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Post by zanygame on Apr 14, 2023 21:37:10 GMT
Well mine is based on actual usage of the NHS - what is your based on? The actual usage of the NHS.
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Post by oracle75 on Apr 14, 2023 21:38:50 GMT
There is something utterly irrelevant about unknown sources and projections over multiple countries in a very unstable, fast changing economic world. Is this what you mean by common sense??
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Post by Red Rackham on Apr 14, 2023 23:12:27 GMT
There is something utterly irrelevant about unknown sources and projections over multiple countries in a very unstable, fast changing economic world. Is this what you mean by common sense?? What you're describing there are IMF forecasts. Here to help.
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Post by zanygame on Apr 15, 2023 5:46:48 GMT
The NHS is already hugely privatised, from suppliers to agency staff. It just isnt visible because it doesnt win any votes. Having used both systems and without going into detail, i have a range of choices as to how much i pay and for what. Cancer and heart are free. I then can chooose to "buy" such things as radiography, echography, osteopathy including hip and knee replacements, hospitalisation, a wide range of surgery, eye, teeth and hearing care and a private hospital room, nursing care at home, physiotherapy at home, blood tests and results by internet at home, doctors appointments, meals and cleaners at home plus almost all medication, for around 1000 euros a year paid monthly. Plus any ambulance or taxi travel i needed. My husband was once airlifted by helicopter on a two hour journey.When i worked in the UK i paid around that in National Insurance. And got nothing like this. What I got was hours in A and E and weeks or months of waiting to see a consultant, never mind the tests and xrays afterwards. Instead of being offered nursing care at home i was sent away with a box of paracetamol and told to make a doctors appointment if i needed to. Which took days or even weeks to start all over again. I have run the gamut of using the health service here and it is wonderful. At every stage i was given the personal details of doctors and nurses if i needed them. They could always find me time to discuss my husbands issues when i visited the wards. In an emergency at home an ambulance arrived within 15 minutes. If the UK could provide anything close to that without privatisation and personal insurance topping out national insurance, it wouldnt be having doctors and nurses on strike and people in long term pain at home. The NHS does not and cannot supply a proper and complete health service free at the point of use. NI cant possibly cover it and anyway that is in fact a tax. The money the government says it invests in the NHS is also tax money. And if it chooses to use it to pay for private services it will. And does. And you will never know. How do you think Specsavers is so successful? It is a private company which would be supported by taxation in France and therefore prices would fall. The idea of a free NHS is a magicians trick, hiding cards up sleeves and getting you to look the other way. I see no reason why the NHS should not use private services. Why it cant negotiate good contractual terms at competitive prices. Then maybe the UK could pay its staff a proper wage and not suffer extended strikes. What happens to you if you can't afford £1,000 annual insurance?
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Post by oracle75 on Apr 15, 2023 8:14:34 GMT
What happens if you cant afford NI?
Those who are not working are supported by the state.
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Post by oracle75 on Apr 15, 2023 8:16:17 GMT
There is something utterly irrelevant about unknown sources and projections over multiple countries in a very unstable, fast changing economic world. Is this what you mean by common sense?? What you're describing there are IMF forecasts. Here to help. Acknowleged as only a general guide and never as accurate.
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Post by oracle75 on Apr 15, 2023 8:28:39 GMT
I dont know hoq much of the national taxation is in the French budget but i can confirm after speaking to my insurance company that all the benefits i listed will cost around 1000 euros a year, or less than 100 euros per month. Some in the UK pay more than that in prescription charges. The proportion of French tax revenue that goes into health is i am sure available online somewhere. Germany had the highest level of current healthcare expenditure among the EU Member States, valued at €432 billion in 2020. France recorded the second highest level of current healthcare expenditure (€281 billion), followed by Italy (€160 billion) and Spain (€120 billion). I believe the UK spends about 180 billion a year on the NHS and hopes it covers what other countries spend plus additional personal insurance. It just isnt sustainable. The government just cannot afford to shoulder the entire cost of the nation's health needs anymore. The quasi religious belief that state support alone can do this will begin to eat into other critical needs and the essential quality of life will diminish.
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Post by Vinny on Apr 15, 2023 8:38:06 GMT
Not seeing it - the IMF growth forecast for the next 5 years puts us pretty much in the centre of the pack for the G7, so (with obvious caveats to forecasts being wrong) I'd say we were doing so-so. Exactly, it's intermediate. No worse than the EU but Oracle and co. can't help themselves. Here's another graphic displaying with the UK outperforming the G7 if the US is excluded. Doesn't say much for the EU. Another sting in the tail for Europhiles: To sum it up, Europhiles talk a lot of horse manure when trying desperately to run the nation down because it left the EU. Interesting.
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Post by oracle75 on Apr 15, 2023 8:46:31 GMT
According to the last two graphs, business investment up to 2022 is only at the same level as 2019, so there has been no real growth post covid. The UK should be seeing further growth now, nearly 2 years after the pandemic. This accords with the recent analyses. What is the UK current economic growth? Monthly real gross domestic product (GDP) is estimated to have increased by 0.3% in January 2023 (Figure 1) following a fall of 0.5% in December 2022. Monthly GDP is now estimated to be 0.2% below its pre-coronavirus levels (February 2020).Mar 10, 2023 www.ons.gov.uk › bulletins GDP monthly estimate, UK: January 2023 - Office for National Statistics
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Post by zanygame on Apr 15, 2023 8:53:01 GMT
What happens if you cant afford NI? Those who are not working are supported by the state. Yes but you are describing a part state part private system. Why would anyone pay extra insurance for Radiography etc if its available free on the state? Unless you are simple saying you have the same system as the UK where you can pay to queue jump?
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Post by oracle75 on Apr 15, 2023 9:01:30 GMT
The state support for essential care for cancer and heart conditions applies to everyone. Essential care includes necessary scans etc allied to those conditions. State support for those on SMIC or state relief/ unemployment is monitored through tax returns and demands for benefits.
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Post by Vinny on Apr 15, 2023 9:04:40 GMT
Those who cannot afford national insurance are covered by those who can. The NHS is a social healthcare system.
IF the EU incorporates healthcare into the single market, they might go down the US route. If they do, every Europhile leftie who loved it because of free movement, would ditch it like a bucket of cold sick.
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Post by buccaneer on Apr 15, 2023 10:10:12 GMT
Exactly, it's intermediate. No worse than the EU but Oracle and co. can't help themselves. Here's another graphic displaying with the UK outperforming the G7 if the US is excluded. Doesn't say much for the EU. Another sting in the tail for Europhiles: To sum it up, Europhiles talk a lot of horse manure when trying desperately to run the nation down because it left the EU. Interesting. Nowhere near as bad as Europhiles would have you believe. Especially when they try and hitch everything negatively related to it to the UK leaving the EU.
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Post by Pacifico on Apr 15, 2023 11:48:08 GMT
Germany had the highest level of current healthcare expenditure among the EU Member States, valued at €432 billion in 2020. France recorded the second highest level of current healthcare expenditure (€281 billion), followed by Italy (€160 billion) and Spain (€120 billion). I believe the UK spends about 180 billion a year on the NHS and hopes it covers what other countries spend plus additional personal insurance. It just isnt sustainable. The government just cannot afford to shoulder the entire cost of the nation's health needs anymore. The quasi religious belief that state support alone can do this will begin to eat into other critical needs and the essential quality of life will diminish. In 2020 the UK spent more than the EU average on healthcare
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Post by Steve on Apr 15, 2023 13:51:36 GMT
Not seeing it - the IMF growth forecast for the next 5 years puts us pretty much in the centre of the pack for the G7, so (with obvious caveats to forecasts being wrong) I'd say we were doing so-so. Exactly, it's intermediate. No worse than the EU but Oracle and co. can't help themselves. Here's another graphic displaying with the UK outperforming the G7 if the US is excluded. Doesn't say much for the EU. . . . . Actually it just shows how your source of Briefings for Britain (the former Briefings for Brexit) are less than honest. The World Bank that knows that GDP growth by devaluing the currency is a fraud show it different when using a common reference currency value (US$) UK GDP in world comparable terms using a common reference currency *US$) Struggling for any real growth compared to 2015 Eurozone GDP in world comparable terms using a common reference currency *US$) Oh look big growth since 2015
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