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Post by Bentley on Apr 9, 2023 23:25:39 GMT
Google provided you with a quote from Churchill that you can’t prove he actually said . Ill repeat . National service was for about 2 years . The cheap Labour imported from the colonies is still with us . This is not from Churchill - www.jstor.org/stable/1810806I’m sure you believe everything that any British government tells you Red( and google apparently). I don’t have that problem . |
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Post by wapentake on Apr 9, 2023 23:50:43 GMT
And you can’t prove he didn’t,there was a labour shortage and one of parts of having an empire is that people from that empire came here,they fought for it in two world wars so what’s your problem? I can’t prove that you are not Meghan Markle but there is very little evidence to support it. My ‘problem’ is posted in my previous posts. Where did you get the idea that ‘ one of the parts of having an empire is that people from that empire came here ‘? . The idea of having an empire is that the subjects of the empire stay where they are ffs. 🙄 No it isn’t go look at the history of various empires Rome for instance they had many people from outside the empire there and successful too,a lot of Caesars weren’t even born there. The empire brought wealth and power to this country it also brought many of its people who contributed to that wealth and power so I ask again what’s the problem. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Apr 10, 2023 0:19:21 GMT
I can’t prove that you are not Meghan Markle but there is very little evidence to support it. My ‘problem’ is posted in my previous posts. Where did you get the idea that ‘ one of the parts of having an empire is that people from that empire came here ‘? . The idea of having an empire is that the subjects of the empire stay where they are ffs. 🙄 No it isn’t go look at the history of various empires Rome for instance they had many people from outside the empire there and successful too,a lot of Caesars weren’t even born there. The empire brought wealth and power to this country it also brought many of its people who contributed to that wealth and power so I ask again what’s the problem. Indeed, and both the Roman empire and the Ottoman empire are famous for bloodlust and brutality, and yet outraged lefties are not demanding they should be cancelled or the beneficiaries of those empires pay reparations or kneel and beg forgiveness. Yet, they do demand that the short lived British empire is cancelled, and that we pay reparations and beg forgiveness on bended knee. Are outraged lefties anarchists, or just ignorant? |
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Post by Bentley on Apr 10, 2023 6:01:37 GMT
I can’t prove that you are not Meghan Markle but there is very little evidence to support it. My ‘problem’ is posted in my previous posts. Where did you get the idea that ‘ one of the parts of having an empire is that people from that empire came here ‘? . The idea of having an empire is that the subjects of the empire stay where they are ffs. 🙄 No it isn’t go look at the history of various empires Rome for instance they had many people from outside the empire there and successful too,a lot of Caesars weren’t even born there. The empire brought wealth and power to this country it also brought many of its people who contributed to that wealth and power so I ask again what’s the problem. Nope. One of the consequences of having an empire is that subjects if the emperor sometimes become useful to the empire. It isn’t a ‘ part’ of it . The Empire brought wealth to the already wealthy. When Britain was the wealthiest and most powerful country in the world many ordinary British people were starving or living miserable and poor lives. The white working class were essentially no better off than the subjects of the empire thousands of miles away . |
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Post by Pacifico on Apr 10, 2023 6:59:22 GMT
I'm pretty gobsmacked that you cite the military as an example of a government service that is run well - it is currently a disaster zone than is short of everything (including manpower) and is thus no longer considered a Tier 1 operator. We currently have a Chief of the Air Staff who bizarrely believes his number one priority is to increase diversity - that is the level that we have been reduced to, over promoted yes men who will ignore military capability in a desire to hit Whitehall targets.. OK let’s take another angle,would you privatise the military? No - as I dont see that it would improve things. But your idea that the people who run the DVLA and the Passport Office will ensure that the Energy, Water supplies and Train services are efficient and well run is surely a joke? |
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Post by wapentake on Apr 10, 2023 8:35:21 GMT
No it isn’t go look at the history of various empires Rome for instance they had many people from outside the empire there and successful too,a lot of Caesars weren’t even born there. The empire brought wealth and power to this country it also brought many of its people who contributed to that wealth and power so I ask again what’s the problem. Indeed, and both the Roman empire and the Ottoman empire are famous for bloodlust and brutality, and yet outraged lefties are not demanding they should be cancelled or the beneficiaries of those empires pay reparations or kneel and beg forgiveness. Yet, they do demand that the short lived British empire is cancelled, and that we pay reparations and beg forgiveness on bended knee. Are outraged lefties anarchists, or just ignorant? This s the thing,the British empire was the worlds largest and most successful it made us who we are the legacy of that is the people who were invited here and paid their way contributed to the society we have now especially in areas like the health service. As to your further point I agree it was a history both good and bad and not just for the people on that empire but us too. As history it needs to be recognised not cancelled not altered nor apologised for I have had these arguments before,there are people in the UK who are self loathing often from the constituent nations who have nothing good to say and believe we should be ashamed,mention the history of other nations not just ancient but modern too perhaps Germany in the middle of the last century and oh dear me no that’s history how dare you mention that that happened a while ago nothing to be ashamed of there. As to lefty’s I dunno I’ve been called a lefty liberal and worse,I believe in fair play for all who now live here a cohesive society where people are identified for what they do and are not their skin colour black or white. If there are people who don’t want to be here that’s fine they can leave but our history cannot be changed we owe nobody anything and should be ashamed of nothing,the only ones we have an obligation to now are any dependent territories. The commonwealth has been a success countries joining who were never part of the empire that too though is changing since the death of Elizabeth the second and Charlie may well not take her place but that’s tomorrows history to come. |
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Post by wapentake on Apr 10, 2023 8:39:34 GMT
No it isn’t go look at the history of various empires Rome for instance they had many people from outside the empire there and successful too,a lot of Caesars weren’t even born there. The empire brought wealth and power to this country it also brought many of its people who contributed to that wealth and power so I ask again what’s the problem. Nope. One of the consequences of having an empire is that subjects if the emperor sometimes become useful to the empire. It isn’t a ‘ part’ of it . The Empire brought wealth to the already wealthy. When Britain was the wealthiest and most powerful country in the world many ordinary British people were starving or living miserable and poor lives. The white working class were essentially no better off than the subjects of the empire thousands of miles away . Yes they were useful and were invited here so are as much a part of the fabric of the society as we are,I don’t disagree wit much of the other you say. Can I refer you to the reply I made to Red Rackham for where I believe it all stands today. Thanks. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2023 8:42:56 GMT
No it isn’t go look at the history of various empires Rome for instance they had many people from outside the empire there and successful too,a lot of Caesars weren’t even born there. The empire brought wealth and power to this country it also brought many of its people who contributed to that wealth and power so I ask again what’s the problem. Indeed, and both the Roman empire and the Ottoman empire are famous for bloodlust and brutality, and yet outraged lefties are not demanding they should be cancelled or the beneficiaries of those empires pay reparations or kneel and beg forgiveness. Yet, they do demand that the short lived British empire is cancelled, and that we pay reparations and beg forgiveness on bended knee. Are outraged lefties anarchists, or just ignorant? They're extremist hypocrites, not anarchists, at least not in the true sense of the word. Like Islamists they love the chaos but only in the smash up stage, before they set up their authoritarian order. |
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Post by sheepy on Apr 10, 2023 8:43:41 GMT
Nope. One of the consequences of having an empire is that subjects if the emperor sometimes become useful to the empire. It isn’t a ‘ part’ of it . The Empire brought wealth to the already wealthy. When Britain was the wealthiest and most powerful country in the world many ordinary British people were starving or living miserable and poor lives. The white working class were essentially no better off than the subjects of the empire thousands of miles away . Yes they were useful and were invited here so are as much a part of the fabric of the society as we are,I don’t disagree wit much of the other you say. Can I refer you to the reply I made to Red Rackham for where I believe it all stands today. Thanks. Cohesive society became a long ago figment of the imagination, which doesn't take much working out. |
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Post by wapentake on Apr 10, 2023 8:49:46 GMT
OK let’s take another angle,would you privatise the military? No - as I dont see that it would improve things. But your idea that the people who run the DVLA and the Passport Office will ensure that the Energy, Water supplies and Train services are efficient and well run is surely a joke? Why is it a joke? Water gas and electricity were sold off that’s the joke on all of us. Shareholders first consumers last,sewage pumped in to rivers and the sea,the middle men in power what purpose do they serve other than to make a few rich there’s no real competition the so called regulators are a joke,you may have bad memories or the electric and gas boards but I don’t,the poor didn’t have to-pay more and upfront,we have been victims of a con trick. Furthermore for decades govts of all colours have failed to secure our future our energy security but are hell bent on us paying to save the planet when we if we ceased as a nation tomorrow and disappeared completely wouldn’t make a blind bit of difference to net zero. |
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Post by sandypine on Apr 10, 2023 8:55:22 GMT
No it isn’t go look at the history of various empires Rome for instance they had many people from outside the empire there and successful too,a lot of Caesars weren’t even born there. The empire brought wealth and power to this country it also brought many of its people who contributed to that wealth and power so I ask again what’s the problem. Nope. One of the consequences of having an empire is that subjects if the emperor sometimes become useful to the empire. It isn’t a ‘ part’ of it . The Empire brought wealth to the already wealthy. When Britain was the wealthiest and most powerful country in the world many ordinary British people were starving or living miserable and poor lives. The white working class were essentially no better off than the subjects of the empire thousands of miles away . Indeed and if one thinks carefully about it the Indian Army is upheld as the largest volunteer army fighting for the UK. The British Army had many conscripts and in the end National Servicemen. If the definition of slavery is being compelled to do that which you do not want to do at the behest of a master at risk to life and limb then slavery only ended in the UK in 1963 and was almost entirely composed of the white working class youth. |
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Post by sheepy on Apr 10, 2023 8:59:36 GMT
I’m sure you believe everything that any British government tells you Red( and google apparently). I don’t have that problem . No not a fecking word of it Bentley, as you asked. |
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Post by Pacifico on Apr 10, 2023 10:27:09 GMT
No - as I dont see that it would improve things. But your idea that the people who run the DVLA and the Passport Office will ensure that the Energy, Water supplies and Train services are efficient and well run is surely a joke? Why is it a joke? Water gas and electricity were sold off that’s the joke on all of us. Shareholders first consumers last,sewage pumped in to rivers and the sea,the middle men in power what purpose do they serve other than to make a few rich there’s no real competition the so called regulators are a joke,you may have bad memories or the electric and gas boards but I don’t,the poor didn’t have to-pay more and upfront,we have been victims of a con trick. Furthermore for decades govts of all colours have failed to secure our future our energy security but are hell bent on us paying to save the planet when we if we ceased as a nation tomorrow and disappeared completely wouldn’t make a blind bit of difference to net zero. Well I can only remind you that one of the main reasons for the privatisation of the water industry was that it failed to comply with EU water quality standards after decades of underfunding while State owned. Privatisation was needed to get the investment in from the private sector to bring the system up to date. So pardon me if I dont see Government control as the great solution to all our problems. I do fully agree with your last paragraph. |
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Post by Toreador on Apr 10, 2023 15:36:30 GMT
Why is it a joke? Water gas and electricity were sold off that’s the joke on all of us. Shareholders first consumers last,sewage pumped in to rivers and the sea,the middle men in power what purpose do they serve other than to make a few rich there’s no real competition the so called regulators are a joke,you may have bad memories or the electric and gas boards but I don’t,the poor didn’t have to-pay more and upfront,we have been victims of a con trick. Furthermore for decades govts of all colours have failed to secure our future our energy security but are hell bent on us paying to save the planet when we if we ceased as a nation tomorrow and disappeared completely wouldn’t make a blind bit of difference to net zero. Well I can only remind you that one of the main reasons for the privatisation of the water industry was that it failed to comply with EU water quality standards after decades of underfunding while State owned. Privatisation was needed to get the investment in from the private sector to bring the system up to date. So pardon me if I dont see Government control as the great solution to all our problems. I do fully agree with your last paragraph. Spot on. As an keen angler back in the day, our rivers were in a terrible state as were many of our lakes and other waterways. |
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Post by see2 on Apr 10, 2023 16:52:41 GMT
Well I can only remind you that one of the main reasons for the privatisation of the water industry was that it failed to comply with EU water quality standards after decades of underfunding while State owned. Privatisation was needed to get the investment in from the private sector to bring the system up to date. So pardon me if I dont see Government control as the great solution to all our problems. I do fully agree with your last paragraph. Spot on. As an keen angler back in the day, our rivers were in a terrible state as were many of our lakes and other waterways. It took 25 years of push by the EU to get our coastal waters safe for water sports etc. " In the 1980s, the British government tried to claim that the beaches of Brighton, Blackpool, Skegness and many other resorts weren’t used for bathing, to avoid dealing with the sewage, condoms and tampons that polluted them. Of the 27 beaches it agreed were used for swimming, nine were too dirty to reach the minimum bathing standard. Today, after legal action from the EU and directives on bathing water and urban waste water, 99% of the UK’s 632 designated beaches have been deemed safe for swimming. From Llandudno to Cromer, beaches that failed tests for faecal bacteria in 1988 are now rated as excellent, even though today’s standards are stricter than before. Blackpool South beach is awarded a blue flag for excellent sea water quality 95% of British beaches clean enough to swim, EU tests show Read more The improvement did not take place overnight. Even in 1995, more than half of England’s 370 beaches were blighted by unacceptable levels of pollution. It took successful court cases against the UK, such as one in 1993 over Blackpool’s seafront, to drive the clean-up. It also took £30bn of investment by water and waste companies over 20 years, pushed along by EU directives. Short sewage pipes that dumped their contents near the shore were a big problem, but the run-off of manure and agricultural chemicals from farms was also an issue. One popular beach affected was Bude, in Cornwall, but by 2015 its waters had improved enough to be judged “good”. The huge improvement in water quality has protected public health and the environment, and had an economic benefit. The seaside tourism industry is worth £3.6bn a year and supports 210,000 jobs in England and Wales alone. Surfers, who were regular observers of “floaters” from sewage outflows, are clear that EU action has been the key to the great British beach clean-up. Hugo Tagholm, chief executive of Surfers Against Sewage, said: “Over the last 25 years, EU directives have undoubtedly helped drive huge improvements.”
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