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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 14, 2024 11:40:52 GMT
Reform UK is not a political party that offers very much that could make life any better for the ordinary man or woman, its based almost exclusively around Immigration, Populism and Nationalism. I actually do think that such a new political party bridging the Right of the Conservative Party with Reform UK might happen ... but what success would it have. ? Such a party would take away some votes from Labour, particularly in traditional working class areas ( The Red Wall ), but it would also lose many traditional Conservative votes, especially in their heartlands of the South, the Home Counties and the Midlands, middle class people who could not stomach a Right wing, populist party hell bent on jingoism and immigrant bashing. What would happen to the remainder of the Conservative Party, the moderates and traditionalists, the Ken Clarkes of this world and Nicholas Soames. ? I think what the problem is the Conservative Party and their press people are so part of a larger public school + Oxford + History/PPE/banking /PR/accountant types that they suffer from group think. They don't have any modern ideas. None of them are engineers and scientists. They are the same sort as we had 200 years ago, and this kind of thinking does not relate to the modern world and nor the days of the powerful British Empire where those of a certain school could get cushy jobs over in Hong Kong ruling like kings by birthright.
I do think populism is a really bad direction to go. The right direction to go is to create a party that is brilliant at managing the economy, thus it creates wealth which can then be used to fix our country's problems, like build proper roads and railways, create robot hospitals and all manner of 21st century thinking. The people most capable of that are those from the competitive business community.
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Post by johnofgwent on Jun 18, 2024 16:16:23 GMT
Reform UK is not a political party that offers very much that could make life any better for the ordinary man or woman, its based almost exclusively around Immigration, Populism and Nationalism. I actually do think that such a new political party bridging the Right of the Conservative Party with Reform UK might happen ... but what success would it have. ? Such a party would take away some votes from Labour, particularly in traditional working class areas ( The Red Wall ), but it would also lose many traditional Conservative votes, especially in their heartlands of the South, the Home Counties and the Midlands, middle class people who could not stomach a Right wing, populist party hell bent on jingoism and immigrant bashing. What would happen to the remainder of the Conservative Party, the moderates and traditionalists, the Ken Clarkes of this world and Nicholas Soames. ? Well let’s just stop and think about that a minute Reform say they want to hike the income tax threshold from its current £12000 to £20000 Which would mean an ordinary man or woman earning the NMW for a 40 hour week would be a bloody sight better off than either the Labour or Tory party want them to be Looks to Me like you need to re think that a bit |
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Post by piglet on Jun 19, 2024 10:12:18 GMT
Reform would make a big difference, especially in those three things you mention, immigration, populism, and nationalism.
no1, it says it will stop the boats, i hope so.
no2 populism, yes it will be nice to spend within our means, drink healthy water, have an NHS. Etc.
no3, yes the reverse racism against the british people needs to be reversed, that the woke get fired. It will be nice to see white faces on the BBC, that we house homeleess british grandmas now on the street, trans sh it does not get first place on tv. etc.
You mention those three things like it is bad mr witch. It is not.
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Post by dodgydave on Jun 19, 2024 22:16:47 GMT
The term Populism is meaningless.
Reform are called populist by Labour... yet they have policies that target the wealthy... which is literally the definition of populism lol.
Populism is a range of political stances that emphasize the idea of "the people" and often juxtapose this group with "the elite".
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 20, 2024 0:13:39 GMT
Reform would make a big difference, especially in those three things you mention, immigration, populism, and nationalism. no1, it says it will stop the boats, i hope so. no2 populism, yes it will be nice to spend within our means, drink healthy water, have an NHS. Etc. no3, yes the reverse racism against the british people needs to be reversed, that the woke get fired. It will be nice to see white faces on the BBC, that we house homeleess british grandmas now on the street, trans sh it does not get first place on tv. etc. You mention those three things like it is bad mr witch. It is not. Populism is simple single fix-it-all solutions. As we run through Reform's manifesto we see this throughout. Every department just needs to be de-woked and de-netzeroed and it will all work fine. The other aspect is to go to the extreme and be forceful so you look tough and serious. There's no subtilty or finesse in populism, rather it is on the level of a football match. The more you scream, the more support you give your team, which is supposed to make them run faster. If you leave a detailed plan of how you think such and such should be managed on a Reform site, it would get completely ignored, vis-a-vis if you say something to knock the other side you get guaranteed support. It's all about bashing stuff. They are like bulls in the china shop. The china shop is run by a capitalist who has all the controls finely tuned to give the perfect product. |
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Post by jonksy on Jun 20, 2024 4:46:05 GMT
This is what happens when you replace a popular, vote winning leader with someone no one wanted apart from the MPs, not even Tory party members. It takes a lot to squander an 80+ majority and not even connect with your own supporters. I wish they would just hold the election tomorrow and put us all out of our misery. The only reason I think there are so many undecided voters still is that they know they do not want the tories any more but they cannot bring themselves to vote Labour. As a life long and now very disappointed Tory I will be voting for Reform. The Tories do not deserve to be in power as they are no longer tories but socialism never works. The tories have been trying it and look where that got them...... Cabinet ministers warn the polls were 'beyond people's wildest nightmares', with Rishi Sunak predicted to become the first sitting PM to LOSE his seat as Tory potential leadership candidates bow out of race....... www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13548807/Cabinet-ministers-polls-nightmare-Rishi-Sunak-lose-seat-Tory.html |
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Post by see2 on Jun 20, 2024 7:15:26 GMT
Nigel Farage has said he would be willing to lead a merged Reform-Conservative party. The Reform party leader said he could not lead the Tories as it “currently is” but predicted a new party is likely to emerge after the general election. Asked if he could rule out leading the Conservative Party one day, Mr Farage told LBC on Thursday morning: "I think something new is going to emerge on the centre-Right, I don’t know what it is called"."But do I think I am capable of leading a national opposition to a Labour Party with a big majority where I can stand up and hold them to account on issues? Yes." Asked if he would be happy to lead a merged party, he replied: "Yes". He added: "They [the Tories] may be dead". www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/06/13/farage-willing-to-lead-conservative-reform-merged-party/I think it's very premature to talk about the death of the Tory party, but the fact that it is being talked about is testament to weak so called one nation centrists, people like Sunak, who have infiltrated the Conservative party. Over the next few years the Tories will have two choices: Move back to the centre right and become relevant, or stay centrist and become irrelevant as Reform becomes the official opposition party. Lies and insinuations made Farage in 2016, so no change there ^^^ LOL Farage was always on the right of the Tory party. Its typical of those on the Right of Politics, to lie calling themselves Center Right. I guess wiser people can't really blame them for their deliberate deceit. |
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Post by Pacifico on Jun 20, 2024 7:50:34 GMT
Nigel Farage has said he would be willing to lead a merged Reform-Conservative party. The Reform party leader said he could not lead the Tories as it “currently is” but predicted a new party is likely to emerge after the general election. Asked if he could rule out leading the Conservative Party one day, Mr Farage told LBC on Thursday morning: "I think something new is going to emerge on the centre-Right, I don’t know what it is called"."But do I think I am capable of leading a national opposition to a Labour Party with a big majority where I can stand up and hold them to account on issues? Yes." Asked if he would be happy to lead a merged party, he replied: "Yes". He added: "They [the Tories] may be dead". www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/06/13/farage-willing-to-lead-conservative-reform-merged-party/I think it's very premature to talk about the death of the Tory party, but the fact that it is being talked about is testament to weak so called one nation centrists, people like Sunak, who have infiltrated the Conservative party. Over the next few years the Tories will have two choices: Move back to the centre right and become relevant, or stay centrist and become irrelevant as Reform becomes the official opposition party. Lies and insinuations made Farage in 2016, so no change there ^^^ LOL Farage was always on the right of the Tory party.
well that is not hard - Tony Blair is on the right of the current Tory Party.. |
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Post by sandypine on Jun 20, 2024 8:11:13 GMT
Nigel Farage has said he would be willing to lead a merged Reform-Conservative party. The Reform party leader said he could not lead the Tories as it “currently is” but predicted a new party is likely to emerge after the general election. Asked if he could rule out leading the Conservative Party one day, Mr Farage told LBC on Thursday morning: "I think something new is going to emerge on the centre-Right, I don’t know what it is called"."But do I think I am capable of leading a national opposition to a Labour Party with a big majority where I can stand up and hold them to account on issues? Yes." Asked if he would be happy to lead a merged party, he replied: "Yes". He added: "They [the Tories] may be dead". www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/06/13/farage-willing-to-lead-conservative-reform-merged-party/I think it's very premature to talk about the death of the Tory party, but the fact that it is being talked about is testament to weak so called one nation centrists, people like Sunak, who have infiltrated the Conservative party. Over the next few years the Tories will have two choices: Move back to the centre right and become relevant, or stay centrist and become irrelevant as Reform becomes the official opposition party. Lies and insinuations made Farage in 2016, so no change there ^^^ LOL Farage was always on the right of the Tory party. Its typical of those on the Right of Politics, to lie calling themselves Center Right. I guess wiser people can't really blame them for their deliberate deceit. It depends how you measure and define Right, Left and Centre. If specific views are popular then I would have thought that they automatically become Centre. Strictly controlling immigration is now a policy of the centre, the centre left and the whole right. |
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Post by andrewbrown on Jun 20, 2024 8:59:14 GMT
I think that Gavin Barwell got it right on Peston last night. Some people won't vote Tory as they are too right wing for them. Some people won't vote Tory as they are not ring wing enough for them.
At present they are serving nobody.
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Post by sheepy on Jun 20, 2024 9:05:52 GMT
Reform would make a big difference, especially in those three things you mention, immigration, populism, and nationalism. no1, it says it will stop the boats, i hope so. no2 populism, yes it will be nice to spend within our means, drink healthy water, have an NHS. Etc. no3, yes the reverse racism against the british people needs to be reversed, that the woke get fired. It will be nice to see white faces on the BBC, that we house homeleess british grandmas now on the street, trans sh it does not get first place on tv. etc. You mention those three things like it is bad mr witch. It is not. Populism is simple single fix-it-all solutions. As we run through Reform's manifesto we see this throughout. Every department just needs to be de-woked and de-netzeroed and it will all work fine. The other aspect is to go to the extreme and be forceful so you look tough and serious. There's no subtilty or finesse in populism, rather it is on the level of a football match. The more you scream, the more support you give your team, which is supposed to make them run faster. If you leave a detailed plan of how you think such and such should be managed on a Reform site, it would get completely ignored, vis-a-vis if you say something to knock the other side you get guaranteed support. It's all about bashing stuff. They are like bulls in the china shop. The china shop is run by a capitalist who has all the controls finely tuned to give the perfect product. Ah, the old what is populism, we must define it, so it has a box within the system, the trouble with populism, it doesn't actually have a box within Westminster politics, it is an outsider working for democracy for all. That is cataclysmic for the Westminster party as has been shown many times, the Farage likes to flirt with us, but really, he is a Tory through and through. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Jun 20, 2024 9:23:13 GMT
Nigel Farage has said he would be willing to lead a merged Reform-Conservative party. The Reform party leader said he could not lead the Tories as it “currently is” but predicted a new party is likely to emerge after the general election. Asked if he could rule out leading the Conservative Party one day, Mr Farage told LBC on Thursday morning: "I think something new is going to emerge on the centre-Right, I don’t know what it is called"."But do I think I am capable of leading a national opposition to a Labour Party with a big majority where I can stand up and hold them to account on issues? Yes." Asked if he would be happy to lead a merged party, he replied: "Yes". He added: "They [the Tories] may be dead". www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/06/13/farage-willing-to-lead-conservative-reform-merged-party/I think it's very premature to talk about the death of the Tory party, but the fact that it is being talked about is testament to weak so called one nation centrists, people like Sunak, who have infiltrated the Conservative party. Over the next few years the Tories will have two choices: Move back to the centre right and become relevant, or stay centrist and become irrelevant as Reform becomes the official opposition party. Lies and insinuations made Farage in 2016, so no change there ^^^ LOL Farage was always on the right of the Tory party. Its typical of those on the Right of Politics, to lie calling themselves Center Right. I guess wiser people can't really blame them for their deliberate deceit. Is Farage a nasty far right extremist? LOL change the record ffs. |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 20, 2024 9:28:17 GMT
Populism is simple single fix-it-all solutions. As we run through Reform's manifesto we see this throughout. Every department just needs to be de-woked and de-netzeroed and it will all work fine. The other aspect is to go to the extreme and be forceful so you look tough and serious. There's no subtilty or finesse in populism, rather it is on the level of a football match. The more you scream, the more support you give your team, which is supposed to make them run faster. If you leave a detailed plan of how you think such and such should be managed on a Reform site, it would get completely ignored, vis-a-vis if you say something to knock the other side you get guaranteed support. It's all about bashing stuff. They are like bulls in the china shop. The china shop is run by a capitalist who has all the controls finely tuned to give the perfect product. Ah, the old what is populism, we must define it, so it has a box within the system, the trouble with populism, it doesn't actually have a box within Westminster politics, it is an outsider working for democracy for all. That is cataclysmic for the Westminster party as has been shown many times, the Farage likes to flirt with us, but really, he is a Tory through and through. If you had studied the arts you would see how all this works. You get definite artistic movements throughout history just as you get political movements, and if you don't define what you are talking about you make as much sense as Sunak or Starmer. We can do better on here and not need to follow the riffraff. Farage aint straight with us entirely. He's using political trickery, much like a web designer would use search engine optimisation. It does nothing to enhance the product you sell, but just brings more punters to your firm. If your firm spends 95% of its intellectual efforts on developing a brand image and only 5% on the product, then you would have a firm like Paula Vennell's post office. What sounds good often is not at all good. To figure out if sounding good = being good you have to study the techniques employed in populism. I see it as a kind of "come on down/the price is right" type tacky games show for the proles, all run by the elite. |
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Post by sheepy on Jun 20, 2024 9:30:49 GMT
Ah, the old what is populism, we must define it, so it has a box within the system, the trouble with populism, it doesn't actually have a box within Westminster politics, it is an outsider working for democracy for all. That is cataclysmic for the Westminster party as has been shown many times, the Farage likes to flirt with us, but really, he is a Tory through and through. If you had studied the arts you would see how all this works. You get definite artistic movements throughout history just as you get political movements, and if you don't define what you are talking about you make as much sense as Sunak or Starmer. We can do better on here and not need to follow the riffraff. Farage aint straight with us entirely. He's using political trickery, much like a web designer would use search engine optimisation. It does nothing to enhance the product you sell, but just brings more punters to your firm. If your firm spends 95% of its intellectual efforts on developing a brand image and only 5% on the product, then you would have a firm like Paula Vennell's post office. What sounds good often is not at all good. To figure out if sounding good = being good you have to study the techniques employed in populism. I see it as a kind of "come on down/the price is right" type tacky games show for the proles, all run by the elite. Farage isn't causing the populists a problem, he is doing us a favour, he probably doesn't realise it, but then this is politics, I don't have to do anything if I don't want too. |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jun 20, 2024 9:36:50 GMT
If you had studied the arts you would see how all this works. You get definite artistic movements throughout history just as you get political movements, and if you don't define what you are talking about you make as much sense as Sunak or Starmer. We can do better on here and not need to follow the riffraff. Farage aint straight with us entirely. He's using political trickery, much like a web designer would use search engine optimisation. It does nothing to enhance the product you sell, but just brings more punters to your firm. If your firm spends 95% of its intellectual efforts on developing a brand image and only 5% on the product, then you would have a firm like Paula Vennell's post office. What sounds good often is not at all good. To figure out if sounding good = being good you have to study the techniques employed in populism. I see it as a kind of "come on down/the price is right" type tacky games show for the proles, all run by the elite. Farage isn't causing the populists a problem, he is doing us a favour, he probably doesn't realise it, but then this is politics, I don't have to do anything if I don't want too. Reform paid an agency £140 grand to select the candidates to run in this election. Have a long think about the kind of person who would think of doing that. I'm just giving you a peak behind the scenes here. |
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