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Post by Handyman on Feb 22, 2023 18:33:44 GMT
If you considered your ridiculous statement for one moment, you would realise that MI5 have stated that they have hard evidence that this person would be a threat to the security of the UK, therefore any trial would result in a substantial custodial sentence, paid for by my income tax. I am quite happy that she is left in a ramshackle and inhospitable tented camp, that was her choice and we should respect that. She has already cost the UK Taxpayers a fortune, according the London News this evening the Police, the Council and her school should have done something to stop her going , they stated that 30 young girls from the same part of London as her had their passports confiscated so they could not get to Syria. She was only 15 years of age, she allegedly was a bright student knew what she was doing, the age of Criminal Responsibility to know the difference between right and wrong is 10 years of age in the UK. According to the Journalist who has interviewed her a number of time in Syria, has stated at no time did she claim she had been trafficked until very recently , he considers her to be a manipulative liar |
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Post by Pacifico on Feb 22, 2023 18:38:16 GMT
She wanted to go and become a citizen of the foreign country - we should respect that decision.
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Post by sword on Feb 22, 2023 19:20:44 GMT
She wanted to go and become a citizen of the foreign country - we should respect that decision. She joined a terror gang in another Country she didn't want to be a citizen of Syria. |
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Post by sword on Feb 22, 2023 19:23:40 GMT
Well if she does ever get back here , I hope she lives next door to you and not me or mine , MI5 will know who is was associated with here in the UK and who she was in contact with here in the UK and outside of it, before she and her two schoolmates volunteered to be baby making machines for ISIS , MI6 and their assets in Syria likewise, plus info shared by other Intelligence Service Agents We will never know exactly what she did there , but they will. I think she should be tried by a British court.
She was 15 when she left. Other 15-year-olds get sympathy when they're groomed, even though some return time and time again to their abusers — apparently willingly.
When she's found guilty at her trial (the Home Sec says she is, and of what we should then find out), it's doubtful she'll be free to live next door to anyone...
She should have faced a Syrian Court,thats the Country she was helping terrorists against. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2023 19:44:38 GMT
A lot of hype about a trafficked, if she was and to date we have no evidence either way, 15 year old girl. What kind of government is so 'terrified' of a 15 year old girl that they would not bring her back to be tried. She was born in The UK so there are other agencies to be looked at in the country as to why she turned out as she has or has not. Coz it's never their fault in the eyes of the loony left. |
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Post by Steve on Feb 22, 2023 19:56:58 GMT
This may be the correct decision, but having it announced with the implication that we’d agree if we had the same info as the authorities, sounds too much like the actions of a totalitarian state. Uncomfortable though it might be, I think she should be brought back to the UK in custody to face trial, when all the info on her wrongdoing — and any involvement or slip ups of British security services — can be openly aired… Well if she does ever get back here , I hope she lives next door to you and not me or mine , MI5 will know who is was associated with here in the UK and who she was in contact with here in the UK and outside of it, before she and her two schoolmates volunteered to be baby making machines for ISIS , MI6 and their assets in Syria likewise, plus info shared by other Intelligence Service Agents We will never know exactly what she did there , but they will. If the allegations against her are proved in a court then she can be jailed for life with no parole. But there's no demonstrated substance to them and the government didn't seem to believe them judging from their evidence in this case. She's our mess, we should deal with it not shit on other people's door steps. Meantime we are looking more and more like a pariah state over this and those seeking to recruit more terrorists from the muslim communities will be pissing themselves with glee at the Home Office antics Read the judgement esp para 7 and 303 www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/Shamima-Begum-OPEN-Judgment.pdf The first just states as fact something (the Supreme Court and if it gets there, the ECtHR won't so accept) and that limited her scope of appeal. The latter effectively says Javid didn't have to make the correct decision he just had to be able to say he didn't know it was incorrect. Again the ECtHR won't have to accept that as compliance with the ECnHR. You have your pyrrhic victory for now but don't bet anything on it lasting |
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Post by Steve on Feb 22, 2023 20:00:46 GMT
. . .She was only 15 years of age, she allegedly was a bright student knew what she was doing, the age of Criminal Responsibility to know the difference between right and wrong is 10 years of age in the UK. . . But the UN convention of the child we are signed up to says we must not give a lifelong punishment for deeds committed as a child |
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Post by wapentake on Feb 22, 2023 20:21:31 GMT
. . .She was only 15 years of age, she allegedly was a bright student knew what she was doing, the age of Criminal Responsibility to know the difference between right and wrong is 10 years of age in the UK. . . But the UN convention of the child we are signed up to says we must not give a lifelong punishment for deeds committed as a child But she chose to join Islamic state,in some Islamic states the age of consent is 14,in Iran it’s twelve therefore they’re considered adults not children. |
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Post by Orac on Feb 22, 2023 20:25:00 GMT
Well if she does ever get back here , I hope she lives next door to you and not me or mine , MI5 will know who is was associated with here in the UK and who she was in contact with here in the UK and outside of it, before she and her two schoolmates volunteered to be baby making machines for ISIS , MI6 and their assets in Syria likewise, plus info shared by other Intelligence Service Agents We will never know exactly what she did there , but they will. If the allegations against her are proved in a court then she can be jailed for life with no parole. But there's no demonstrated substance to them and the government didn't seem to believe them judging from their evidence in this case. She's our mess, we should deal with it not shit on other people's door steps. Meantime we are looking more and more like a pariah state over this and those seeking to recruit more terrorists from the muslim communities will be pissing themselves with glee at the Home Office antics Read the judgement esp para 7 and 303 www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/Shamima-Begum-OPEN-Judgment.pdf The first just states as fact something (the Supreme Court and if it gets there, the ECtHR won't so accept) and that limited her scope of appeal. The latter effectively says Javid didn't have to make the correct decision he just had to be able to say he didn't know it was incorrect. Again the ECtHR won't have to accept that as compliance with the ECnHR. You have your pyrrhic victory for now but don't bet anything on it lasting Steve, i know this going to sound like a rude question, but do you think it's possible you have some deep emotional need for the British public to be thwarted and humiliated? The way you speak here makes it sound like this is personal for you. |
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Post by sandypine on Feb 22, 2023 20:37:58 GMT
. . .She was only 15 years of age, she allegedly was a bright student knew what she was doing, the age of Criminal Responsibility to know the difference between right and wrong is 10 years of age in the UK. . . But the UN convention of the child we are signed up to says we must not give a lifelong punishment for deeds committed as a child But there is no life long punishment, she was free to carry on life as a Bangladeshi citizen not as a British citizen. The UK did not make her stateless, if she did not uptake Bangladeshi citizenship as she was entitled to do she made herself stateless, a decision she made as an adult. Many people make mistakes at 15 that reflect all through their lives, that is life; there are several things I would not have done at fifteen, but did and have lived with those consequences although much less impactful than Begum's. |
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Post by Steve on Feb 22, 2023 20:49:17 GMT
But the UN convention of the child we are signed up to says we must not give a lifelong punishment for deeds committed as a child But she chose to join Islamic state,in some Islamic states the age of consent is 14,in Iran it’s twelve therefore they’re considered adults not children. We are not such a rogue pseudo state, we are sworn to work to our rules and signed up to conventions |
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Post by Steve on Feb 22, 2023 20:52:13 GMT
If the allegations against her are proved in a court then she can be jailed for life with no parole. But there's no demonstrated substance to them and the government didn't seem to believe them judging from their evidence in this case. She's our mess, we should deal with it not shit on other people's door steps. Meantime we are looking more and more like a pariah state over this and those seeking to recruit more terrorists from the muslim communities will be pissing themselves with glee at the Home Office antics Read the judgement esp para 7 and 303 www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/Shamima-Begum-OPEN-Judgment.pdf The first just states as fact something (the Supreme Court and if it gets there, the ECtHR won't so accept) and that limited her scope of appeal. The latter effectively says Javid didn't have to make the correct decision he just had to be able to say he didn't know it was incorrect. Again the ECtHR won't have to accept that as compliance with the ECnHR. You have your pyrrhic victory for now but don't bet anything on it lasting Steve, i know this going to sound like a rude question, but do you think it's possible you have some deep emotional need for the British public to be thwarted and humiliated? The way you speak here makes it sound like this is personal for you. No it's an offensive insult posed supposedly as a question I care about democracy, justice, truth and for people to be treated as individuals not as broad brush labels to suit simple minded bigotry. If that's a bad thing then we are going to have frequent disagreements here. |
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Post by wapentake on Feb 22, 2023 20:57:07 GMT
But she chose to join Islamic state,in some Islamic states the age of consent is 14,in Iran it’s twelve therefore they’re considered adults not children. We are not such a rogue pseudo state, we are sworn to work to our rules and signed up to conventions Are all Islamic states considered rogue? You cannot escape that she went there freely and embraced it,till all went wrong. Where does the UN convention on children stand on states that allow the age of consent to be so low. Under different circumstances I might have more empathy for the girl. |
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Post by Pacifico on Feb 22, 2023 22:13:10 GMT
She wanted to go and become a citizen of the foreign country - we should respect that decision. She joined a terror gang in another Country she didn't want to be a citizen of Syria. No - she wanted to be a Citizen of the Islamic Caliphate - which she became. As is her right and you should respect that decision. |
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Post by Steve on Feb 22, 2023 23:59:22 GMT
We are not such a rogue pseudo state, we are sworn to work to our rules and signed up to conventions Are all Islamic states considered rogue? You cannot escape that she went there freely and embraced it,till all went wrong. Where does the UN convention on children stand on states that allow the age of consent to be so low. Under different circumstances I might have more empathy for the girl. I have no empathy for her but the fact is she is British and this is positioning the UK as a rogue state. I know of no state that places Islam as its core law that can be considered anything other than appalling but you mentions Isis and iran and they are particularly poor examples. |
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