storing heat; a one off event like Pakistan floods ( rainfall levels that are events that have happened locally since Indian/Pakistan records began) and record temperatures in the UK are all hailed as signs of imminent disaster. I am not denying these events all I am asking is that the whole situation is viewed with a dispassionate eye but that seems to be asking far too much. |
|
|
|
Post by dappy on Nov 18, 2022 10:18:13 GMT
Once again Sandy, while I admire your stamina and I am really not going round the same loop again, however much you wish to deny reality, the simple fact is that the vast majority of scientists with knowledge in the field are telling us that man made effects are resulting in climate change that will cause significant damage to the world and its inhabitants living standards, probably killing off a large number of species.
It is only a forecast, but it is a forecast the experts are making with confidence and the consequences are forecast to be very serious.
We can take a gamble and ignore them if we want but if we do it appears to be a gamble with a high probability of losing our bet and a gamble for which the losses if we lose will be high and the gains if we win low.
Problem is though that the stake for the gamble is one we have to decide to put up while the gains or losses of our bet will accrue to our grandchildren. Are we too selfish to for once put our grandkids interests first?
|
|
|
|
Post by sheepy on Nov 18, 2022 10:26:37 GMT
Once again Sandy, while I admire your stamina and I am really not going round the same loop again, however much you wish to deny reality, the simple fact is that the vast majority of scientists with knowledge in the field are telling us that man made effects are resulting in climate change that will cause significant damage to the world and its inhabitants living standards, probably killing off a large number of species. It is only a forecast, but it is a forecast the experts are making with confidence and the consequences are forecast to be very serious. We can take a gamble and ignore them if we want but if we do it appears to be a gamble with a high probability of losing our bet and a gamble for which the losses if we lose will be high and the gains if we win low. Problem is though that the stake for the gamble is one we have to decide to put up while the gains or losses of our bet will accrue to our grandchildren. Are we too selfish to for once put our grandkids interests first? But they haven't been ignored they have moved the goalposts, which you never even noticed. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2022 11:36:05 GMT
This I have to say is the idiocy and corrupt thinking that epitomises the crisis manufacturers and their acolytes. Local temperatures are fed into the models to bring about a global temperature. If some local temperatures are being measured higher now than in the past due to local heat island effects then the models are using incorrect data to come to their findings. We see it every day that local events (like our record temperatures) are presented as definitive evidence that global warming is occurring irrespective of global pauses in temperatures. So in the warmists playbook there is no happy medium; a global pause is largely ignored and assumed to be the oceans storing heat; a one off event like Pakistan floods ( rainfall levels that are events that have happened locally since Indian/Pakistan records began) and record temperatures in the UK are all hailed as signs of imminent disaster. I am not denying these events all I am asking is that the whole situation is viewed with a dispassionate eye but that seems to be asking far too much. Global warming is happening despite local variation. |
|
|
|
Post by sandypine on Nov 18, 2022 12:37:29 GMT
This I have to say is the idiocy and corrupt thinking that epitomises the crisis manufacturers and their acolytes. Local temperatures are fed into the models to bring about a global temperature. If some local temperatures are being measured higher now than in the past due to local heat island effects then the models are using incorrect data to come to their findings. We see it every day that local events (like our record temperatures) are presented as definitive evidence that global warming is occurring irrespective of global pauses in temperatures. So in the warmists playbook there is no happy medium; a global pause is largely ignored and assumed to be the oceans storing heat; a one off event like Pakistan floods ( rainfall levels that are events that have happened locally since Indian/Pakistan records began) and record temperatures in the UK are all hailed as signs of imminent disaster. I am not denying these events all I am asking is that the whole situation is viewed with a dispassionate eye but that seems to be asking far too much. Global warming is happening despite local variation. No argument there from me, the why and to what degree are the questions. |
|
|
|
Post by sandypine on Nov 18, 2022 12:50:58 GMT
Once again Sandy, while I admire your stamina and I am really not going round the same loop again, however much you wish to deny reality, the simple fact is that the vast majority of scientists with knowledge in the field are telling us that man made effects are resulting in climate change that will cause significant damage to the world and its inhabitants living standards, probably killing off a large number of species. It is only a forecast, but it is a forecast the experts are making with confidence and the consequences are forecast to be very serious. We can take a gamble and ignore them if we want but if we do it appears to be a gamble with a high probability of losing our bet and a gamble for which the losses if we lose will be high and the gains if we win low. Problem is though that the stake for the gamble is one we have to decide to put up while the gains or losses of our bet will accrue to our grandchildren. Are we too selfish to for once put our grandkids interests first? Once again I am denying nothing. I am asking where is the evidence that the vast majority/overwhelming majority/97% of scientists with knowledeg in the field believe that man is the primary driver of climate change. You have linked to NASA many of whose scientist disagree with the official NASA position as evidenced by their open letter, you have linked to other US scientific associations and agencies as proof that most scientists agree that man drives the climate change yet that evidence from those I hav eresearched merely quote the IPCC as the source of that belief. It seems to all come back to Cooks assessment of numerous scientific papers on the subject and that assessment has been heavily criticised and several scientists have stated they disagree with Coo's assessment of their work and outlook. |
|
|
|
Post by patman post on Nov 18, 2022 12:52:17 GMT
Seems to me that if what’s happening around individual countries isn’t recorded, we won’t know what’s happening around the globe.
While weather is day-to-day events wherever you are, each event has usually fallen within approximately predictable patterns. Knowing these patterns, allows significant variations to be noted and compared. And because the variations in different countries are now being compared, a more comprehensive picture of climate, weather and their aberrations around the globe can be compiled.
It’s true that scientific study of climate and weather has only been around for 300 years. But modern study of earth cores, ice cores fossils, etc, record material going back many thousands of years. As elements of modern environments are recorded, comparisons with elements found in these cores can be made.
Climate change is now generally accepted as a fact. The discussions now appear to be over whether human activity and CO2 are factors in the change and, if so, can human activity be changed to stop or reverse climate change.
Human activity does change local environments and weather — eg, by city-building increasing temperature, reducing ground water, and creating air movement and increasing wind. We can add air pollution to that and it is harming health.
Health and the environment alone seem powerful enough reasons to modify human behaviour. If there's a chance that this also reduces the adverse effects of climate change, it seems a no brainer…
|
|
|
|
Post by sandypine on Nov 18, 2022 19:56:29 GMT
Seems to me that if what’s happening around individual countries isn’t recorded, we won’t know what’s happening around the globe. While weather is day-to-day events wherever you are, each event has usually fallen within approximately predictable patterns. Knowing these patterns, allows significant variations to be noted and compared. And because the variations in different countries are now being compared, a more comprehensive picture of climate, weather and their aberrations around the globe can be compiled. It’s true that scientific study of climate and weather has only been around for 300 years. But modern study of earth cores, ice cores fossils, etc, record material going back many thousands of years. As elements of modern environments are recorded, comparisons with elements found in these cores can be made. Climate change is now generally accepted as a fact. The discussions now appear to be over whether human activity and CO2 are factors in the change and, if so, can human activity be changed to stop or reverse climate change. Human activity does change local environments and weather — eg, by city-building increasing temperature, reducing ground water, and creating air movement and increasing wind. We can add air pollution to that and it is harming health. Health and the environment alone seem powerful enough reasons to modify human behaviour. If there's a chance that this also reduces the adverse effects of climate change, it seems a no brainer… No harm in modifying human behaviour, what is of concern is that those with an agenda want to modify your behaviour so that they can still partake in their rather wasteful behaviour. The idea seems to be to limit C02 by stopping the hoi polloi from doing all sorts of things whilst they go about their more meaningful lives. Well bugger that for a game of soldiers. They want miles of empty UK roads where cost will limit most people from using a car. The four hundred private jets all progressing to cop 27 should tell us that limiting C02 has little to do with it and we will be mugs to fall for it and the lies told, and exposed, in the C02 game should warn us. It is the tried and trusted method to get you to do what they wish in that it is virtuous to behave as they wish. |
|
|
|
Post by Dubdrifter on Nov 19, 2022 8:32:13 GMT
People need to realise that chaos is only generated and engineered by Globalists like the Soros Posse … even if Truss had a sound economic plan and a top economist steering this Country out of debt and paying back all our creditors … that isn’t what Globalist Totalitarian Agenda players want … at the very top … they only make huge profits from chaos and panic, Sanctions and War. Soros drained the Bank of England of it’s gold reserves back @‘92 … Why do we invest in the currency of a Country that repeatedly shafts us … why don’t we have Bankers that invest in the Pound and building Briton’s fortunes… not boosting American and Israeli interests all the time. We need a Reset Programme … away from debt dependancy and WEF/IMF manipulation. … we called for that with the Brexit VOTE … we are still looking for leadership that will deliver. Time to move away from the Tory/Labour mindset that never delivers … we need a Farage Government with top advisors who know what they are doing. Iceland found indigenous leaders and advisors that steered them out of chronic debt and the clutches of IMF/WEF dependency … why can’t we create a political/leadership climate that attracts top people …?? …. Because we have a ROTTEN Media owned and run by foreign linked tribal factions who have always had designs to enslave us. … address that problem …and flush the System … and we might have a chance at significant change … environmentally too. Soros is a US asset. They used him to loot the soviet union of anything valuable with his series of foundations recruiting the talented scientists over there to cross over and work for Uncle Sam, similar to Operation Paperclip in WW2, the US needs talent.
My view is globalisation is inevitable, necessary and beneficial. If we do the opposite, which is protectionism, then we will end up failing. The dollar in the next ten years is going to crash and burn, possibly much faster - who can tell. We are at a point where the US and the UK look now to be on the losing side and many supporting countries in a marriage of convenience are moving over to China. As they do so the Chinese empire grows. It's a radically different philosophy in China but the big dividend is China is selling peace and financial stability. It is also going through a period similar to the English Enlightenment. We are going the other way and now we are like a pre-Enlightenment society. We lack capital as well. The country is virtually bankrupt, but there is a way out now if we act fast and change our ways. Also India was once a supporter of the Western financial system but India has recently crossed the line. As well as chatting to Chinese I tap into what is being said in India and it is interesting. The Indians are looking to go East and so too are the Africans. We can not afford to fight this empire, and besides it does not want to fight us either. What it is fighting is this violent Anglo-Saxon view that has caused wars for thousands of years. This new empire goes by the rule of sovereignty. What you do and how you run your own country is not their business. What is their business is business, which is the giant BRI and the sophisticated financial system it is creating where there is proper competition. It's a free market system that I have been advocating all along, and just coincidently it seems to me the Chinese think the same as I do for the same reasons. They are mathematically minded, so are on the post-Enlightenment side of the fence.
They will buy our industry up be because our industry is under exploiting capital resources due to idiotic British management. One way or another these firms will go bust and be bought up on the cheap by the Chinese. I recall a top English hifi manufacturer from the 70s in Cambridge called Quad. The Chinese bought it from the receivers, and I believe now it is bigger and better than it ever was. What we are going to have to do is learn from them because now they are the more technologically advanced so that makes them teacher and we mere pupils of commerce. If we carry on we will pick up the tricks and turn ourselves around in the process. Unfortunately the stupid government has decided to block sale of a Newport semiconductor manufacturer they purchased. The Chinese firm is very upset the Brits are using the strong arm of the government diktat to reverse a private agreement and it does not bode well. Anyway, it is upto the voter. There are some right bastards in the tory Party and right nasty warmngers, but I do not think Rishi is one of them. He's kind of got the right idea but is hampered by the collective nature of government and the other type, like the Duncan Smiths of this world. They are national embarrassments.
Don't copy them. That was banking fraud. They ripped us and many others.
Very astute summary of our situation and current World business trends, Baron … which many viewing this Forum should take on board and develop into their future strategies … if only we were well-managed … and we had brains instead of bullies and rip-off merchants in charge of UK business today. 😫 ho hum. So many bright ideas we developed … squandered and sold off cheap😖. … so much pioneering stuff … under-developed and unappreciated by ignorant morons who would sell off their mothers into prostitution … if it would turn them a shekel. Re: the Newport semi-conductor deal … I’m sure the U.S. and Chinese have blocked many a deal … often after the ink has dried … because of ‘security concerns’ and ‘economic protectionism’ … if Government Depts were intelligent … these businesses would be fully supported by the state and internal manufacturing … and wouldn’t even need to look for WELL DODGY FOREIGN INVESTORS … I see all foreigners as WELL-DODGY … so nothing personal against Chinese people or others. They see us as “well-dodgy” too … and rightly so …. especially those in the West linked to the Soros Posse. Re my highlight in BOLD … I wasn’t referring to the crooked Icelandic bankers that committed the frauds that spiralled Iceland into colossal debt … but those who strategised returning Iceland to some sort of stability without them running cap in hand to prostitute themselves forever to the dictats of the IMF. Do you get my drift? |
|
|
|
Post by Montegriffo on Nov 19, 2022 9:04:56 GMT
The following is from: www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/learn-about/how-forecasts-are-made/observations/weather-stationsOf course the Met Offiice personnel may be lazy, lying, or just mistaken, but it seems the chance that the local environment affects meteorological readings has been accounted for… Weather station sites are selected to ensure that the observations are representative of the wider area around the station and not unduly influenced by local effects. Ideal site Level ground. No trees; buildings, or steep ground nearby that might influence the measurements. Undesirable site Warming effect of buildings on the measurement of temperature Sheltering or shading effects of trees on the measurement of sunshine and wind. Frost hollow where overnight temperatures on still clear nights may be far lower than at neighbouring locations. Top of a hill or steep escarpment where winds will be unrepresentative of the wider area. Norwich is frequently shown as the coldest place in East Anglia, they're obviously scared of taking a thermometer to Cromer or Sheringham lest they freeze to death. That's due to its high altitude. |
|
|
|
Post by Dubdrifter on Nov 25, 2022 6:28:23 GMT
Once again Sandy, while I admire your stamina and I am really not going round the same loop again, however much you wish to deny reality, the simple fact is that the vast majority of scientists with knowledge in the field are telling us that man made effects are resulting in climate change that will cause significant damage to the world and its inhabitants living standards, probably killing off a large number of species. It is only a forecast, but it is a forecast the experts are making with confidence and the consequences are forecast to be very serious. We can take a gamble and ignore them if we want but if we do it appears to be a gamble with a high probability of losing our bet and a gamble for which the losses if we lose will be high and the gains if we win low. Problem is though that the stake for the gamble is one we have to decide to put up while the gains or losses of our bet will accrue to our grandchildren. Are we too selfish to for once put our grandkids interests first? Once again I am denying nothing. I am asking where is the evidence that the vast majority/overwhelming majority/97% of scientists with knowledeg in the field believe that man is the primary driver of climate change. You have linked to NASA many of whose scientist disagree with the official NASA position as evidenced by their open letter, you have linked to other US scientific associations and agencies as proof that most scientists agree that man drives the climate change yet that evidence from those I hav eresearched merely quote the IPCC as the source of that belief. It seems to all come back to Cooks assessment of numerous scientific papers on the subject and that assessment has been heavily criticised and several scientists have stated they disagree with Coo's assessment of their work and outlook. With scientific evidence coming out about America’s HAARP and geo-weathering manipulation programmes … involving climate engineering since WW2 . en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-frequency_Active_Auroral_Research_ProgramIran claimed U.S. warships in the Mediterranean created weird unseasonal flooding in Belgium and Germany earlier this year … and a drought in Iran … due to climate manipulation. www.geoengineeringwatch.org/iran-accuses-u-s-of-using-weather-weapons/…. (check out this shocking documentary on Youtube ( The Dimming ) … youtu.be/rf78rEAJvhY…. It details the science behind these projects …. It confirms the history of the USA’s botched attempts to manipulate our weather. People have to understand that the U.S. motivations on climate change are nothing more than bio-warfare on the Planet … Rishi Sunak and Biden’s appearance at Cop 27 was nothing more than another attempt to whip up Reparation Agendas and further defund Europe and the Commonwealth. Best we end this ‘special POODLE relationship’ NOW… and shut down the EU … which has no effective strategies to help the Environment. Generating Sanctions against Russia … and then rolling out FRACKING across Europe … is the most stupid toxic chemical attack on the environment since Chernobyl blew it’s stack. Extinction Rebellion are the dumbest action group around right now … they would be doing the Planet a REAL favour pouring Fracking chemicals into the Offices of the White House, Klaus Schwab, Black Cube, the Pentagon, Soros and Bloomberg … if they want to make a real statement attacking the main pollutants of Mother Earth today. |
|
