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Post by zanygame on Jul 17, 2023 20:30:34 GMT
No one is saying it was not hot however breaking the magic 40 in an official weather station has all the hallmarks of a political record and not an actual one I believe records were broken and 40C exceeded in multiple locations. Backwash from jet planes and urban heat islands can not explain away all those recordings. Don't be so sure.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2023 20:33:22 GMT
That's what I said, and all the other receding glaciers have their own personal reasons . Nothing to do with getting warmer. I think Nature magazine picked these as a typical example. There's not much soot in Austria but I believe they are receding as a result of being warn away by skiers. I'm awaiting the study results. Arctic ice is melting because of the enormous increase in Polar bears and their hot breath. So endeth the Mind Zone's reasoned debate that I did not push for but was happy to partake in. Maybe you keep ending up at this point because you aren't discussing climate change correctly. You probably added too many variables, which end up becoming too complex for such a complex system.
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Post by sandypine on Jul 17, 2023 21:12:08 GMT
So endeth the Mind Zone's reasoned debate that I did not push for but was happy to partake in. Reasoned debate? You are asked about glacial recession across the planet and reply that some glaciers on the lower slopes of the Himalayas are receding because of soot. You are told of record breaking temperatures across the planet and you blame tarmac. Its pointed out that its hot where the tarmac isn't and you say they're lying. We obviously have very different ideas of reason. NASA mentioned soot are they wrong to so do? What record breaking temperatures have actually occurred yet and when they do will they be in the cities and be obtained from weather stations that 'deniers' will not be able to point to and say 'wait a minute'. Where is it hot where the Tarmac is not in terms of records? Being 'told' about something does not mean I should accept that the unvarnished truth and the history of teh global warming narrative has had many hiccups
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Post by sandypine on Jul 17, 2023 21:24:25 GMT
I believe records were broken and 40C exceeded in multiple locations. Backwash from jet planes and urban heat islands can not explain away all those recordings. Don't be so sure. Locations give you information the record was at a live airport, the next down was at Heathrow, the hottest minimum was at Kenley in South London, the hottest night was in Charlwood which is, wait for it, less than 1Km from the end of Gatwick's runway. If records are being compared with what temperatures we had in the past, and that is the basis of the AGW claim, then we alos have to consider what other factors may affect the modern temperatures.
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Post by steppenwolf on Jul 18, 2023 5:55:43 GMT
Another factor is that modern methods of temperature recording are much faster than in the past, so they can record, for example, transient high temperatures like when a jet aircraft lands. There are also many more of these weather stations, especially in urban areas.
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Post by zanygame on Jul 18, 2023 6:19:20 GMT
Reasoned debate? You are asked about glacial recession across the planet and reply that some glaciers on the lower slopes of the Himalayas are receding because of soot. You are told of record breaking temperatures across the planet and you blame tarmac. Its pointed out that its hot where the tarmac isn't and you say they're lying. We obviously have very different ideas of reason. NASA mentioned soot are they wrong to so do? What record breaking temperatures have actually occurred yet and when they do will they be in the cities and be obtained from weather stations that 'deniers' will not be able to point to and say 'wait a minute'. Where is it hot where the Tarmac is not in terms of records? Being 'told' about something does not mean I should accept that the unvarnished truth and the history of teh global warming narrative has had many hiccups Of course NASA nor you are wrong to mention Soot. Where you are wrong is to pretend that means global warming isn't happening. Or that this is the only reason the lower Himalayan glaciers are receding. Record temperatures have been broken in dozens of places across the planet. AND THAT is the critical thing, these are not an unusual set of weather conditions in one area, this is global. The hottest ever recorded in Europe was in 2021 (only two years ago) China has recorded its hottest ever temperature this year at 52.2c Searching the internet for exceptions to the rule is not reasoned conversation. Pretending that these odd anomalies you find cast doubt on the other tons of evidence out there is duplicitous. Then we have people asking why the weather was different 300,000,000 years ago when the continents weren't even in the same place, or why we had a warm period in one part of Europe a thousand years ago as if these unusual events might explain what we see today, time and again despite being given the reasons for these events and the reasons for the current ones. Or pretending Co2 is good for the planet and plants will thrive making life better for the mammals. Its all just smoke and mirrors and deserves similar quality answers.
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Post by zanygame on Jul 18, 2023 6:21:56 GMT
Another factor is that modern methods of temperature recording are much faster than in the past, so they can record, for example, transient high temperatures like when a jet aircraft lands. There are also many more of these weather stations, especially in urban areas. And we have stainless steel which is shiny and can reflect sunlight away.
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Post by Pacifico on Jul 18, 2023 6:29:20 GMT
Forcasting a new record high temperature of 43c in Rome today.
The previous record of 42c was set in 1841
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Post by zanygame on Jul 18, 2023 6:36:06 GMT
Locations give you information the record was at a live airport, the next down was at Heathrow, the hottest minimum was at Kenley in South London, the hottest night was in Charlwood which is, wait for it, less than 1Km from the end of Gatwick's runway. If records are being compared with what temperatures we had in the past, and that is the basis of the AGW claim, then we alos have to consider what other factors may affect the modern temperatures. Absolutely and the world shares that thermometer on the roof of Heathrow Here's a photo of it.
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Post by johnofgwent on Jul 18, 2023 7:23:54 GMT
I remember the insanely hot heatwave from last summer. and i remember 1976 which while a full degree lower in dad’s greenhouse than last year’s was in mine ladted a bloody sight longer.
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Post by johnofgwent on Jul 18, 2023 7:27:40 GMT
I see the temperatures in Death Valley have drawn a crowd of sun seekers keen to experience it.
Was it Noel Coward who wrote of the habits of Mad Dogs and Englishmen. Seems another verse is needed. Or maybe the second verse if The Sun Has Got Its Hat On could be geographically relocated.
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Post by Pacifico on Jul 18, 2023 7:46:00 GMT
The solution to deaths from high temperatures is cheap energy - if only the government would take note.
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Post by johnofgwent on Jul 18, 2023 9:26:34 GMT
The solution to deaths from high temperatures is cheap energy - if only the government would take note. i presume you mean so you can run air conditioning ? I would have thought the answer was not to live there.
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Post by sandypine on Jul 18, 2023 9:33:08 GMT
NASA mentioned soot are they wrong to so do? What record breaking temperatures have actually occurred yet and when they do will they be in the cities and be obtained from weather stations that 'deniers' will not be able to point to and say 'wait a minute'. Where is it hot where the Tarmac is not in terms of records? Being 'told' about something does not mean I should accept that the unvarnished truth and the history of teh global warming narrative has had many hiccups Of course NASA nor you are wrong to mention Soot. Where you are wrong is to pretend that means global warming isn't happening. Or that this is the only reason the lower Himalayan glaciers are receding. Record temperatures have been broken in dozens of places across the planet. AND THAT is the critical thing, these are not an unusual set of weather conditions in one area, this is global. The hottest ever recorded in Europe was in 2021 (only two years ago) China has recorded its hottest ever temperature this year at 52.2c Searching the internet for exceptions to the rule is not reasoned conversation. Pretending that these odd anomalies you find cast doubt on the other tons of evidence out there is duplicitous. Then we have people asking why the weather was different 300,000,000 years ago when the continents weren't even in the same place, or why we had a warm period in one part of Europe a thousand years ago as if these unusual events might explain what we see today, time and again despite being given the reasons for these events and the reasons for the current ones. Or pretending Co2 is good for the planet and plants will thrive making life better for the mammals. Its all just smoke and mirrors and deserves similar quality answers. Several points that seem to need continual repetition. Where have I said global warming is not happening? Where have I said the only reason glaciers are retreating is soot? The thing is if you take a look at all the highest temperatures recorded a pattern starts to emerge that raises concerns that in any other walk of life would raise concerns as to the veracity of the values recorded and the legitimacy of their comparison to past temperatures and readings. There is also the situation where a reading stands for 100 years and suddenly it becomes a non reading and is expunged from the records so that a lower record can stand as the hottest. You are a businessman,if you base your business on the readings of temperatures available then you would ask questions as to how they were recorded, you would seek verification that they were traceable to national standards and you would wish to know if any other factors were involved. I used to inspect production plants of various sorts and verify the values they were recording and the units they were producing and quite often just a slight digging below the surface and questioning of staff highlighted problems with what they were producing. Temperature recording is no different and if one compares a temp 100 years ago of a station in an open field with temps recorded now from the same sited station now on the edge of an industrial estate and just outside an airport fence then there are reasons to suggest the comparison is not viable. Most especially with new instant response probes being used as opposed to slow response mercury or even spirit thermometers. The NOAA in teh US have sited new stations in pristine sites to try and negate this question and so far the stations they have record no temperature rise in the US since 2005. Yet we are still told the global temp increase is accelerating when even the last 8 years are below the 30 year average. The figures they are recording are not telling the tale they would have us believe. These are not a 'few anomalies' they are serious questions. They seem to be trying to sell us a pup where even the weather charts are a different hue as though something has happened other than a decision by someone to change the colours. It is a game with obvious plays.
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Post by sandypine on Jul 18, 2023 9:47:46 GMT
Locations give you information the record was at a live airport, the next down was at Heathrow, the hottest minimum was at Kenley in South London, the hottest night was in Charlwood which is, wait for it, less than 1Km from the end of Gatwick's runway. If records are being compared with what temperatures we had in the past, and that is the basis of the AGW claim, then we alos have to consider what other factors may affect the modern temperatures. Absolutely and the world shares that thermometer on the roof of Heathrow Here's a photo of it. Do not laugh here is one that actually fed into the 'warming' data. It was very far from being alone.
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