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Post by Einhorn on May 16, 2023 9:30:29 GMT
I'm prepared to extend ordinary courtesies to other users. But not you, Klan Dan. I draw the line at people who sneeringly post pictures of Nazis murdering innocent people. However you addressed the original post to me and I have seen no evidence other than a documentary about a couple of years ago. What do you want me to do? I've watched many TV programmes, I don't remember the name of all of them. The documentary showed that secret operatives were trained to torture, mutilate and to kill the innocent. They were instructed to kill British people who might have had information that was useful to the Nazis. It didn't matter that these people were innocents who had no intention of assisting the Nazis. |
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Post by sandypine on May 16, 2023 9:31:42 GMT
Not true. Universal male suffrage was introduced in 1919, the Empire did not begin to contract until 1947. Depends how you define the Empire. Ireland broke away from the UK very soon after the ordinary man obtained the franchise. There was no public support for a continued war with the Irish. Public support doesn't matter when the ordinary person doesn't have a vote. It was British public pressure that stopped many things, the black and tans in Ireland and, well before 1919, the concentration camps in South Africa. Having the vote is not the same as exerting pressure, in fact sometimes having the vote tempers the use of public pressure. |
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Post by Dan Dare on May 16, 2023 9:31:56 GMT
The customary rule of forum etiquette requires that, if challenged, the onus to substantiate it is on the person who makes a claim. I'm prepared to extend ordinary courtesies to other users. But not you, Klan Dan. I draw the line at people who sneeringly post pictures of Nazis murdering innocent people. Is this what you're chuntering about?
Note the source.
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Post by Einhorn on May 16, 2023 9:34:54 GMT
I'm prepared to extend ordinary courtesies to other users. But not you, Klan Dan. I draw the line at people who sneeringly post pictures of Nazis murdering innocent people. Is this what you're chuntering about?
Note the source.
I'm referring to the time you sneeringly posted pictures of a mass hanging of Jewish concentration camp prisoners. |
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Post by Einhorn on May 16, 2023 9:35:45 GMT
Depends how you define the Empire. Ireland broke away from the UK very soon after the ordinary man obtained the franchise. There was no public support for a continued war with the Irish. Public support doesn't matter when the ordinary person doesn't have a vote. It was British public pressure that stopped many things, the black and tans in Ireland and, well before 1919, the concentration camps in South Africa. Having the vote is not the same as exerting pressure, in fact sometimes having the vote tempers the use of public pressure. We'll just put it down to coincidence, then, Sandy.  |
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Post by sandypine on May 16, 2023 9:37:54 GMT
However you addressed the original post to me and I have seen no evidence other than a documentary about a couple of years ago. What do you want me to do? I've watched many TV programmes, I don't remember the name of all of them. The documentary showed that secret operatives were trained to torture, mutilate and to kill the innocent. They were instructed to kill British people who might have had information that was useful to the Nazis. It didn't matter that these people were innocents who had no intention of assisting the Nazis. All I am saying it does not make it so because you said it, I have had to quote pages in books on this thread because people said if I could not prove it it was not so. Having said that I can believe it as war is a dirty business. All I have ever contended is that the British Empire was better than most and not universally a bad thing. Those those select all the bad bits are doing just that, being selective in their historical narrative to paint a picture they wish to paint which is effectively a false one. |
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Post by Einhorn on May 16, 2023 9:42:11 GMT
What do you want me to do? I've watched many TV programmes, I don't remember the name of all of them. The documentary showed that secret operatives were trained to torture, mutilate and to kill the innocent. They were instructed to kill British people who might have had information that was useful to the Nazis. It didn't matter that these people were innocents who had no intention of assisting the Nazis. All I am saying it does not make it so because you said it, I have had to quote pages in books on this thread because people said if I could not prove it it was not so. Having said that I can believe it as war is a dirty business. All I have ever contended is that the British Empire was better than most and not universally a bad thing. Those those select all the bad bits are doing just that, being selective in their historical narrative to paint a picture they wish to paint which is effectively a false one. No, my or your saying something doesn't make it so. We can take that as a given. That said, you can find out what you need to know with the assistance of Google. I don't disagree that the British Empire might have been better than most. Britain's elites offered the Fred West Empire model. Other less kindly nations, like Japan and Turkey, offered the Harold Shipman model. |
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Post by Dan Dare on May 16, 2023 9:46:35 GMT
Is this what you're chuntering about?
Note the source.
I'm referring to the time you sneeringly posted pictures of a mass hanging of Jewish concentration camp prisoners. I don't have such pictures, and never have. |
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Post by Einhorn on May 16, 2023 9:49:45 GMT
I'm referring to the time you sneeringly posted pictures of a mass hanging of Jewish concentration camp prisoners. I don't have such pictures, and never have. LOL! Google had them. And you posted disgusting gloating pictures of Jews being mass murdered. |
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Post by sandypine on May 16, 2023 9:50:30 GMT
All I am saying it does not make it so because you said it, I have had to quote pages in books on this thread because people said if I could not prove it it was not so. Having said that I can believe it as war is a dirty business. All I have ever contended is that the British Empire was better than most and not universally a bad thing. Those those select all the bad bits are doing just that, being selective in their historical narrative to paint a picture they wish to paint which is effectively a false one. No, my or your saying something doesn't make it so. We can take that as a given. That said, you can find out what you need to know with the assistance of Google. I don't disagree that the British Empire might have been better than most. Britain's elites offered the Fred West Empire model. Other less kindly nations, like Japan and Turkey, offered the Harold Shipman model. Fred West did not build roads, bridges and railways nor drainage nor provide a legal and educational framework. The poor Indian was better off in terms of his living and more fairly treated by the State than he had been before the Empire. Of course millions of widows were grateful not to be burnt alive on their husbands funeral pyres and many hundreds of thousands of travellers were not strangled by the thugs. So I think Fred West is a bit of a game playing on your part not really grounded in reality. |
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Post by Einhorn on May 16, 2023 9:57:06 GMT
No, my or your saying something doesn't make it so. We can take that as a given. That said, you can find out what you need to know with the assistance of Google. I don't disagree that the British Empire might have been better than most. Britain's elites offered the Fred West Empire model. Other less kindly nations, like Japan and Turkey, offered the Harold Shipman model. Fred West did not build roads, bridges and railways nor drainage nor provide a legal and educational framework. The poor Indian was better off in terms of his living and more fairly treated by the State than he had been before the Empire. Of course millions of widows were grateful not to be burnt alive on their husbands funeral pyres and many hundreds of thousands of travellers were not strangled by the thugs. So I think Fred West is a bit of a game playing on your part not really grounded in reality. The Indians built those roads, bridges and railways at the command of a British elite who wished to plunder their nation of its resources. Don't talk of schools when children of school age were being hanged in the UK for stealing bread under Britain's Bloody Code. The ordinary British person was just as oppressed by Britain's elite as those in the Empire. The elite divided the British underclass and conquered. They did the same in the Empire. When someone like Rees-Mogg tells you to be proud of Empire, he really means be proud of the fact that Brits were nothing but cannon fodder for their masters, who lived in slum conditions, and were shit upon from just as great a height as those in 'The Empire'. |
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Post by Dan Dare on May 16, 2023 9:59:17 GMT
I don't have such pictures, and never have. LOL! Google had them. And you posted disgusting gloating pictures of Jews being mass murdered. Can you provide a link to such a post? Or is it like your story about British operatives being instructed to mutilate German occupiers a figment of your febrile imagination and so just as ephemeral? |
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Post by sandypine on May 16, 2023 10:04:29 GMT
Fred West did not build roads, bridges and railways nor drainage nor provide a legal and educational framework. The poor Indian was better off in terms of his living and more fairly treated by the State than he had been before the Empire. Of course millions of widows were grateful not to be burnt alive on their husbands funeral pyres and many hundreds of thousands of travellers were not strangled by the thugs. So I think Fred West is a bit of a game playing on your part not really grounded in reality. The Indians built those roads, bridges and railways at the command of a British elite who wished to plunder their nation of its resources. Don't talk of schools when children of school age were being hanged in the UK for stealing bread under Britain's Bloody Code. The ordinary British person was just as oppressed by Britain's elite as those in the Empire. The elite divided the British underclass and conquered. They did the same in the Empire. When someone like Rees-Mogg tells you to be proud of Empire, he really means be proud of the fact that Brits were nothing but cannon fodder for their masters, who lived in slum conditions, and were shit upon from just as great a height as those in 'The Empire'. Notwithstanding the fact that much of what you say has legs but in the same period you refer to vast UK sewage and clean drinking water schemes were put in place, public health was placed high on the agenda with hospitals and sanitoriums being built, easy transport for the working man was enabled by parliament and prison reform was well under way. This is my point you are selectively choosing the bad with no mitigation as regards the good. |
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Post by Einhorn on May 16, 2023 10:06:39 GMT
LOL! Google had them. And you posted disgusting gloating pictures of Jews being mass murdered. Can you provide a link to such a post? Or is it like your story about British operatives being instructed to mutilate German occupiers a figment of your febrile imagination and so just as ephemeral? No, I can't. Do you deny posting pictures of mass hangings of Jews. You referred to them as k*kes. |
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Post by Einhorn on May 16, 2023 10:08:15 GMT
The Indians built those roads, bridges and railways at the command of a British elite who wished to plunder their nation of its resources. Don't talk of schools when children of school age were being hanged in the UK for stealing bread under Britain's Bloody Code. The ordinary British person was just as oppressed by Britain's elite as those in the Empire. The elite divided the British underclass and conquered. They did the same in the Empire. When someone like Rees-Mogg tells you to be proud of Empire, he really means be proud of the fact that Brits were nothing but cannon fodder for their masters, who lived in slum conditions, and were shit upon from just as great a height as those in 'The Empire'. Notwithstanding the fact that much of what you say has legs but in the same period you refer to vast UK sewage and clean drinking water schemes were put in place, public health was placed high on the agenda with hospitals and sanitoriums being built, easy transport for the working man was enabled by parliament and prison reform was well under way. This is my point you are selectively choosing the bad with no mitigation as regards the good. As I said, Fred West versus Harold Shipman. The former was a saint compared to the latter. That doesn't mean he wasn't a c*nt. |
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