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Post by patman post on Mar 11, 2024 13:53:42 GMT
patmanpost I expect that related to MP's who chose to change Party. As we know Mr.Anderson was rendered Partyless due to his suspension from the Conservative Parliamentary Party. He has currently been an Independent MP and as such was not a member of any 'Party' within Parliament. It wasn't his choice to become an Independent MP, it wasn't his choice to be removed from the Tories, hence I expect that from his perspective the only choice that he's making of his own volition is to join Reform. From the voters viewpoint they voted to be represented by a Conservative MP. Rishi Sunak has the power to disregard their wishes and lumber them with an Independent MP instead. It was Sunak's decision rather than Anderson's that the people of Ashfield are not permitted to have an MP of the Party of their choice**. Didn't Anthony Mangall's proposition (which Lee supported) call for MPs — who no longer represented the party they were elected for — to resign and go for a by election.
**Interestingly, I think the government's response corresponded with my view — ie, voters cast their vote for individual candidates as their representatives, and not the political party they represent...
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Post by Hutchyns on Mar 11, 2024 14:04:53 GMT
patman post
That's superb news for the Conservatives as most of their candidates will be the same people holding exactly the same individual opinions as they did last time.
Nothing to do with wanting Boris and his 'oven ready' Brexit deal ...... the 80+ majority was secured on the quality of the local candidates it seems.
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Post by patman post on Mar 11, 2024 14:18:00 GMT
patman post That's superb news for the Conservatives as most of their candidates will be the same people holding exactly the same individual opinions as they did last time.Nothing to do with wanting Boris and his 'oven ready' Brexit deal ...... the 80+ majority was secured on the quality of the local candidates it seems. You seem to be ignoring the fact that opinion poll after poll indicate that voters' opinions have changed on several topics (eg, Boris, Brexit, the Tories, etc) irrespective of whether voters voted for candidate or party... |
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Post by Hutchyns on Mar 11, 2024 14:30:00 GMT
patman post
Far from it, and I expect that it will be voters total disillusionment with the way the Tory Government and its unelected leader have betrayed Brexit and made a pigs ear of a host of other issues, that the quality of their local Conservative candidate won't matter a damn to them .... the pale pink modern Conservative Party deserves and must get a historically hard kicking.
Even if constituents have the most brilliant Conservative MP imaginable (e.g North East Somerset) I'm still convinced that punishing the Tories for the immense damage they've done and continue to do, will be the overriding motivation. Naturally Conservative Central Office will cling to the belief that it'll be otherwise.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2024 14:30:13 GMT
I see this has the lefties rattled.  Labour supporters must be whooping with delight at the prospect of a new party kicking lumps out of the Tories when the election comes… You probably are. But come the General Election Labour still need people to actually turn out and vote for them. It does look like Starmer will be lucky come November. As for a by-election, is it really worth it with such a short time to go? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2024 14:33:07 GMT
Love the way that reform are now the 'far-right'.. He'll be calling it BNP-lite, or something, next. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2024 14:36:29 GMT
To do really well, Reform need a big hitter, and I mean Farage. They might get 30% of the vote - and no seats in the lamentable FPTP system.
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Post by Hutchyns on Mar 11, 2024 14:37:45 GMT
blackiswhite Not necessarily. The people of Rochdale indicated that postal voting is the way to go ...... those voting slips could be printed up, filled in, and ready to go within a couple of days of an Election being called  There'd be no President Biden and the peaceful world we enjoy today without the blessing of (huge amounts of) postal votes. |
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Post by Bentley on Mar 11, 2024 14:39:05 GMT
Love the way that reform are now the 'far-right'.. Wait until they win a seat . They will be extreme far right fascists … |
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Post by patman post on Mar 11, 2024 14:50:45 GMT
patman post Far from it, and I expect that it will be voters total disillusionment with the way the Tory Government and its unelected leader have betrayed Brexit and made a pigs ear of a host of other issues, that the quality of their local Conservative candidate won't matter a damn to them .... the pale pink modern Conservative Party deserves and must get a historically hard kicking. Even if constituents have the most brilliant Conservative MP imaginable (e.g North East Somerset) I'm still convinced that punishing the Tories for the immense damage they've done and continue to do, will be the overriding motivation. Naturally Conservative Central Office will cling to the belief that it'll be otherwise. Congratulations — a nifty rethink. But I think I agree with most of that, apart from your positioning of the current inept Tory administration on the political spectrum.
So far 60 Tory MPs have said they intend to stand down, plus a few who've become independent, so their opinions won't be a factor.
Seventeen Labour MPs are standing down...
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Post by witchfinder on Mar 11, 2024 15:01:06 GMT
They could almost be campaign slogans for the current Labour Party, couldn't they?
So Witchy, are you sure you know left from right?
Strange, that EVERY reference to the BNP to be found describes them as Far Right or Extreme Right, yet according to the wise poster "The Squeezed Middle" who is far better informed than say The Oxford Encyclopedia or Wikipedia, the BNP are in actual fact closely related to The Labour Party. You really couldn't make this up "Is the BNP a racial nationalist party? According to Tyndall, "The BNP is a racial nationalist party which believes in Britain for the British, that is to say racial separatism." Richard Edmonds in 1993 told The Guardian ' s Duncan Campbell that "we [the BNP] are 100% racist". Anyone who holds such views, similar views, or who is racist in any way is 100% not welcome in The Labour Party. A basic, yet fundamental principle of The Labour Party is equality, regardless of anyones race, colour, faith, gender, sexuality or physical ability. In the 1970s and 1980s the National Front and BNP engaged in an open hate campaign against black people and Jewish people, and later in the 21st century they turned their hatred towards Muslims, so I guess that Lee Anderson will fit in really well with the watered down version of the BNP ( Reform UK ). But dont insult Labour Party supporters by suggesting we hold similar views to The Far Right |
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Post by jonksy on Mar 11, 2024 15:04:57 GMT
They could almost be campaign slogans for the current Labour Party, couldn't they?
So Witchy, are you sure you know left from right?
Strange, that EVERY reference to the BNP to be found describes them as Far Right or Extreme Right, yet according to the wise poster "The Squeezed Middle" who is far better informed than say The Oxford Encyclopedia or Wikipedia, the BNP are in actual fact closely related to The Labour Party. You really couldn't make this up "Is the BNP a racial nationalist party? According to Tyndall, "The BNP is a racial nationalist party which believes in Britain for the British, that is to say racial separatism." Richard Edmonds in 1993 told The Guardian ' s Duncan Campbell that "we [the BNP] are 100% racist". Anyone who holds such views, similar views, or who is racist in any way is 100% not welcome in The Labour Party. A basic, yet fundamental principle of The Labour Party is equality, regardless of anyones race, colour, faith, gender, sexuality or physical ability. In the 1970s and 1980s the National Front and BNP engaged in an open hate campaign against black people and Jewish people, and later in the 21st century they turned their hatred towards Muslims, so I guess that Lee Anderson will fit in really well with the watered down version of the BNP ( Reform UK ). But dont insult Labour Party supporters by suggesting we hold similar views to The Far Right There is meed to point out the hatred of the UK as those who vote labour show their true colours at every opportunity... |
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Post by Bentley on Mar 11, 2024 15:05:23 GMT
Possible because the political term left and right is a subjective one .
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Mar 11, 2024 15:43:56 GMT
Strange, that EVERY reference to the BNP to be found describes them as Far Right or Extreme Right, yet according to the wise poster "The Squeezed Middle" who is far better informed than say The Oxford Encyclopedia or Wikipedia, the BNP are in actual fact closely related to The Labour Party. You really couldn't make this up "Is the BNP a racial nationalist party? According to Tyndall, "The BNP is a racial nationalist party which believes in Britain for the British, that is to say racial separatism." Richard Edmonds in 1993 told The Guardian ' s Duncan Campbell that "we [the BNP] are 100% racist". Anyone who holds such views, similar views, or who is racist in any way is 100% not welcome in The Labour Party. A basic, yet fundamental principle of The Labour Party is equality, regardless of anyones race, colour, faith, gender, sexuality or physical ability. In the 1970s and 1980s the National Front and BNP engaged in an open hate campaign against black people and Jewish people, and later in the 21st century they turned their hatred towards Muslims, so I guess that Lee Anderson will fit in really well with the watered down version of the BNP ( Reform UK ). But dont insult Labour Party supporters by suggesting we hold similar views to The Far Right And what's right wing about any of the above? The BNP and NF were left wing. That the current woke left reject them doesn't make them "Right wing". Like the very bad people, they were socialists and socialism is left-wing. And if hating Jews is "Right wing" then the current Labour Party would be "Far right". It matters not how many lefty academics are in denial over it. |
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Post by vlk on Mar 11, 2024 18:37:30 GMT
Defectors will always be viewed as traitors even among those the defectors defected to.
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