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Post by see2 on Dec 28, 2022 11:10:14 GMT
Just to point out the chukka umunna story is all over the communications workers union twitter page and being distrubuted to its members.
My cousin is a postie currently out on strike in lancashire , and he tells me head union officials have long been advising its members not to pay political subs to the labour party while starmer and the blairites are in charge.
Proving the stupidity of Lefty Union leaders, putting their own interests above the interests of working people. Proving that lefty unions only care about imposing the more extreme policies of the left which is not the purpose of the existence of the Unions. |
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Post by thomas on Dec 28, 2022 11:20:11 GMT
maybe your definition of ad hominem is different to all the rest. Im happy with a bit of banter if not downright attack.Its just your failure to articulate anything of substance beyond empty new labour soundbites and general guff that bothers me.
When Blair quit in 2008 and handed over to Gordon Brown just in time for the global financial crash, he left the Labour vote heading for its lowest ebb in 25 years, and the second-lowest in the best part of a century.
Even in 2005, long before the crash, Blair had taken Labour below 10m votes for only the second time since 1935. The only reason he managed to win three elections with such a disastrously low vote was because the Conservatives at the time were the biggest shambles they’ve ever been in UK history, burning through leaders so fast we struggle to remember them all.
NONE of which explains the disastrous showing of Old Labour since 1951. lets pick apart this drivel and inspect your insinuation.
since 1951 , old labour have won 4 general elections , while new labour won three. Point to old labour.
since 1951, in the 19 elections , old labour have won more votes on average than new labour managed in their stints between 1997 and the 2015 general election . In included corbyns 2017 voters in that figure . point to old labour.
new labours highest vote share since 1951 has been 13.5 million , in 1997 , while old labour beat that in 51 with 13.9 million. point to old labour.
New labours lowest vote share in any GE was browns in 2010 while old labours lowest vote share in any election was foots in 1983. Old labours lowest average vote share was comfortably millions ahead of new labours in practically every single election on record. Showing the voters dont want two tory parties.
Old labour arent the disaster you imply , the disaster is new labours showing.
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Post by Toreador on Dec 28, 2022 11:21:46 GMT
Just to point out the chukka umunna story is all over the communications workers union twitter page and being distrubuted to its members.
My cousin is a postie currently out on strike in lancashire , and he tells me head union officials have long been advising its members not to pay political subs to the labour party while starmer and the blairites are in charge.
Proving the stupidity of Lefty Union leaders, putting their own interests above the interests of working people. Proving that lefty unions only care about imposing the more extreme policies of the left which is not the purpose of the existence of the Unions. Are you a Thatcherite? |
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Post by thomas on Dec 28, 2022 11:21:56 GMT
see above. please address my previous posts. Your left wing need to take control is showing. I have made the grounds upon which I am prepared to debate with you quite clear if you do not wish to oblige I may make comments without entering into debate with you. im not left wing. Another false assumption when someone questions new labours disasterous record. They fall back into their comfortable saftey zone of crying about lefties , tories and nasty nats.
You are part of the uk and scotlands problems , not the solution. Heres hoping the voters grind you into the dust yet again come next election as you and your disgusting party deserve.
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Post by thomas on Dec 28, 2022 11:22:31 GMT
Just to point out the chukka umunna story is all over the communications workers union twitter page and being distrubuted to its members.
My cousin is a postie currently out on strike in lancashire , and he tells me head union officials have long been advising its members not to pay political subs to the labour party while starmer and the blairites are in charge.
Proving the stupidity of Lefty Union leaders, putting their own interests above the interests of working people. Proving that lefty unions only care about imposing the more extreme policies of the left which is not the purpose of the existence of the Unions. stop taking their votes and money then. While pretending you care about the working man and the poor. |
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Post by thomas on Dec 28, 2022 11:24:44 GMT
Proving the stupidity of Lefty Union leaders, putting their own interests above the interests of working people. Proving that lefty unions only care about imposing the more extreme policies of the left which is not the purpose of the existence of the Unions. Are you a Thatcherite? LMFAO.
Good question. I doubt you will get an honest answer.
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Post by thomas on Dec 28, 2022 11:25:30 GMT
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Post by Pacifico on Dec 28, 2022 11:44:50 GMT
new labours highest vote share since 1951 has been 13.5 million , in 1997 , while old labour beat that in 51 with 13.9 million. point to old labour. It was even better than that - in 1997 the voting population was much larger than 1951, so effectively an even worse performance. |
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Post by thomas on Dec 28, 2022 11:54:51 GMT
new labours highest vote share since 1951 has been 13.5 million , in 1997 , while old labour beat that in 51 with 13.9 million. point to old labour. It was even better than that - in 1997 the voting population was much larger than 1951, so effectively an even worse performance. Cheers pacifico. We dont need to analyse 19 elections to see though that see 2 is as usual talking out his rear end on the subject of new labour.
England and scotland dont need two tory parties. If you are a tory , or at least to the centre right , why would you vote new labour when you can have the real thing? If you are left of centre , why would you vote a tory impersonator?
The fact is , kinnock and smith did all the donkey work post 1987 and laid the foundations for new labour , building their vote share gradually , and blair lost 4 million voters over his time in power , facing arguably the worst tory party in uk history , a burnt out shell and a wreck with limp wristed leaders like hague and howard. Blair is arguably the most hated man ever to grace uk politics , hated by all and sundry outside the new labour cult.
The damage that man did to all our nations is immeasurable.
The fantasy new labour worshippers see 2 spin is light years above the reality of new labours time in and out of power , and worthy of a place in a tolkien fiction.
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Post by see2 on Dec 28, 2022 12:02:25 GMT
new labours highest vote share since 1951 has been 13.5 million , in 1997 , while old labour beat that in 51 with 13.9 million. point to old labour. It was even better than that - in 1997 the voting population was much larger than 1951, so effectively an even worse performance. If it had been an entirely bad performance by NL they would have been voted out of office. Yet even after the dishonest propaganda aimed at NL following 2008 the Tories STILL didn't manage to win enough votes for a clear victory in 2010. Even though they were helped by a lack luster performance by Brown in debate before the election. Still the Tories do their best, helped by foolish left wingers, to make sure that NL never get another opportunity to kick the Rubbish Right-wingers into touch again. Pretty sad really. |
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Post by thomas on Dec 28, 2022 12:10:15 GMT
It was even better than that - in 1997 the voting population was much larger than 1951, so effectively an even worse performance. If it had been an entirely bad performance by NL they would have been voted out of office. Eh? Have you missed the past 12 years and counting in england and fifteen in scotland? They were voted out , and kept out of office because people had had enough of them and thier disasterous governance.
new labour wrote the book on propaganda. BBC scotland for example is staffed full of thier toadies and always have been.
yawn. Dont try move the goalposts when faced with the uncomfortable fact new labour compared to old labour have been abysmall.
im neither a tory , foolish lefty and i dont want to see new labour back in charge of either scotland or the uk while we are in it.
Their abysmall and disasterous record , as we are discussing speaks for itself.
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Post by see2 on Dec 28, 2022 12:13:10 GMT
Proving the stupidity of Lefty Union leaders, putting their own interests above the interests of working people. Proving that lefty unions only care about imposing the more extreme policies of the left which is not the purpose of the existence of the Unions. Are you a Thatcherite? I have verbally battered Thatcher's nonsense too many times to be referred to as a Thatcherite. New Labour governed for a wider spread of people which included workers and business people. The people referred to are a major backbone of financial security for the country, and they include a lot more people than those included in Lefty, 'let me polish the opposition benches' nonsense. |
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Post by thomas on Dec 28, 2022 12:14:31 GMT
It was even better than that - in 1997 the voting population was much larger than 1951, so effectively an even worse performance. Still the Tories do their best, helped by foolish left wingers, i appreciate you struggle under pr in scotland , often finishing fourth , but you only have to beat one orther party in englands two horse race politics , and you cant even manage that such is the english publics disillusion with you.
Labour need both foolish left wingers ,and even dafter right wingers to vote them in to power , with a healthy dose of voter apathy and low turnout.
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Post by thomas on Dec 28, 2022 12:15:42 GMT
I have verbally battered Thatcher's nonsense too many times to be referred to as a Thatcherite. Didnt margaret thatcher allegedly say tony blair and new labour were her greatest achievement?
Must pull out the old quotes from new labour grandees on their love of margaret thatcher.....
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Post by thomas on Dec 28, 2022 12:17:55 GMT
and they include a lot more people than those included in Lefty, 'let me polish the opposition benches' nonsense. as opposed to the sighs that have run down the new labour opposition benches looking for a spine to run up..... |
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