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Post by bancroft on Jun 23, 2023 18:40:37 GMT
As recently as the seventies it was possible to start up a serious company in a back yard, garage or semi derelict stately pile Today the sheer amount of money needed to set up means it will not happen. The country has lost what made us ingenious, forever I've noticed a few interesting themes when looking at barn finds in the old car market shown on You Tube. a number seem to have been there as a side business to another business going on in prefabs with desks, chairs and in-trays that folded. They seemed to be located in semi-rural locations yet obviously went bust probably in the 80s. |
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Post by zanygame on Jun 23, 2023 18:50:22 GMT
The Chinese revolution has greatly lowered our prices, but the thing is it has lowered the prices of industrial machines by the same amount. This means that for a modest investment you could manufacture something. There is no reason why a Brit can't use the same resources available to the Chinese and use the same methods to get the same results. My belief is the reason they do not is their methods are different and they lack a proper education. It's not the government. Everyone tries to pass the buck to the government. but the costs of setting up that machine, staffing that factory, acquiring those materials, exporting that product and the amount you get ripped off at every stage make it impossible to defeat cheap Chinese imports at every level. Agreed, the only way we can compete on manufacture with China is to lower our standard of living and standards of safety to theirs. That or develop automation to another level. |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 23, 2023 18:52:09 GMT
Rural areas are good places to manufacture. There is more space. The houses are bigger, they are further way from each other regarding noise and generally speaking you can get away with a lot more than in some posh suburban area. Add to that low crime and a council who although carry out inspections of this and that, it has to be said anyone starting a serious manufacturing business, especially a high tec one, they will love to bits and go easy on you. There's a far more 'do as you please' attitude as long as it does not bother anyone else, hence you just have to not bother anyone else!
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 23, 2023 18:56:03 GMT
but the costs of setting up that machine, staffing that factory, acquiring those materials, exporting that product and the amount you get ripped off at every stage make it impossible to defeat cheap Chinese imports at every level. Agreed, the only way we can compete on manufacture with China is to lower our standard of living and standards of safety to theirs. That or develop automation to another level. If you are the manufacturer that is your job regarding safety. I think their machines are fairly safe, but if you are not happy you can modify them until they are. For example you would want a kill switch on the cover of some laser cutter and stuff like that. This is what they do - customise until it fits their requirements. |
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Post by zanygame on Jun 23, 2023 19:03:08 GMT
Agreed, the only way we can compete on manufacture with China is to lower our standard of living and standards of safety to theirs. That or develop automation to another level. If you are the manufacturer that is your job regarding safety. I think their machines are fairly safe, but if you are not happy you can modify them until they are. For example you would want a kill switch on the cover of some laser cutter and stuff like that. This is what they do - customise until it fits their requirements. Don't be simple Baron. UK safety is far more than making a machine safe. Its everything from checking your building for asbestos, to weekly, monthly and annual checks on everything from your extension leads to your floor cleaner. Its about 4 people needed to clean your gutters and two people to change a light bulb. |
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Post by Toreador on Jun 23, 2023 19:04:11 GMT
Agreed, the only way we can compete on manufacture with China is to lower our standard of living and standards of safety to theirs. That or develop automation to another level. If you are the manufacturer that is your job regarding safety. I think their machines are fairly safe, but if you are not happy you can modify them until they are. For example you would want a kill switch on the cover of some laser cutter and stuff like that. This is what they do - customise until it fits their requirements. Some insurers don't insure a piece of modified equipment but you only find out when someone is injured or killed and try to claim. |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 24, 2023 1:12:03 GMT
If you are the manufacturer that is your job regarding safety. I think their machines are fairly safe, but if you are not happy you can modify them until they are. For example you would want a kill switch on the cover of some laser cutter and stuff like that. This is what they do - customise until it fits their requirements. Some insurers don't insure a piece of modified equipment but you only find out when someone is injured or killed and try to claim. Insurers are bitches, about as bad as bankers. They believe they can dictate your business to you. Either shop around or don't get insured. In fact I've often wondered if I would be better off seeing if I could bank with a Chinese bank. Everything there works efficiently, sensibly and cheaply, with none of this hidden charges and other stings. it's just their business culture. They probably do insurance as well. If not I guess that will be on their list of Western shit industries they can buy up and run properly! |
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Post by johnofgwent on Jun 24, 2023 6:38:07 GMT
Rural areas are good places to manufacture. There is more space. The houses are bigger, they are further way from each other regarding noise and generally speaking you can get away with a lot more than in some posh suburban area. Add to that low crime and a council who although carry out inspections of this and that, it has to be said anyone starting a serious manufacturing business, especially a high tec one, they will love to bits and go easy on you. There's a far more 'do as you please' attitude as long as it does not bother anyone else, hence you just have to not bother anyone else! well i look forward to watching you try to get your change of use planning apication past the planning Nazis. It was quite easy for grandad to donthis in what was then the wilds of Essex around Ilford. How’s it goung for Clarkson’s Farm eh ? |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 24, 2023 10:43:43 GMT
Rural areas are good places to manufacture. There is more space. The houses are bigger, they are further way from each other regarding noise and generally speaking you can get away with a lot more than in some posh suburban area. Add to that low crime and a council who although carry out inspections of this and that, it has to be said anyone starting a serious manufacturing business, especially a high tec one, they will love to bits and go easy on you. There's a far more 'do as you please' attitude as long as it does not bother anyone else, hence you just have to not bother anyone else! well i look forward to watching you try to get your change of use planning apication past the planning Nazis. It was quite easy for grandad to donthis in what was then the wilds of Essex around Ilford. How’s it goung for Clarkson’s Farm eh ? The simple answer is you don't. Cottage industries are industries that start in the home and you are allowed to run a business from your home as long as you don't make noise that pisses off the neighbours. I've been watching some folk take delivery of some of these machines and yes you do need to do some mods. There was a laser cutter with a very noisy extraction fan. You unbolt it and bolt in a super quiet one. The trick every time is you use your ability to design, build and adapt to create your factory as well as your product. With safety concerns, officials need to give real reasons why something is dangerous. For me I can work with this as it all makes sense and is of a technical nature. If the reason wont stand up in court then the official does not have the power to dictate it. I think you just need a bit of a tougher approach. This game is not for snowflakes. Inspectors can push their power beyond their remit, but only if they think you don't understand the law. Anyhow as I pointed out, this part of the world you tend not to get such arseholes in official positions. The number one rule is don't piss anyone off so there is no need to look too deeply. Like don't employ the wrong type who bites the hand that feeds him - you want to pre-empt that. |
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Post by bancroft on Jun 24, 2023 10:51:10 GMT
Rural areas are good places to manufacture. There is more space. The houses are bigger, they are further way from each other regarding noise and generally speaking you can get away with a lot more than in some posh suburban area. Add to that low crime and a council who although carry out inspections of this and that, it has to be said anyone starting a serious manufacturing business, especially a high tec one, they will love to bits and go easy on you. There's a far more 'do as you please' attitude as long as it does not bother anyone else, hence you just have to not bother anyone else! well i look forward to watching you try to get your change of use planning apication past the planning Nazis. It was quite easy for grandad to donthis in what was then the wilds of Essex around Ilford. How’s it goung for Clarkson’s Farm eh ? I haven't followed Clarkson much, yet did notice Richard Hammond bought a massive mechanics workshop somewhere in an industrial site in a semi-rural location where there were other large warehouse type buildings. Of course his thing was repairing and rebuilding cars. In theory it would appear suitable for manufacturing yet not sure how council or government agencies would react if chimneys were extracting gasses from molding plastics or melding metals. This was Hammond's program set in Heredfordshire www.imdb.com/title/tt14906022/ |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 24, 2023 12:12:11 GMT
well i look forward to watching you try to get your change of use planning apication past the planning Nazis. It was quite easy for grandad to donthis in what was then the wilds of Essex around Ilford. How’s it goung for Clarkson’s Farm eh ? I haven't followed Clarkson much, yet did notice Richard Hammond bought a massive mechanics workshop somewhere in an industrial site in a semi-rural location where there were other large warehouse type buildings. Of course his thing was repairing and rebuilding cars. In theory it would appear suitable for manufacturing yet not sure how council or government agencies would react if chimneys were extracting gasses from molding plastics or melding metals. This was Hammond's program set in Heredfordshire www.imdb.com/title/tt14906022/This is where our country goes so very wrong. He is set himself up as teacher to the proles.
He is not a manufacturer but an artist.
I want to show you a small Chinese manufacturer who actually makes things. If you have the patience to listen all the way through you will get what I'm on about. It is the way he thinks which is important here. He's not thinking about if his hair looks right.
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Post by bancroft on Jun 24, 2023 12:22:41 GMT
I wasn't offering Hammond as a successful role model, no far from it more this was about the type of location that might be feasible to manufacture starting on a small scale.
I do however think that local authorities might come down like a ton of bricks if a business operation creates air toxins.
About a decade ago we were being shaped to be a tourist zone with only green enterprises under one form of the EU experiment. Poland was being created as the EU workshop.
I wonder if the green enterprise thinking will still crush manufacturing initiatives.
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Post by besoeker3 on Jun 24, 2023 12:38:08 GMT
Rural areas are good places to manufacture. There is more space. The houses are bigger, they are further way from each other regarding noise and generally speaking you can get away with a lot more than in some posh suburban area. Add to that low crime and a council who although carry out inspections of this and that, it has to be said anyone starting a serious manufacturing business, especially a high tec one, they will love to bits and go easy on you. There's a far more 'do as you please' attitude as long as it does not bother anyone else, hence you just have to not bother anyone else! A sa matter of interest have you engaged in a cottage industry in a rural area? |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 24, 2023 13:03:39 GMT
I wasn't offering Hammond as a successful role model, no far from it more this was about the type of location that might be feasible to manufacture starting on a small scale. I do however think that local authorities might come down like a ton of bricks if a business operation creates air toxins. About a decade ago we were being shaped to be a tourist zone with only green enterprises under one form of the EU experiment. Poland was being created as the EU workshop. I wonder if the green enterprise thinking will still crush manufacturing initiatives. If you are dealing with hazardous gasses you need a filtration system. This is why you don't follow that monkey Hammond. It really isn't that hard. All these standards deal with numbers and so do the suppliers of air filters or anything else you might need. Actually the law on this goes right back in time to common law of trespass. Trespass is a far broader term than someone on someone else's land. It applied to anything, be that a gas, a liquid, a noise, like anything bad emanating from one's land onto another one's land is within the scope of that tort. If you don't bother other people then that's 99% of the law. Anything else you fight your corner. Indeed most of the trouble with health and safety comes from inspectors going beyond their remit, either through ignorance or they don't like the look of you. They only get called out if someone calls them and no one will unless your business affects them. |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 24, 2023 13:05:26 GMT
Rural areas are good places to manufacture. There is more space. The houses are bigger, they are further way from each other regarding noise and generally speaking you can get away with a lot more than in some posh suburban area. Add to that low crime and a council who although carry out inspections of this and that, it has to be said anyone starting a serious manufacturing business, especially a high tec one, they will love to bits and go easy on you. There's a far more 'do as you please' attitude as long as it does not bother anyone else, hence you just have to not bother anyone else! A sa matter of interest have you engaged in a cottage industry in a rural area? I don't talk about my business online. I do live in a rural area though. |
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