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Post by Steve on Dec 18, 2022 14:40:16 GMT
Yes my mistake, 2010 after NL had been lied about and lost the election. . . .  you are the head of the Gordon Brown fan club and I claim my five free thrown staplers . . ."As research commissioned by former shadow chancellor John McDonnell recently showed, the UK state pension is more than £50 a week lower than it would be if Margaret Thatcher hadn’t broken the earnings link in 1980 – the UK has one of the least generous pensions in Europe." So Tory Lib Dem corrected a Tory created problem. That'll do for me. The basic state pension was £1.30 a week in 1948 which would be £54.17 in Dec 2022 termsBut it's actually £141.85 a week so it's gone up over 2 and a half times in real terms value. Well to some votes have to be bought don't they. |
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Post by jaydee on Dec 18, 2022 14:58:14 GMT
Yes my mistake, 2010 after NL had been lied about and lost the election. . . . you are the head of the Gordon Brown fan club and I claim my five free thrown staplers . . ."As research commissioned by former shadow chancellor John McDonnell recently showed, the UK state pension is more than £50 a week lower than it would be if Margaret Thatcher hadn’t broken the earnings link in 1980 – the UK has one of the least generous pensions in Europe." So Tory Lib Dem corrected a Tory created problem. That'll do for me. The basic state pension was £1.30 a week in 1948 which would be £54.17 in Dec 2022 termsBut it's actually £141.85 a week so it's gone up over 2 and a half times in real terms value. Well to some votes have to be bought don't they. £100 in 1950 is equivalent in purchasing power to about £4,049.78 today, an increase of £3,949.78 over 72 years. The pound had an average inflation rate of 5.28% per year between 1950 and today, producing a cumulative price increase of 3,949.78%. This means that today's prices are 40.50 times as high as average prices since 1950, according to the Office for National Statistics composite price index. A pound today only buys 2.469% of what it could buy back then. The inflation rate in 1950 was 3.13%. The current inflation rate compared to last year is now 13.20%. If this number holds, £100 today will be equivalent in buying power to £113.20 next year. Well it is the wankers in Westminster. Who insist the economy is spiffing. And that fanny is still being swallowed h0ok line and sinker |
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Post by see2 on Dec 18, 2022 17:21:51 GMT
Yes my mistake, 2010 after NL had been lied about and lost the election. . . . you are the head of the Gordon Brown fan club and I claim my five free thrown staplers . . ."As research commissioned by former shadow chancellor John McDonnell recently showed, the UK state pension is more than £50 a week lower than it would be if Margaret Thatcher hadn’t broken the earnings link in 1980 – the UK has one of the least generous pensions in Europe." So Tory Lib Dem corrected a Tory created problem. That'll do for me. The basic state pension was £1.30 a week in 1948 which would be £54.17 in Dec 2022 termsBut it's actually £141.85 a week so it's gone up over 2 and a half times in real terms value. Well to some votes have to be bought don't they. And you are the leader of the, for biased reason, Hate Brown club. You have still have not made any attempt to say how bad 2008 would have been without the INTERNATIONAL FINANCIAL MELTDOWN. What were the poverty wage levels in 1948? One of the problems in the paying of pensions is that the system wasn't designed for the changes made in the country since 1948, being not just greater health and living longer but things like final salary pensions and a big increase in early retirements. IMO still the greatest problem is the amount of wealth owned by, what was it, 40% of the population? People are arguing/debating finances while being ripped off by the very rich. |
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Post by Pacifico on Dec 18, 2022 18:29:47 GMT
You never heard of anyone paying voluntary NI contributions? Actually you have but you've forgotten. I told you years ago that's what I all the time I was abroad. IWhat about £3 pw try £800 a year |
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Post by Steve on Dec 18, 2022 18:36:02 GMT
That's roughly what I paid for missing years (having retired early)
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Post by Bentley on Dec 19, 2022 13:32:16 GMT
Pensioners claim that they have paid their dues because they have. . . . Yes and no Yes we pensioners paid was was legally due but it was never enough and is very much way too little now. The state pension has always been a Ponzi scheme, the pensions are paid not from a properly invested return from the relevant contributions but by the contributions of those working plus taxes on the higher earners. In the early years it wasn't too imbalanced as so many people died before being able to claim their state pension, very much the other way round now. It's one of many reasons why government after government has boosted our working population with immigrants. On an actuarial basis at best only the state pension 'due' from contributions is about half what is currently paid. With the triple lock that gets worse every year. This won't change any time soon, no government is going to sign its own death warrant by offending the silver haired voters or raising the state pension age to 75. But squaring the circle on the finances gets ever more difficult. Paying a non contributing demographic isn’t a Ponzi scheme . Paying them enough to live without poverty is the sign of a civilised society . If society objects to that then all non contributing demographics should be included . Changing the pension age to 75 isn’t a death sentence to a government. It’s changing it in one go that is the death sentence . Its pretty obvious that the full pension age will be raised to 75 over time . What future governments will probably do is to create a soft landing ie facilitate part time working / reduced pension payments in the years before you can claim the full pension. Home working, flexible hours, new technology can all make this happen |
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Post by Bentley on Dec 19, 2022 14:05:11 GMT
If you are 64 then you might remember that Global cooling was something that we were supposed to worry about for a number of years. Plus the nuclear threat from the USSR and later on global terrorism. Global warming was considered another one..not THE one . Boomers didn’t do nothing because it was too expensive, they did nothing in the same context as not building nuclear shelters . Pensioners didnt vote for Brexit to make young people suffer. They voted Brexit because they saw membership of the EU as a way to stagnate wages and extinguish a British identity . Something they thought was valuable. Also if how demographics vote is used against them by subsequent generations within 6 years , that should flag up a problem with the ones that use it against them. The old don’t have much of a platform anyway . A sense if duty, nuclear families and some kind of religious beliefs are pretty much extinct except for Muslims . Who seem to hold their old people in esteem. I remember them well. Did we sit back and do nothing? No we looked into the causes and solutions. All except global warming. You can claim that was the reason the old wanted Brexit, but it doesn't change the fact that those affected by Brexit (the young) did not want it, were the old playing god? You have fallen back behind your battlements, defending your position with no attempt at talking peace with the young. No wonder they consider you dinosaurs, you have made no attempt to show them other than you know best. As for claiming the high ground with family. The young consider this the biggest insult of all. You say they claim the old are selfish, but you claim they don't care for their families and children. Oh please. I do not remember while industries being created to fight Global cooling . The first real shot from the AGW warriors was an apocalypse type film called the inconvenient truth . Since then we have a teenage autistic girl and David Attenborough leading the charge , plus middle class idlers gluing themselves to UK roads but keeping their distance from the worst polluters , India ,China and the US. I dont know about this ‘ fallen back behind battlements bullshit and I don’t know of any peace negotiations going on involving young and old . I experienced stagnation of wages and working conditions at a pretty spectacular rate. I voted accordingly. Im not claiming high ground . That’s something you made up. As for playing God? What kind if bullshit is that? We were given a choice in a vote and did so within the perimeters of the referendum. If that’s playing God the voting in a GM is playing God. That’s just have come out of the North Korean handbook of politics. |
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Post by Steve on Dec 19, 2022 18:05:29 GMT
Yes and no Yes we pensioners paid was was legally due but it was never enough and is very much way too little now. The state pension has always been a Ponzi scheme, the pensions are paid not from a properly invested return from the relevant contributions but by the contributions of those working plus taxes on the higher earners. In the early years it wasn't too imbalanced as so many people died before being able to claim their state pension, very much the other way round now. It's one of many reasons why government after government has boosted our working population with immigrants. On an actuarial basis at best only the state pension 'due' from contributions is about half what is currently paid. With the triple lock that gets worse every year. This won't change any time soon, no government is going to sign its own death warrant by offending the silver haired voters or raising the state pension age to 75. But squaring the circle on the finances gets ever more difficult. Paying a non contributing demographic isn’t a Ponzi scheme . . . . Using the contributions of new members to pay liabilities to current members is the very definition of a Ponzi scheme . .Changing the pension age to 75 isn’t a death sentence to a government. It’s changing it in one go that is the death sentence . Its pretty obvious that the full pension age will be raised to 75 over time . What future governments will probably do is to create a soft landing ie facilitate part time working / reduced pension payments in the years before you can claim the full pension. Home working, flexible hours, new technology can all make this happen OK won't disagree with that. It's the boiling the frog without it noticing system |
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Post by Bentley on Dec 19, 2022 18:13:39 GMT
Paying a non contributing demographic isn’t a Ponzi scheme . . . . Using the contributions of new members to pay liabilities to current members is the very definition of a Ponzi scheme . .Changing the pension age to 75 isn’t a death sentence to a government. It’s changing it in one go that is the death sentence . Its pretty obvious that the full pension age will be raised to 75 over time . What future governments will probably do is to create a soft landing ie facilitate part time working / reduced pension payments in the years before you can claim the full pension. Home working, flexible hours, new technology can all make this happen OK won't disagree with that. It's the boiling the frog without it noticing system That trivialises the whole system . It makes pensioners party to a scam and completely undermines the concept of supporting humans who do not and will never contribute to the system not just the ones who contributed to the system in the past . Only a heartless Tory without a moral compass could compare benefits to non contributors to a Ponzi scheme . |
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Post by Steve on Dec 19, 2022 18:15:26 GMT
Except I wasn't comparing benefits to non contributors to a Ponzi scheme was I.
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Post by Bentley on Dec 19, 2022 18:23:14 GMT
Except I wasn't comparing benefits to non contributors to a Ponzi scheme was I. You said..”Using the contributions of new members to pay liabilities to current members is the very definition of a Ponzi scheme” So you comments were just random thoughts in your head..nothing to do with the post you answered. Anyine with two brain cells can see that you were directly comparing NI contributions ( and the a state pension ) to a Ponzi scheme . …is the very definition of a Ponzi scheme”…says Steve . |
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Post by zanygame on Dec 19, 2022 19:48:47 GMT
I remember them well. Did we sit back and do nothing? No we looked into the causes and solutions. All except global warming. You can claim that was the reason the old wanted Brexit, but it doesn't change the fact that those affected by Brexit (the young) did not want it, were the old playing god? You have fallen back behind your battlements, defending your position with no attempt at talking peace with the young. No wonder they consider you dinosaurs, you have made no attempt to show them other than you know best. As for claiming the high ground with family. The young consider this the biggest insult of all. You say they claim the old are selfish, but you claim they don't care for their families and children. Because it never happened. And because the cause was not human and was beyond our control. Oh gosh no 😲 Not a girl with autism and a teenager 😲 How very dare she. And that Attenborough fellow is no better than he should be. I don't support this group, but just because we are not the worst criminals but that does not just let us off. It was metaphorical. You retired to your own position rather than try to examine the other sides views and reach compromise. So you voted according to your needs ignoring what the young wanted. So don't be surprised if they do the same. But the old voted for something that didn't effect them as they had their guaranteed pensions, but will effect the young, so either they didn't care or thought they knew best (Playing god) See above. |
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Post by Bentley on Dec 19, 2022 20:38:31 GMT
Because it never happened. And because the cause was not human and was beyond our control. Oh gosh no 😲 Not a girl with autism and a teenager 😲 How very dare she. And that Attenborough fellow is no better than he should be. I don't support this group, but just because we are not the worst criminals but that does not just let us off. It was metaphorical. You retired to your own position rather than try to examine the other sides views and reach compromise. So you voted according to your needs ignoring what the young wanted. So don't be surprised if they do the same. But the old voted for something that didn't effect them as they had their guaranteed pensions, but will effect the young, so either they didn't care or thought they knew best (Playing god) See above. How do you know it was beyond our control ? Oh dear , note that now you are falsely claiming that I said that she shouldn’t dare, rather than suggesting there could and should be better candidates than a vulnerable teenager. It’s not about you . They are part of the same narrative . It wasn’t metaphorical, it was bollocks . Once again falsely claiming the meaning of the post. Your dishonesty / obtuseness is getting tiresome . This might come as a surprise but stagnating wages today will probably lead to stagnated wages tomorrow. What a revelation, eh? Yes your default demonisation of boomers goes beyond reason . It didn’t affect them so they didn’t care….speak for yourself . Dont try to wriggle out of it . You used hyperbole to over cook the position of Brexit voters . If voting in a referendum is playing God then voting in a GE or voting to remain is playing God. |
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Post by zanygame on Dec 19, 2022 21:33:16 GMT
Well global cooling supposedly had two potential causes, aerosols or milankovitch cycles. We did do something about aerosols though they were not the cause, we had no control over milankovitch cycles. As it happened it was a false alarm. Greta has autism, she is not a vulnerable teenager. You need to educate yourself. Wow what a convincing argument. Again you miss the point, bless you. The point being that unless you think you have a monopoly on knowledge, you must assume these young people also had the knowledge you possess and yet wanted to stay in the EU. Oh get over yourself. I can criticise without it being demonisation. You poor little child. I don't do wriggling, I answer every post as honestly as I can. I have explained the god reference. |
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Post by Bentley on Dec 19, 2022 21:49:07 GMT
Well global cooling supposedly had two potential causes, aerosols or milankovitch cycles. We did do something about aerosols though they were not the cause, we had no control over milankovitch cycles. As it happened it was a false alarm. Greta has autism, she is not a vulnerable teenager. You need to educate yourself. Wow what a convincing argument. Again you miss the point, bless you. The point being that unless you think you have a monopoly on knowledge, you must assume these young people also had the knowledge you possess and yet wanted to stay in the EU. Oh get over yourself. I can criticise without it being demonisation. You poor little child. I don't do wriggling, I answer every post as honestly as I can. I have explained the god reference. Not sure if that’s true but I’m sure that you have been googling it . Depends on where she is on the spectrum , you need to educate yourself and perhaps wonder how she got to be the the poster girl of climate worriers . You decided to post bollocks, I pointed it out . Bollocks in, bollocks out .😉 Agsin it’s you missing the point , as usual, you claim that the boomers were selfish , when that is refuted you change the goalposts to make your non point relevant. You contradict yourself . If the boomers were just thinking about themselves and their pensions then they would be more than happy for legions of cheap Labour paying NI. Instead they just might have generally voted to leave for the sake of the long term future of the UK. You attempted to second guess millions of boomers and only managed to trip yourself up . If I’m a spoiled child then you are a petulant and peevish one who is unwilling to learn. You do wriggle and still are. You explained nothing , just posted ..something . |
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