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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2023 11:18:07 GMT
Do I have to point out that the world did not wake up to the problems of Islamism until the 11th September 2001. Prior to that time Muslims were just "different" we were told. Multicultural politics were encouraged. There was a peace process taking place and hopes for a two state solution in the middle east, which had faltered with violence in the Autumn of 2000, and war in Chechnya, we weren't really that aware of the radicalisation of young fighting aged men in our country. Even in 2005 many wanted to say "oh but it's just a tiny minority". It could be an even smaller majority if we address the issue of indoctrination. We have been at war in one form or another with Muslims states for hundreds of years, usually in the form of conquests and latterly and the search for oil. The two state solutions all proffered were to Israel's advantage and Palestinian disadvantage. Violence begets violence and I can see a lot more 'terrorists' being born across the Muslim countries because of Israel's genocide and our part in it. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2023 11:19:28 GMT
Your history on this one is poor. Palestine was a British protectorate. We created the state of Israel. So we can't say nothing to do with us. However saying that, we should not do anything to inflame this, such as taking one side or another. It should be perfectly possible to support the march to stop the war in Gaza AND support the march against antisemitism. Both are wrong. We should have been pushing for a two state solution rather than just just leaving it. But unfortunately that was "feck all to do with us". We, who is this we you speak of?
Like I said it's feck all to do with us, and I doubt the west poking its usual nose into it will be welcomed by either side.
The last time the west poked their noses in, was the Bush/Blair illegal war in Iraq looking for fictitious WMD, as I said we can voice our opinions on this conflict, raise funds, and other support and help, but filling our cities full of angry bitter protesters is not one of them.
We, along with the US sell them the weapons to carry out genocide, that makes it 'something to do with us'. |
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Post by Vinny on Nov 28, 2023 11:23:43 GMT
Do I have to point out that the world did not wake up to the problems of Islamism until the 11th September 2001. Prior to that time Muslims were just "different" we were told. Multicultural politics were encouraged. There was a peace process taking place and hopes for a two state solution in the middle east, which had faltered with violence in the Autumn of 2000, and war in Chechnya, we weren't really that aware of the radicalisation of young fighting aged men in our country. Even in 2005 many wanted to say "oh but it's just a tiny minority". It could be an even smaller majority if we address the issue of indoctrination. We have been at war in one form or another with Muslims states for hundreds of years, usually in the form of conquests and latterly and the search for oil. The two state solutions all proffered were to Israel's advantage and Palestinian disadvantage. Violence begets violence and I can see a lot more 'terrorists' being born across the Muslim countries because of Israel's genocide and our part in it. The two state solution is over. The Israelis rule everything solution is now starting. All because Hamas chose terrorism rather than diplomacy. |
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Post by Pacifico on Nov 28, 2023 11:25:36 GMT
The two state solutions all proffered were to Israel's advantage and Palestinian disadvantage. What advantage did the Jews get?  |
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Post by Red Rackham on Nov 28, 2023 11:26:39 GMT
And your thoughts on Hamas terrorists attacking Israel on Oct 7? I have on many occasions stated quite clearly that what Hamas did was a war crime. That does not excuse Israel defending itself by slaughtering Palestinian civilians, maiming children, using white phosphorus and shrapnel shells. Given that you accept Hamas committed a war crime, what do you suppose Israel's response should have been? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2023 11:49:40 GMT
That's one of your sillier comments. 75% of Israelis are Jews. Are you suggesting it is the 25% others that are waging war against Hamas? Of course not. The Israeli government represent their people. That's the point anti-Semitism is a hatred of Jews, Israel are waging the war and are being called out for the slaughter of civilians not the Jewish faith. Are you happy that Israel can hide it's genocide behind it's nations faith? Anti-Israel is not anti-Semitism no matter how hard people want you to believe it is. Utter nonsense in my opinion. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2023 11:53:14 GMT
We have been at war in one form or another with Muslims states for hundreds of years, usually in the form of conquests and latterly and the search for oil. The two state solutions all proffered were to Israel's advantage and Palestinian disadvantage. Violence begets violence and I can see a lot more 'terrorists' being born across the Muslim countries because of Israel's genocide and our part in it.
The two state solution is over. The Israelis rule everything solution is now starting. All because Hamas chose terrorism rather than diplomacy. Agreed, However, Biden the senile duffer in the WH is still pushing the 2 state solution. He seems duplicitous in his support for Israel. I suspect he wants Israel to withdraw before they achieve their objectives. |
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Post by Fairsociety on Nov 28, 2023 11:58:02 GMT
We, who is this we you speak of?
Like I said it's feck all to do with us, and I doubt the west poking its usual nose into it will be welcomed by either side.
The last time the west poked their noses in, was the Bush/Blair illegal war in Iraq looking for fictitious WMD, as I said we can voice our opinions on this conflict, raise funds, and other support and help, but filling our cities full of angry bitter protesters is not one of them.
We, along with the US sell them the weapons to carry out genocide, that makes it 'something to do with us'. They call it business as usual, it's leveling up, you wouldn't expect one side to have all the deadly weapons while the other side used handbags.
That's why we have been helping Ukraine, Putin had a obvious weapons advantage over Ukraine, no one objected, so yet again I repeat this conflict has nothing to do with us, it's turf war.
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Post by walterpaisley on Nov 28, 2023 12:03:46 GMT
..still pushing the 2 state solution. Is there any other solution, short of making the region either wholly Palestinian or wholly Israeli territory? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2023 14:28:11 GMT
The two state solutions all proffered were to Israel's advantage and Palestinian disadvantage. What advantage did the Jews get? The blue and by the way stop calling them Jews, that's anti-Semitic, it's Israel. Twice the amount of land for half the number of people. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2023 14:34:10 GMT
I have on many occasions stated quite clearly that what Hamas did was a war crime. That does not excuse Israel defending itself by slaughtering Palestinian civilians, maiming children, using white phosphorus and shrapnel shells. Given that you accept Hamas committed a war crime, what do you suppose Israel's response should have been? Yes, get Hamas but not by bombing the whole of the Gaza Strip killing 10s of thousands of innocent civilians, Israel have the most up to date weapons and 'spy' network in the world. I have answered you question will you now have the decency to answer mine. Would you have supported the British state indiscriminately bombing Northern Ireland to root out the IRA? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2023 14:35:40 GMT
That's the point anti-Semitism is a hatred of Jews, Israel are waging the war and are being called out for the slaughter of civilians not the Jewish faith. Are you happy that Israel can hide it's genocide behind it's nations faith? Anti-Israel is not anti-Semitism no matter how hard people want you to believe it is. Utter nonsense in my opinion. So you are confirming, in your mind, that being against Israel is anti-Semitic, that is what your answer is saying. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2023 14:36:48 GMT
We, along with the US sell them the weapons to carry out genocide, that makes it 'something to do with us'. They call it business as usual, it's leveling up, you wouldn't expect one side to have all the deadly weapons while the other side used handbags.
That's why we have been helping Ukraine, Putin had a obvious weapons advantage over Ukraine, no one objected, so yet again I repeat this conflict has nothing to do with us, it's turf war.
Hamas has a weapons advantage over Israel?  |
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Post by Fairsociety on Nov 28, 2023 14:42:52 GMT
They call it business as usual, it's leveling up, you wouldn't expect one side to have all the deadly weapons while the other side used handbags.
That's why we have been helping Ukraine, Putin had a obvious weapons advantage over Ukraine, no one objected, so yet again I repeat this conflict has nothing to do with us, it's turf war.
Hamas has a weapons advantage over Israel? Hamas is a terrorist group, and heavily funded by very wealthy and influential people, they don't roam the desert wearing robes and flip flops hiding in caves, they are a highly organised 'intelligent' outfit, and a force to be reckoned with ..... or don't you know that? |
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Post by see2 on Nov 28, 2023 14:53:47 GMT
Do I have to point out that the world did not wake up to the problems of Islamism until the 11th September 2001. Prior to that time Muslims were just "different" we were told. Multicultural politics were encouraged. There was a peace process taking place and hopes for a two state solution in the middle east, which had faltered with violence in the Autumn of 2000, and war in Chechnya, we weren't really that aware of the radicalisation of young fighting aged men in our country. Even in 2005 many wanted to say "oh but it's just a tiny minority". It could be an even smaller majority if we address the issue of indoctrination. We have been at war in one form or another with Muslims states for hundreds of years, usually in the form of conquests and latterly and the search for oil. The two state solutions all proffered were to Israel's advantage and Palestinian disadvantage. Violence begets violence and I can see a lot more 'terrorists' being born across the Muslim countries because of Israel's genocide and our part in it. Islamic armies, 'doing God's work' have invaded country after country ever since the 7th century. Even to the extent of taking young Christian males from their families, converting them to Islam and training them as soldiers, the Mamluk, to fight for the spread of Islam. The Muslim raiders from North Africa captured a claimed 1 million Europeans and sold them in the Ottoman Slave Markets. Ended by the French conquest of Algeria. When the Ottoman rulers freed the Jews from the chains of Dhimmitude in 1858, that made Jews in Palestine equal under the law to the Arabs, they unwittingly lit the blue touch paper of the Arab hatred of and conflict with the Jews. If you want to understand the conflicts between the Arabs and the Jews you need to start from that period of history. |
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