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Post by Orac on Nov 14, 2022 19:52:13 GMT
I literally just covered it in my last posts. And the ones before. The bit about consistent principle. AKA, the concept of 'degrees' is not even relevant to principle of the point i was writing about. See my earlier posts for elaboration Could you outline the principle and explain why it is inconsistent with the notion of degree / amount? As far as i can see, the concept being used is 'threat' and this nearly always comes as a quantity rather than a binary.
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Post by colbops on Nov 14, 2022 20:36:31 GMT
My own view is that it is already too late and the only potential option still available is a territorial solution like that once proposed for Apartheid-era South Africa. Is it too late? Is too late a false premise perhaps? Is there such a thing as who stole our culture? Is culture imposed or does it evolve naturally, and then change through consensus and is that conscious or unconscious consensus? Would an apartheid type solution actually work for culture. Would you be able to find enough people that shared your idea of what English culture is, segregate them, and then stop them being influenced by outside influence? What would be the aim of trying to recapture a lost culture? what benefit would it bring? How would you reintroduce it? Can you establish this was our culture on X date and then impose the concept that this is going to be our culture now? Does the internet or globalisation destroy any hope of what once was being what is in the same way? How far do you want to go? Ostracise anyone in the community that doesn't show their face in church on Sunday? Do all Mothers day cards get left on shelves in favour of Mothering Sunday cards - Or do we take it even further and make Mothering Sunday a day to go back to your home church as it was even further back and strip away this erroneous concept that it was ever about mothers at all?
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Post by Dan Dare on Nov 14, 2022 21:42:45 GMT
Blimey. So many questions.
You never did respond to my own simple question about whether you were a 'Caucasian', or not.
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Post by colbops on Nov 14, 2022 22:12:17 GMT
Blimey. So many questions.
You never did respond to my own simple question about whether you were a 'Caucasian', or not.
It doesn't matter. It's not pertinent to the conversation and I wouldn't want it to influence how you interact with me
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Post by wapentake on Nov 14, 2022 23:34:21 GMT
Who stole our culture?
Our politicians.
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Nov 15, 2022 1:28:14 GMT
If you'd troubled to read the OP and the links included there you would have seen that the culprits responsible for the theft of our culture were not, originally, thought to be foreigners living in the UK. That's an inflection you have chosen to place on the question. I'd say the Frankfurt School and Gramaski etc were just a part of it. It's easy to fall into the trap of thinking we've got our man, so no need to look further. There are many other strands to it that do not in any way connect to the Frankfurt School. I tried to show some of my own research on this which connects to London, but I notice it all got ignored. The Fabian Society for example was a powerful influence. You will see it is also British aristocracy. I spent quite a bit of my time in my youth studying the history of art around the time I refer to. You have a French element as well. Essentially it is connected to socialism and Marxism. I believe Marx himself was hired by the British aristocracy. He was like the figurehead. Those women writing books on woke in this current time don't have any power, rather they are useful idiots, and the same was going on a century or more ago. What we read we imagine was from someone who was pushing the agenda, but you can't just do that. You need backing. Hitler also would never have made it as a leader without the right backing. I'd follow the money.
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Post by Dan Dare on Nov 15, 2022 8:45:14 GMT
Blimey. So many questions.
You never did respond to my own simple question about whether you were a 'Caucasian', or not.
It doesn't matter. It's not pertinent to the conversation and I wouldn't want it to influence how you interact with me Of course it matters. In any discussion concerning questions of identity it is crucial to understand where your adversary is 'coming from'. Everybody has an axe to grind.
If you don't want to disclose, I'll assume you are a hostile nation-wrecker, either of foreign extraction or a home-grown quisling.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2022 9:12:34 GMT
Back to the OP. Who stole the tarts?
And are these knaves still of hearts or are they getting a little nastier and becoming agents of clubs.
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Post by Dan Dare on Nov 15, 2022 9:33:49 GMT
BvL is trying to finger the Fabian Society by introducing the toxic label 'Marxism' into the mix. But the truth of the matter is that the Fabians had little influence on mainstream politics or society as a whole, not that they were anywhere near as ambitious in their goals, which tended to be confined to ameliorating the conditions of the working class rather than campaigning for group rights for every social group. In that respect, the Fabian Society were proto-social democrats rather than cultural marxists seeking hegemonic control over society through the capture of its 'mediating' institutions.
Certainly, even on home turf, the society's objectives were quite modest and this is reflected in its achievements. The working class, which in the late 30s still comprised 75% of the population, was deeply socially conservative and patriotic, even nationalistic. The Trade Union movement, and by extension its political wing the Labour Party, were economically illiberal, being particularly in favour of tariffs and other forms of protectionism, the complete opposite to Marx’s dream of an ‘international proletariat’. That their present-day counterparts would be enthusiastic promoters of multiculturalism, open borders and equal rights for foreign workers would have seemed bizarre in the extreme to Labour voters in the 1930s. Many people in the white working class of course still feel that way today.
That said, it is of course much easier to trace a connection between Tony Blair (or David Cameron) and early 20th century British radicals than it is between them and, say, Herbert Marcuse. Yet I would propose it is the latter linkage that better explains their behaviours when in a position to project political power in the cause of social 'progressivism'.
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Nov 15, 2022 11:30:55 GMT
BvL is trying to finger the Fabian Society by introducing the toxic label 'Marxism' into the mix. But the truth of the matter is that the Fabians had little influence on mainstream politics or society as a whole, not that they were anywhere near as ambitious in their goals, which tended to be confined to ameliorating the conditions of the working class rather than campaigning for group rights for every social group. In that respect, the Fabian Society were proto-social democrats rather than cultural marxists seeking hegemonic control over society through the capture of its 'mediating' institutions. Certainly, even on home turf, the society's objectives were quite modest and this is reflected in its achievements. The working class, which in the late 30s still comprised 75% of the population, was deeply socially conservative and patriotic, even nationalistic. The Trade Union movement, and by extension its political wing the Labour Party, were economically illiberal, being particularly in favour of tariffs and other forms of protectionism, the complete opposite to Marx’s dream of an ‘international proletariat’. That their present-day counterparts would be enthusiastic promoters of multiculturalism, open borders and equal rights for foreign workers would have seemed bizarre in the extreme to Labour voters in the 1930s. Many people in the white working class of course still feel that way today. That said, it is of course much easier to trace a connection between Tony Blair (or David Cameron) and early 20th century British radicals than it is between them and, say, Herbert Marcuse. Yet I would propose it is the latter linkage that better explains their behaviours when in a position to project political power in the cause of social 'progressivism'.
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Nov 15, 2022 11:54:02 GMT
BvL is trying to finger the Fabian Society by introducing the toxic label 'Marxism' into the mix. But the truth of the matter is that the Fabians had little influence on mainstream politics or society as a whole, not that they were anywhere near as ambitious in their goals, which tended to be confined to ameliorating the conditions of the working class rather than campaigning for group rights for every social group. In that respect, the Fabian Society were proto-social democrats rather than cultural marxists seeking hegemonic control over society through the capture of its 'mediating' institutions. Certainly, even on home turf, the society's objectives were quite modest and this is reflected in its achievements. The working class, which in the late 30s still comprised 75% of the population, was deeply socially conservative and patriotic, even nationalistic. The Trade Union movement, and by extension its political wing the Labour Party, were economically illiberal, being particularly in favour of tariffs and other forms of protectionism, the complete opposite to Marx’s dream of an ‘international proletariat’. That their present-day counterparts would be enthusiastic promoters of multiculturalism, open borders and equal rights for foreign workers would have seemed bizarre in the extreme to Labour voters in the 1930s. Many people in the white working class of course still feel that way today. That said, it is of course much easier to trace a connection between Tony Blair (or David Cameron) and early 20th century British radicals than it is between them and, say, Herbert Marcuse. Yet I would propose it is the latter linkage that better explains their behaviours when in a position to project political power in the cause of social 'progressivism'. The Fabians were corrupting the arts. How many times do we think about Charles Dickens when thinking about the industrial revolution? It was through books of fiction that these people first of all started to influence the way we think. You see this in the French Revolution with Voltaire and Rousseau. As I had pointed out previously there were two big changes that made it more into what we see today. Firstly Freud's theories on sex, which are still taught in universities today despite being utterly wrong and the second was the mode of transmission, where we go from the novel to the radio. Indeed when radio was invented it was considered by the fascist British as a military technology, and woe betide anyone who has their own radio. The radio was in the hands of the establishment and so on to the creation of the BBC, which I think is 100 years and one day old today. If we also look at the arts around 1920 we have various movements. You might like to take a look at Dadism. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dada for example. From about 1890 onwards art would change from trying to create beauty to more of a sort of intellectual thing. This is where art is corrupted into switching to brainwashing material. You will see this as it turns very dark. Atonal music is done for the same reasons and often used in films to inflict a sense of horror in the subject. Picasso was also part of this transformation of art. A painting he paid off his bar bill with sold a while back for £45m. How did it appreciate much in value? Well back then this art was regarded as shitty and no one was that interested. Someone was pushing it and it was not by popular demand. The public were being led by the nose.
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Post by Dan Dare on Nov 15, 2022 12:05:02 GMT
"The Fabians were corrupting the arts."
How, exactly? All of the artistic movements you mention were based on the continent, not Britain.
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Nov 15, 2022 13:02:48 GMT
"The Fabians were corrupting the arts." How, exactly? All of the artistic movements you mention were based on the continent, not Britain. The Hampstead Historical Club is your lead. It's hardly front page news, indeed the comprehensive wiki page on it and its members was deleted. It's a shame because it read like a who's who in late 19th century Britain. You see what had happened with the aristocracy was their power was diminishing. The new middle class were seriously rich and beginning to call the shots on account of money talks and bullshit walks. The old feudal system had had its day. So what you got was a feeling that we should go backwards to the times when they held all the cards as the landlords. Two big examples of this were John Ruskin and William Morris. There was a connection here to the academics of Oxford, as per Ruskin being the man with the connections and the one who could make a star, which was to be William Morris as in a household name. The idea here was the green rural life was idyllic and industry was dirty, smelly and exploitative. It was a complete lie for what their idyllic past was in reality was incredible poverty and plagues almost wiping out the population and disease in the poor sanitation etc etc. This is in contrast to the Enlightenment where pragmatism and science were the thing and this was radically improving conditions and life expectancy. All this was by-the-bye though. As with the greens of today they do not care how many they kill. After all the aristocracy had gained their power by being efficient killers. You may wonder where the Jews came in. Well these land owners in times in the past had teamed up with Jewish financiers to create the cartel known as the British East India Company. As land and farming were less profitable they used this to diversify their investments. It's quite easy then to understand how the Jews came in later on with the Frankfurt School etc. Indeed there is no definite start date for all of this. It was like a picture coming into focus. The further back you go the less clear it is until it fades completely from view. By the way, talking of leads, another you might want to look at is RCA. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RCA
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Post by Dan Dare on Nov 15, 2022 13:14:00 GMT
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Post by jeg er on Nov 15, 2022 13:30:06 GMT
Blimey. So many questions.
You never did respond to my own simple question about whether you were a 'Caucasian', or not.
Yes, indeed, so many questions. Add them to the tally of those which remain unanswered by yourself from myself and Dappy. You are not doing so well with this mind zone topic of yours on this occasion, as you are rejecting all your available opportunities to discuss the points you have raised, which sort of goes against all your earlier goals for this section
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