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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2023 14:37:44 GMT
I'm afraid that I consider quotes from the Guardian with less consideration than I might with quotes from the Beano. How about the Telegraph. "Paul Myners, former Telegraph journalist who helped Gordon Brown save Britain’s banks, dies aged 73" The Telegraph. FT any good. "Gordon Brown’s bank rescue plan has received rave reviews around the world. The Conservatives have given it their grudging support. Paul Krugman, the US economist and winner of the Nobel prize for economics, mused: “Has Gordon Brown saved the world financial system?”.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2023 14:48:59 GMT
Amonst the MANY news papers across the world who held up Gordon Brown as the man who showed the rest of the world what to do as the Bankng Crisis hit was The New York Times and Washington Post.
It is also correct that Nobel Prize winning economist Paul Krugman did praise Gordon Brown
(Wikipedia) " Krugman asserted that Brown "defined the character of the worldwide financial rescue effort" and urged British voters not to support the opposition Conservative Party in the 2010 general election, arguing their Party Leader David Cameron "has had little to offer other than to raise the red flag of fiscal panic"
In the days immediately after Gordon Brown announced his plan of action, the US President "George Bush" followed suit, leading many commentators to declare that Gordon Brown led the way.
IT WORKED
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Post by om15 on Jun 25, 2023 15:12:36 GMT
Perhaps they might be wrong,
Wiki.
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Post by thomas on Jun 26, 2023 6:48:50 GMT
yawn. When asked a question about labour , labour supporters scream tory bad. Change the record ffs.
The dizzying dishonesty of Keir Starmer
The Labour leader has shredded just about every principle he ever claimed to hold.
Given all this pearl-clutching over the dishonesty of Johnson, often in relation to the sorts of fibs and spin politicians have always indulged in, it is striking just how muted the reaction has been to the even more flagrant deceptions of Sir Keir Starmer. Unlike Johnson, the Labour leader hasn’t simply made a series of bombastic, exaggerated statements – he has shredded just about every principle he once claimed to hold dear.
This week, Starmer admitted on BBC Radio 4’s Today programme that he will abandon his pledge to scrap university tuition fees – a promise he made to the Labour membership in 2020. Other pledges he has jettisoned from his Labour leadership campaign include nationalising the utilities firms, increasing income tax on high earners, keeping freedom of movement with the EU and banning outsourcing in the NHS.
The about-turns are dizzying. They are not just everyday untruths. Imagine if Boris had campaigned to Get Brexit Done, and instead took us into the Euro. That is the level of political deception Keir has stooped to. So where is all the anger from the chattering classes?
My point is, unfortunately, that a Labour government will be inherently better than the Tories. i choose neither . Being railroaded down a cul de sac by people like you with the false choice of picking between dumb and dumber is exactly why the uk is in the mess politically it is today.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2023 6:59:02 GMT
My point is, unfortunately, that a Labour government will be inherently better than the Tories. i choose neither . Being railroaded down a cul de sac by people like you with the false choice of picking between dumb and dumber is exactly why the uk is in the mess politically it is today.
What do you suggest is the answer then?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2023 7:38:29 GMT
I suppose that Keir Starmer could stick to the original promise of abolishing tuition fees, plus billions for the NHS, free cake tomorrow, open up the ever lasting cheque book.
But what about reality ?
I would far sooner trust any prospective Prime Minister who said that they cant do everything overnight, but what I do know is that a Labour government would be infinately more fairer than the Tories, and would priorotise the things which are important to ordinary people, and not the wealthy or big business.
You can only spend and borrow what the economic and financial landscape at the time dictates
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Post by thomas on Jun 26, 2023 7:46:49 GMT
i choose neither . Being railroaded down a cul de sac by people like you with the false choice of picking between dumb and dumber is exactly why the uk is in the mess politically it is today.
What do you suggest is the answer then? what do you mean what do i suggest? Thats up to the people in your country to sort out their parliament. When england is now the only nation in west or central europe without a form of pr ,perhaps thats a starting point.
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Post by jonksy on Jun 26, 2023 7:47:06 GMT
I suppose that Keir Starmer could stick to the original promise of abolishing tuition fees, plus billions for the NHS, free cake tomorrow, open up the ever lasting cheque book. But what about reality ? I would far sooner trust any prospective Prime Minister who said that they cant do everything overnight, but what I do know is that a Labour government would be infinately more fairer than the Tories, and would priorotise the things which are important to ordinary people, and not the wealthy or big business. You can only spend and borrow what the economic and financial landscape at the time dictates When have labour ever worried about what the country can afford fiddles? There is one thing for sure the country can't afford having smarmer infesting NO 10.
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Post by thomas on Jun 26, 2023 7:50:24 GMT
I suppose that Keir Starmer could stick to the original promise of abolishing tuition fees, plus billions for the NHS, free cake tomorrow, open up the ever lasting cheque book. But what about reality ? I would far sooner trust any prospective Prime Minister who said that they cant do everything overnight, but what I do know is that a Labour government would be infinately more fairer than the Tories, and would priorotise the things which are important to ordinary people, and not the wealthy or big business. You can only spend and borrow what the economic and financial landscape at the time dictates eh?
Lets wind back here sid regarding tuition fees. It was the labour party who specifically introduced them into scotland.
lets have a look at labours inglorious history and their outirght lies on tuition fees and why they shouldnt ever be trusted....
The facts about the history of tuition fees in Scotland are stark and unarguable:
– in 1997 when Labour came to power, higher education was free.
– the Labour government then introduced fees of £1000 a year across the UK, which meant a four-year degree in Scotland suddenly cost £4000.
– in 2000, the Labour-led Scottish Executive replaced said fees with a “graduate endowment”, meaning that Scottish students paid £2000 retrospectively towards the cost of their education – half of what it had cost them under Labour’s fees system in 1999, but still £2000 more than the £0 they’d been paying in 1997.
In the space of three years, then, while claiming to have “abolished” tuition fees, Labour had in fact increased the cost of a degree in Scotland from zero to £2000. Those are the cold, hard, unyielding truths.
Yet astonishingly, years later, the party’s education spokesman in Scotland is still trying to dance on the head of a semantic pin and insist that Labour abolished fees.
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Post by thomas on Jun 26, 2023 7:59:14 GMT
I suppose that Keir Starmer could stick to the original promise of abolishing tuition fees, plus billions for the NHS, free cake tomorrow, open up the ever lasting cheque book. But what about reality ? I would far sooner trust any prospective Prime Minister who said that they cant do everything overnight, but what I do know is that a Labour government would be infinately more fairer than the Tories, and would priorotise the things which are important to ordinary people, and not the wealthy or big business. You can only spend and borrow what the economic and financial landscape at the time dictates When have labour ever worried about what the country can afford fiddles? There is one thing for sure the country can't afford having smarmer infesting NO 10. Look at the pfi debt the last labour government left future generations to pay. They bankrupted glasgow city council , so much that council tax receipts couldnt cover debt interest after their 80 years in charge of my home city.
They spent millions fighting equal pay for glaswegian council workers , then when kicked out of power in glasgow , sided with the unions to attack the incoming council for problems they had caused in the first place.
Labours speciality is leaving ticking timebombs for other parties to deal with rather than worrying about what " cities , councils or countries " can afford.
If keir starmer had half a fucking brain he would never have made pledges he wasnt sure he could keep in the first place .Backtracking on them makes him no only look untrustworty , but completely stupid. Nick clegg is on the phone right now to starmer with a story about tuition fees.
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Post by Dogburger on Jun 26, 2023 8:14:58 GMT
What do you suggest is the answer then? what do you mean what do i suggest? Thats up to the people in your country to sort out their parliament. When england is now the only nation in west or central europe without a form of pr ,perhaps thats a starting point. We voted 7 years ago not to be like Europe . There is nothing wrong with our system its the people in it that is the problem . PR wouldn't change that ,you would still have the same people fecking it up . What we need I believe is less MP's on a wage that reflects their position (may attract the right people ) and a massively scaled down house of Lords that doesn't include failed MP's or anyone thats there because Daddy was . Im not against PR but lets drain the swamp first .
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Post by Vinny on Jun 26, 2023 8:24:49 GMT
Partly fixing a mess you yourself contributed to, is not a sign of success.
If you crash your car, and then repair it, it's not a sign that you're a good driver, you've still crashed your car.
Gordon Brown in his madness sold off our gold at rock bottom prices, raided pensions destroying the idea of a private pension's scheme as being a good investment.
The only only decent savings option available to people under New Labour, was buying houses. And that pushed house prices up by over £100k between 1997 and 2007. That level of a boom is unsustainable and went bust.
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Post by Fairsociety on Jun 26, 2023 8:40:08 GMT
There is a problem when a government is office for a long period of time, the Tories have been in for 13 years now, it's far too long.
They become complacent , or just plain fed up of being in power, and it shows.
The Tories appear to be stumbling around trying to please people who wouldn't vote for them anyway, they are caving in to the woke snowflakes, they don't appear to have any clout, and it's like they keep on having to ask permission for everything, give Thatcher her due, she didn't ask what she could do, she just told them she was doing it.
Johnson and Sunak are pondering to the woke snowflakes instead of getting on with what the many want, and not the few, and I dread to think if Labour get in, it's a nightmare.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2023 20:19:57 GMT
Tuition Fees
Personaly I do not believe that going to University should be free, I believe that students should pay something, a contribution, partly because it helps to keep the Drop-Out Rate down, but partly because later in life many or most of those students will be in a position, financialy, to make a contribution.
The Labour Party, like the SNP and Greens, and to a degree the Lib Dems are so called "Progressive" political parties - educated people with degrees and higher qualifacations usually = higher pay; Is it fair to expect that those on modest incomes and pay tax should fund (in full) an education which will enable someone one day,to earn a lot more than they do.
In other words its REASONABLE to ask students to retrospectively contribute something, when they are able to do so, I see nothing unfair about it.
The Labour government of Blair introduced fees capped at £3000, late TRIPLED by the Tories
My other argument is that by asking former students on decent incomes to contribute towards their fees, it frees up money to spend on priorities, which as far as both Labour and the SNP are concerned would be similar priorities, public services, local transport, and YES it would be good if more people in England on low incomes could get free prescriptions.
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Jun 26, 2023 20:56:03 GMT
I suppose that Keir Starmer could stick to the original promise of abolishing tuition fees, plus billions for the NHS, free cake tomorrow, open up the ever lasting cheque book. But what about reality ? I would far sooner trust any prospective Prime Minister who said that they cant do everything overnight, but what I do know is that a Labour government would be infinately more fairer than the Tories.... What you do know is nothing, as usual. Including how to use English.
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