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Post by Pacifico on Nov 30, 2022 18:50:02 GMT
Labour the enemy of aspiration - never changes.. You can aspire to anything, including an elitist education for your kids if you are wealthy enough. But this should not be tax exempt when the money could be better spent improving education for all. The advancement of education is a charitable purpose (and has been for hundreds of years) and so independent schools are capable of being charities. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2022 18:50:14 GMT
I read somewhere that private schools only educated 7% of the school population. That 7% is generally better educated than anything the state provides. Because money pays for that. Such elitist educations should not be tax exempt on top. |
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Post by totheleft3 on Nov 30, 2022 18:53:05 GMT
independent schools are all overseen by a board of governors or trustees, whilst other private schools may be run by their owner with no governing body.
From the link you posted was the point I was going to make .
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Post by Pacifico on Nov 30, 2022 18:55:57 GMT
independent schools are all overseen by a board of governors or trustees, whilst other private schools may be run by their owner with no governing body. From the link you posted was the point I was going to make . So the objection to private schools is not that they charge fees but how their management is organised? Seems a rather esoteric thing to get your knickers in a twist over. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2022 18:58:30 GMT
I think there are far more appealing targets to get money from than targeting the education system. Like people have pointed out, putting private schooled kids into public schools will only add more drain to the system which is already overwhelmed. That actually is an unproven and I think unlikely contention because it actually depends upon the numbers. If as I suspect very few private school pupils will drop out because their parents will in most case just pay more, then the money raised to go to the state sector will dwarf the added cost of a handful of extra pupils. That they will all leave the private sector on masse is another of those old canards the right like to trot out like the rich will all leave the country if asked to pay slightly more tax. It won't happen of course and is just the standard bullshit that convinces few people not already beholden to the Daily Mail. Its something right wingers find convenient to believe but is in fact mostly nonsense. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2022 19:01:41 GMT
You can aspire to anything, including an elitist education for your kids if you are wealthy enough. But this should not be tax exempt when the money could be better spent improving education for all. The advancement of education is a charitable purpose (and has been for hundreds of years) and so independent schools are capable of being charities. A strange charity that only helps the well off and mostly the rich. I smell bullshit. Tis far more charitable to use the money to help educate the underfunded and struggling educations of the millions whose plight is often far more desperate than that of those attending elitist schools. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2022 19:04:06 GMT
Are you actually putting that forward as an argument, I mean really? SO MANY HOLES IN IT. Education levels in 1945 where you left school aged 14 Reforms in 1970, but it took until Blair in 1997 to have an effect. OMG. I can't begin to answer such crap. No you never do have an answer - just a single mantra - higher taxes.. And you talk of mantras with no sense of insight or irony, lol |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2022 19:14:33 GMT
independent schools are all overseen by a board of governors or trustees, whilst other private schools may be run by their owner with no governing body. From the link you posted was the point I was going to make . If Starmer nevertheless went to a fee paying school - regardless of how it is managed - this fact should be accepted without any feeble attempt to exonerate him from the charge of being privately educated. The fact that his parents paid for his education should not be held against him though. He was after all just a kid at the time and not the one making the decisions. Same could actually be said of Sunak. But it is where they stand on issues today as adults and leaders that matters. I am not and have never been Keir's biggest fan. Having been inside the Labour party as a member I have seen too much. But on this issue he has gotten it right. I hope he means it, which is always a question mark for me in his case. He seems to be serious on this issue though insofar as I can tell. |
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Post by Toreador on Nov 30, 2022 21:25:16 GMT
independent schools are all overseen by a board of governors or trustees, whilst other private schools may be run by their owner with no governing body. From the link you posted was the point I was going to make . I've known several school governors, I wouldn't let them run my tap. |
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Post by Toreador on Nov 30, 2022 21:27:40 GMT
I think there are far more appealing targets to get money from than targeting the education system. Like people have pointed out, putting private schooled kids into public schools will only add more drain to the system which is already overwhelmed. That actually is an unproven and I think unlikely contention because it actually depends upon the numbers. If as I suspect very few private school pupils will drop out because their parents will in most case just pay more, then the money raised to go to the state sector will dwarf the added cost of a handful of extra pupils. That they will all leave the private sector on masse is another of those old canards the right like to trot out like the rich will all leave the country if asked to pay slightly more tax. It won't happen of course and is just the standard bullshit that convinces few people not already beholden to the Daily Mail. Its something right wingers find convenient to believe but is in fact mostly nonsense. As with TTL3, I smell envy. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 30, 2022 21:59:10 GMT
That actually is an unproven and I think unlikely contention because it actually depends upon the numbers. If as I suspect very few private school pupils will drop out because their parents will in most case just pay more, then the money raised to go to the state sector will dwarf the added cost of a handful of extra pupils. That they will all leave the private sector on masse is another of those old canards the right like to trot out like the rich will all leave the country if asked to pay slightly more tax. It won't happen of course and is just the standard bullshit that convinces few people not already beholden to the Daily Mail. Its something right wingers find convenient to believe but is in fact mostly nonsense. As with TTL3, I smell envy. I suspect you don't know any rich people. |
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Post by totheleft3 on Nov 30, 2022 22:02:04 GMT
That actually is an unproven and I think unlikely contention because it actually depends upon the numbers. If as I suspect very few private school pupils will drop out because their parents will in most case just pay more, then the money raised to go to the state sector will dwarf the added cost of a handful of extra pupils. That they will all leave the private sector on masse is another of those old canards the right like to trot out like the rich will all leave the country if asked to pay slightly more tax. It won't happen of course and is just the standard bullshit that convinces few people not already beholden to the Daily Mail. Its something right wingers find convenient to believe but is in fact mostly nonsense. As with TTL3, I smell envy. If you smell envy whats your excuse for worshipping the rich . |
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Post by Pacifico on Nov 30, 2022 22:21:27 GMT
The advancement of education is a charitable purpose (and has been for hundreds of years) and so independent schools are capable of being charities. A strange charity that only helps the well off and mostly the rich. I smell bullshit.Tis far more charitable to use the money to help educate the underfunded and struggling educations of the millions whose plight is often far more desperate than that of those attending elitist schools. I dont know what your sense of smell is like but your historical knowledge is definitely lacking. The education system in the UK was built upon schools being set up for charitable purposes. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2022 22:47:25 GMT
COMPREHENSIVE including or dealing with all elements or aspects of something:
Education is free and available to every person in the UK between the ages of 5 and 18, therefore WHY should tax payers give tax breaks to private funded schools masquerading as charities. ?
The comprehensive education system is designed to educate all students of every ability, from remedial to those who are particularly bright, talented and outstanding.
The Conservatives believe in elitism, where schools can select their pupils, its a form of snobbery, and in the end this kind of Tory policy always results in "superior" education establishments, and the remainder are for the "dross" of society - how so typically Conservative.
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Post by dodgydave on Nov 30, 2022 23:09:04 GMT
So where will the kids go when their parents can no longer afford to send them to private schools? I suggest that most of them would and could afford it. The few who cant can send their kids to the same schools everyone else's kids go to. Why should taxpayers be subsidising elitist educations for the offspring of the already fairly well off? Why should elitist education be tax exempt? Private healthcare isn't. Tax it in the usual way and use the money to improve state education for all, including the handful who might have dropped out of an elitist education. "Subsidising elitist education" lol. I've never heard such rubbish. Ok, let's take that argument to it's logical conclusion. Why should they pay higher tax rate and "subsidise" lower earners? Why should they pay into the pot for education, then pay twice when they pay private fees? It's funny, everybody wants to be "equal" until it comes to responsibility. If you don't believe in subsidy, then charge every parent for sending their kids to school. While we are at it, lets put a wrecking ball to faith schools, working men's clubs, hospices, and the countless other charities that might be benefitting from an "unfair" advantage lol. We are not equals, even if you abolish private schools' people will invest in their children's education in other way such as tutors. Instead of populist class warfare, Starmer should be looking how he can provide people with the opportunities required for a long and happy life. |
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