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Post by zanygame on Nov 7, 2024 9:22:59 GMT
Fine with me not to include them in the house requirement numbers. They represent a very tiny percent. Of course we could build enough houses, the reason we haven't got enough is the result of not building enough for years and that is because of planning law. If building land was half its current price and readily available we would build more homes more cheaply. The restrictions on building are planning regulation, shortage of skilled trades and a shortage of materials. The price of land is an irrelevance. absolute bollox. Planning regulation is causing the high prices. I thought you might understand supply and demand. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 7, 2024 9:26:39 GMT
You might want to think why houses are so much cheaper in France. Do they have no shortage of materials, no shortage of labour, no immigration?
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Nov 7, 2024 9:53:47 GMT
But the bloke on a forum is simply parrotting the official rhetoric.
And you want to complain about "Word play".  I wasn't complaining I was explaining. I take it you have no access to the official rhetoric you could show me. I suppose it comes in the same category as "We don't want X or Y" The weird assumption that what I think is what the country thinks. I doubt that anyone would make that assumption, Zany. |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Nov 7, 2024 9:55:48 GMT
You might want to think why houses are so much cheaper in France. Do they have no shortage of materials, no shortage of labour, no immigration? Cheaper where, exactly?
I will grant you that outside of major cities housing tends to be cheaper.
And that's because they have twice the land mass for a similar population.
Land is therefore cheap.
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Nov 7, 2024 9:56:36 GMT
The restrictions on building are planning regulation, shortage of skilled trades and a shortage of materials. The price of land is an irrelevance. absolute bollox. Planning regulation is causing the high prices. I thought you might understand supply and demand. Actually, you're both talking absolute bollocks.
HTH.
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Post by sandypine on Nov 7, 2024 10:15:33 GMT
Building more houses lies in the realm of government policy as does immigration. I thought the discussion was with regards what is to be done, most say that dealing with house building and not dealing with migration is not joined up policy. Pushing for more houses, and the regulations necessary for that, without a direct policy to control immigration is counter productive and will actually have a negative impact on the house building policy aim of providing houses for our population unless one plans to cater for future increases as well. If that is policy then that should be clearly stated. Just because they are both government policy, it does not follow that they are dependent on each other. I am pushing for more houses for the people already living here. The shortage may in part be due to historical immigration along with longevity etc. But the way to stop immigration is not to make a housing shortage. And yes we will need a policy on building enough houses for the future, house prices are crippling our economy with too much money tied up in asset value and mortgages and not enough in spending. What are you hoping for, that if enough people are homeless some migrants might leave. They are not dependant but each have an effect on the other. You say you wish to build the houses for people that are here by freeing up land and restrictions on building. That seems like a long term project at least several years. We are only trying to point out that this time next year the number already here definition in your policy will have increased unless there are policies to counter that increase. You may need to house 6 million today and you may house 300,000 by this time next year but on current policy you will still have 6 million left to house this time next year. Building is not a solution on its own. |
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Post by Fairsociety on Nov 7, 2024 10:33:19 GMT
You might want to think why houses are so much cheaper in France. Do they have no shortage of materials, no shortage of labour, no immigration? LOL ... you mean the English mugs who go to France purchase a dilapidated property, spend tens of thousands doing it up, then when it's finished the French kick them out on a technicality.
Reading just that a while back, when the family had finally finished their doer-up, a farmer started to drive his tractor on their drive way, when they protested and went to the authorities to complain, in the small small print, the farmer still owned the plot of land they had build their driveway, needless to say they sold up at a big loss because it was unsellable as the farmer would not sell them the piece of land.
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Post by sheepy on Nov 7, 2024 10:53:07 GMT
Nope tell them the truth, they won't find a free lunch here and they are being purposely given a false impression of the place. That won't work. Conditions here are far better than where they come from, no matter how bad they are compared to our own past. Maybe if we tell them they can't have a home. Like most things that come from the Westminster party and repeated by yourself they are badly thought out sticking plasters and fine it if doesn't work then turn them around and send them right back. Rather than later on find out the hard way. |
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Post by Pacifico on Nov 7, 2024 11:40:32 GMT
The restrictions on building are planning regulation, shortage of skilled trades and a shortage of materials. The price of land is an irrelevance. absolute bollox. Planning regulation is causing the high prices. I thought you might understand supply and demand. If you cannot get planning permission the price of the land is an irrelevance. Slow down and think for once. |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Nov 7, 2024 15:17:02 GMT
absolute bollox. Planning regulation is causing the high prices. I thought you might understand supply and demand. If you cannot get planning permission the price of the land is an irrelevance... And if you can, it's still prohibitive. That's the problem with land: They aren't making any more. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 7, 2024 15:37:52 GMT
You might want to think why houses are so much cheaper in France. Do they have no shortage of materials, no shortage of labour, no immigration? Cheaper where, exactly?
I will grant you that outside of major cities housing tends to be cheaper.
And that's because they have twice the land mass for a similar population.
Land is therefore cheap.
Supply and demand. Limit supply build demand. There is plenty of land in the UK not built on 89% at this time. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 7, 2024 15:43:24 GMT
absolute bollox. Planning regulation is causing the high prices. I thought you might understand supply and demand. If you cannot get planning permission the price of the land is an irrelevance. Slow down and think for once. Yes. If you limit the land that has planning permission you force the price up on the land that does. What do you think would happen to the price of building land if they removed the need for planning permission at all. It would fall to the same price as arable land. |
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Post by sandypine on Nov 7, 2024 16:40:20 GMT
If you cannot get planning permission the price of the land is an irrelevance. Slow down and think for once. Yes. If you limit the land that has planning permission you force the price up on the land that does. What do you think would happen to the price of building land if they removed the need for planning permission at all. It would fall to the same price as arable land. No it wouldn't there are other factors at play local shops, infrastructure, schools, neighbours, transport links to name but a few. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 7, 2024 16:49:33 GMT
Yes. If you limit the land that has planning permission you force the price up on the land that does. What do you think would happen to the price of building land if they removed the need for planning permission at all. It would fall to the same price as arable land. No it wouldn't there are other factors at play local shops, infrastructure, schools, neighbours, transport links to name but a few. There would also be poor arable land farmers would be glad to sell as building land. Plenty of people live miles from shops schools etc. It would certainly be a lot cheaper than 25 times the price of arable land I hope your not arguing that restricting building land doesn't effect its price. Its bad enough that a capitalist like Pacifico is prepared to pretend the rules on supply and demand don't apply to building land because it suits his argument. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 7, 2024 16:59:05 GMT
If you cannot get planning permission the price of the land is an irrelevance... And if you can, it's still prohibitive. That's the problem with land: They aren't making any more. but there's an awful lot that stands empty. What makes this country crowded is not people per square mile its infrastructure. Roads schools parks hospitals etc I point out again that I want immigration slowed or stopped, but logic wont let me pretend things that aren't true are, and its not true that we could not release a load of land for building with "covering the country in concrete" as the rhetoric goes. Release 1% of arable land or grey land and its enough to build houses for everyone in this country who wants one |
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