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Post by Steve on Oct 21, 2022 0:26:18 GMT
A large section of our problems are a result of our massive over-reaction to covid. . . Oh so you'd have let the NHS collapse and society soon after would you FFS just look at the case load figures from March/April 2020. We came damn close to those collapses but almost too late we locked down and reversed those appalling exponential rises. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Oct 21, 2022 0:32:05 GMT
Take a tip from Hercules who was tasked with cleaning out the Augean stables. Divert the Thames through the Palace of Westminster, flush the whole lot of them out (both sides of the House) and start again. Have you taken water quality tests of the Thames recently More shit and more coke than a House of Commons gents toilet That's diversity for you. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Oct 21, 2022 0:46:56 GMT
The government cant govern. People are gluing themselves to roads causing chaos, with impunity. We are being invaded daily, and reward them for doing so. The EU still governs us through N Ireland and legislation. Because we let them. Wokery is causing civil war, no one in government knows how to deal with it. Take one wrong step and hell breaks loose. We are bankrupt. The spectre of rule by dictatorship grows ever larger through the American democrats, the EU, socialism, China, and practically everyone else. Living in Britain will soon be like living under Putin, but in a woke way. Freedom shrinks daily. Watch what you say or think. Wear a headscarf to cover your hair, or we will kill you. Being white is a crime. You are guilty of everything because of your history. A christian christmas is forbidden. Business is a sin. No fracking, no oil. Alcoholism, drug addiction, dependancy in every way is ok. Lauded even as you are a victim. The rich are the enemy. Terrorists are saints fighting for freedom. Chaos is everywhere, the country is sinking head first. While parliament fights amongst itself. How did we get here? We are going to be living under a master sooner or later, democracy is finished, just look at our parliament, and the disaster of brexit and theresa May.etc. The need for freedom needs to be re mustered under another leader. And it will emerge. To lose again. Globalists, and there like will always prevail, to enslave us all for the benefit of the few. It is impossible for a large organisation, like the Eu etc, not to be stinkingly corrupt. It's the illness of woke. Yes covid cost £billions and Putin's adventures aren't helping. But the illness of woke has negatively affected this country more than anything in my lifetime. I would never have believed that men in dresses would be allowed into girls changing rooms, or critical race theory would be taught to children as fact, or 'white' people would be forced to do unconscious bias training which implies they are biased to begin with, or that we would see British police officers in uniform wearing rainbow helmets and dancing at gay pride events, or that senior politicians and police officers would kneel for a Marxist organisation whose core aim is to defund the police, and has since been outed as totally corrupt. Woke is an extremely damaging left-wing illness that like kneeling for BLM will eventually die. |
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Post by jonksy on Oct 21, 2022 1:25:30 GMT
A large section of our problems are a result of our massive over-reaction to covid. . . Oh so you'd have let the NHS collapse and society soon after would you FFS just look at the case load figures from March/April 2020. We came damn close to those collapses but almost too late we locked down and reversed those appalling exponential rises. Society would have collapsed if the so called experts had their way over nothing more than a poxy virus. Even bow they still harp on about another lockdown....There is not one peice of evidence that proves the lockdown worked along with wearing a face mask and social distancing. |
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Post by petenz on Oct 21, 2022 2:09:09 GMT
Society would have collapsed if the so called experts had their way over nothing more than a poxy virus. Even bow they still harp on about another lockdown....There is not one peice of evidence that proves the lockdown worked along with wearing a face mask and social distancing. Agree about the lockdown failure in the UK. This was due more to the on-again off-again confusing nature of the lockdown rules, the lack of enforcement and flouting of the rules by sections of the public more than any deficiencies in the methods adopted. The lockdown worked well here in NZ as the WHO figures show, with 1.8 million Covid cases resulting in 3129 deaths attributed to the virus. A subsequent study based on what could have been expected had NZ followed the same pattern as the UK showed we could have expected around 7000 deaths. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Oct 21, 2022 2:29:00 GMT
Thing is, it was something new. No one knew how to deal with it, it was guesswork based on the worst possible scenario. Politicians listened to 'experts' because that's what anyone would have done. Can you imagine the reaction if thousands of people had died because the government ignored expert advice. If it happens again, and it probably will, hopefully we'll be better prepared.
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Post by andrewbrown on Oct 21, 2022 3:04:18 GMT
Blimey. People think that "wokery" got us here. Let's just be clear, wokery just means caring about others. Anyone think that we got where we are whilst caring for others.
Nah, I don't think so either.
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Post by totheleft3 on Oct 21, 2022 4:09:03 GMT
How did we get in this mess because the fools voted the tories in
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Post by Pacifico on Oct 21, 2022 6:55:07 GMT
How did we get in this mess, because the alternative was even worse..
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Post by johnofgwent on Oct 21, 2022 7:26:55 GMT
A large section of our problems are a result of our massive over-reaction to covid. . . Oh so you'd have let the NHS collapse and society soon after would you FFS just look at the case load figures from March/April 2020. We came damn close to those collapses but almost too late we locked down and reversed those appalling exponential rises. To be honest Steve I look around me now and wonder if it was worth it. The NHS HAS collapsed and society is heading for the toilet. I saw the NHS up close and personal in December 2019 when it left my wife to die on the floor of our hallway leaving me and my daughter to do the job Maggie threw me on the dole for doing back in 81/82 and then her and everyone since taxed my arse off to pretend they were doing for me thereafter. I saw it again in jan 2021 when I was thrown out of A&E twice in a fortnight, first after admission for a lung problem and then a week later after admission for a stroke. On both times they threw me - and everyone else- out within two days fearing we would catch covid from the conditions in their plague pit The fact is the brand new hospital up the road has lots of shiny kit and no one trained to use it. And the fire doors don’t release in an emergency. If it catches fire it’ll be leppings lane (for the crush) and the other stadium that caught fire all over again. And conditions are barely better today. The reduction in capacity imposed “to prevent a meltdown” has caused England to endure delays not seen before outside Welsh labours incompetent fiefdom. |
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Post by Orac on Oct 21, 2022 8:27:52 GMT
Politicians listened to 'experts' because that's what anyone would have done. Can you imagine the reaction if thousands of people had died because the government ignored expert advice. This is the problem - the political atmosphere around the issue became extreme and was opportunistically used to trap the government in a no win scenario. The notion quickly became that, if deaths (in retrospect) were preventable by any means, then the government had killed those people by not employing those means. This is an absurd and unworkable standard that amounts to infinite claim for resources. The whole issue became politicised and we became trapped with bad policy that was almost certainly a gigantic over-reaction to an albeit quite serious problem. I feel the "three weeks to flatten the curve and give the NHS a chance to prepare" was a sensible hedge because we did not know yet what we were dealing with. When this 3 weeks became two months and it became obvious covid was not the Andromeda Strain, we were well into over-reaction territory that we couldn't afford. The experts are only experts in narrow fields - the advice of various narrow experts has to be incorporated into a hedge / judgment by someone who has a broader view and is accountable. An expert in viral transmission modelling, for instance, can not tell you how much damage a set of heavy restrictions will do to society - to our sense of community, to our children - and how that is going to compute to results 5 or 10 years down the line. |
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Post by jonksy on Oct 21, 2022 8:31:17 GMT
Blimey. People think that "wokery" got us here. Let's just be clear, wokery just means caring about others. Anyone think that we got where we are whilst caring for others. Nah, I don't think so either. I can't wait for your explanation on how trying to erase our history by pulling down statues or the changing of street name is helping others. |
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Post by sandypine on Oct 21, 2022 8:53:23 GMT
Blimey. People think that "wokery" got us here. Let's just be clear, wokery just means caring about others. Anyone think that we got where we are whilst caring for others. Nah, I don't think so either. I would dispute that wokery means caring for others I would suggest it is a passionate obsessive belief that one cares for others and one is going to make damn sure that everyone else observes the care one feels. In part we did get here 'caring' for others as we have distributed much of our current earned wealth to other countries and we accept large numbers of people 'in need' from other countries and fight tooth and nail to keep them here even if they do not deserve it. |
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Post by Cartertonian on Oct 21, 2022 9:04:50 GMT
Bentley (quoting G Michael Hopf) wrote:
What a disturbing and dystopian concept, written of course by an author of disturbing and dystopian science fiction literature. ‘Strong men’ create good times for their weak-minded acolytes…and grim, miserable times for normal people. Strong men like Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, Mao, Pol Pot, Pinochet, Putin, Kim et al relied on their ‘strength’ to impose their will. The dark age we may be heading into is one in which reason would give way to instinct and ‘strong men’ would once again try to impose their version of order, whether those being subjugated like it or not. Those times will only be ‘good’ for those with similarly disturbing and dystopian views.
Petenz wrote:
That would be good, but sadly it’s a fantasy. The US was founded by people who wanted to ‘start again’ and look where that has got them. We can’t start with a blank slate, we have to work with what we have.
Ergo, Pacifico was right when he wrote…
…but not in the way he thinks.
When, not if, Labour get back in they will probably govern quite sensibly for their first term, but even during that time their hardcore ideologues will be plotting a seismic shift to the left, just as the Tories’ hardcore ideologues tried (and now clearly failed) to instigate a seismic shift to the right. In any subsequent term, those ideologues would be seeking to bring those plots to fruition. And repeat when the Tories get back in…ad infinitum. We are in this mess because our anachronistic political system allows single parties with only minority support in the country to dominate politics and impose their will (see above).
There has been lots of talk recently about the need for stability…but if you step back and look at the last half a century rather than just the last few weeks or months, our system fosters perpetual instability. First-term governments of any stripe steady the ship as best they can, but then their own ideological wingnuts start pushing the more extreme end of their agenda. We are where we are now because that route eventually runs out of road, as the extreme agenda of either main party eventually becomes unacceptable to the majority.
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Post by Steve on Oct 21, 2022 18:46:21 GMT
Oh so you'd have let the NHS collapse and society soon after would you FFS just look at the case load figures from March/April 2020. We came damn close to those collapses but almost too late we locked down and reversed those appalling exponential rises. To be honest Steve I look around me now and wonder if it was worth it. The NHS HAS collapsed and society is heading for the toilet. I saw the NHS up close and personal in December 2019 when it left my wife to die on the floor of our hallway leaving me and my daughter to do the job Maggie threw me on the dole for doing back in 81/82 and then her and everyone since taxed my arse off to pretend they were doing for me thereafter. I saw it again in jan 2021 when I was thrown out of A&E twice in a fortnight, first after admission for a lung problem and then a week later after admission for a stroke. On both times they threw me - and everyone else- out within two days fearing we would catch covid from the conditions in their plague pit The fact is the brand new hospital up the road has lots of shiny kit and no one trained to use it. And the fire doors don’t release in an emergency. If it catches fire it’ll be leppings lane (for the crush) and the other stadium that caught fire all over again. And conditions are barely better today. The reduction in capacity imposed “to prevent a meltdown” has caused England to endure delays not seen before outside Welsh labours incompetent fiefdom. No John the NHS has not collapsed. It may not be meeting your or my expectations and occasionally fucks up completely but it it actually delivering a huge amount of healthcare and preventative medicine What Mags is wishing to deny it that on March 23rd 2020 it was looking at imminent total collapse with 14,000 deaths a day and well over a million cases wanting hospital treatment by April 20th if the exponential trippling per week was unchecked. Lockdown introduced that day made that check. |
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