|
|
Post by Totheleft on Feb 18, 2024 16:45:30 GMT
Let me qualify my comment above . Hamas could have accomplished it objective (ie goading a reaction) by merely killing Jews. It didn’t need to rape and mutilate but it did just the same ..just as ISIS did and other Islamic terrorists have in the past . That is because Hamas are anti-Semitic depraved scum who believe that Jewish people are Kafir and therefore fair game for the worst possible treatment. And to support such is anti-Semitic.
And to draw a false equivalence between the actions of anti-Semitic depraved scum and the necessary actions of the recognised Jewish nation in defending itself is, of itself, anti-Semitic.
Arnt Christians Kafir? |
|
|
|
Post by witchfinder on Feb 18, 2024 16:52:08 GMT
This poster here at least partially answers my question But first, lets look at what Antisemitism actually means, and its not complicated at all, it simply means racism towards Jewish people, hatred of Jewish people or anything similar such as the desire to commit crimes or genocide against people because they are Jewish. I am willing to bet anyone a pound to a penny that the overwhelming and vast majority of people on that march with Jeremy Corbyn ARE NOT RACISTS, are not Antisemites and are not anti Jewish, but many will be opposed to the Israeli government and the Israeli Defence Force. Going back to my original point against the poster ... jonksy ... I still call into question his outrageous assertion that people who march either in favour of the rights of the Palestinian people, or against what the government of Israel is doing IS NOT ANTISEMITIC. The word "Antisemitic" is bandied about far too much in the WRONG context You can’t separate Jews and Israel . If you criticise the Jewish state you are criticising Jews. Let me repeat this I notice that the pro Palestinian protesters condemn Israel but not Hamas . I also notice that not one of the banners demand Hamas stop using Palestinians as human shields. The bias is so overwhelming but the lefties are blind to it. Oh yes you can separate Israel with Jewish people, first of all Israel is a state, a nation, a country, and Jewish people are a race and a particular faith or religion. If Israel bombed a hospital or a refugee camp or murdered innocents, then to criticise Israel, its government or its defence force IS NOT antisemitic, it is to criticise the actions of a state ( a state which happens to be majority Jewish ). I personally am not antisemitic, I am not anti Jewish and I would stand up against anyone who is racist towards Jews, but I will criticise Israel, the government of Israel and the IDF. |
|
|
|
Post by Bentley on Feb 18, 2024 16:53:48 GMT
Jews don’t want the world to be Jewish.
Jews do not have an equivalent of ISIS or the Taliban .
Jews are not anti West .
Israel is a platform for projecting Western ( US) military power in the ME.
Israel is a bastion of the West in the ME disregarding the military.
Jews are fully integrated in the West and have a powerful presence.
Jews are one of the most ( if not the most.) accomplished ethnic group ..ever.
You must be stupid to be anti semite imo.
|
|
|
|
Post by Bentley on Feb 18, 2024 16:59:48 GMT
You can’t separate Jews and Israel . If you criticise the Jewish state you are criticising Jews. Let me repeat this I notice that the pro Palestinian protesters condemn Israel but not Hamas . I also notice that not one of the banners demand Hamas stop using Palestinians as human shields. The bias is so overwhelming but the lefties are blind to it. Oh yes you can separate Israel with Jewish people, first of all Israel is a state, a nation, a country, and Jewish people are a race and a particular faith or religion. If Israel bombed a hospital or a refugee camp or murdered innocents, then to criticise Israel, its government or its defence force IS NOT antisemitic, it is to criticise the actions of a state ( a state which happens to be majority Jewish ). I personally am not antisemitic, I am not anti Jewish and I would stand up against anyone who is racist towards Jews, but I will criticise Israel, the government of Israel and the IDF. Nope. Without Israel being Jewish is meaningless. Jews are defined by Israel. If Israel commits an act in the interests of Israel then it is in the interests of Jews . I suspect that the only criticism of the Israeli government that Jews will accept is not antisemitic is that its action is not in the interests of Israel. |
|
|
|
Post by witchfinder on Feb 18, 2024 17:14:33 GMT
Ridiculous post Asking anyone to prove that anyone IS NOT something, it doesnt work like that. If you believe that the Labour Party IS Antisemitic, its up to you to prove your accusation, not the other way around. It was proven, which is why the party was going through a purge to try and address the issue. Obviously, the problem is far worse than Labour lets on, which is why it's still going on today. If Labour addressed the problem properly, instead of projecting their racism onto others, then they'd lose their key support. This is why Starmer flip flops when ordered to by those who are only interested in votes.
It's a disgusting party.
Where you say "its still going on today" could you please give us an example of where antisemitism is going on in the Labour Party, as in specific instances of racism against Jewish people. ? |
|
|
|
Post by witchfinder on Feb 18, 2024 17:23:34 GMT
Oh yes you can separate Israel with Jewish people, first of all Israel is a state, a nation, a country, and Jewish people are a race and a particular faith or religion. If Israel bombed a hospital or a refugee camp or murdered innocents, then to criticise Israel, its government or its defence force IS NOT antisemitic, it is to criticise the actions of a state ( a state which happens to be majority Jewish ). I personally am not antisemitic, I am not anti Jewish and I would stand up against anyone who is racist towards Jews, but I will criticise Israel, the government of Israel and the IDF. Nope. Without Israel being Jewish is meaningless. Jews are defined by Israel. If Israel commits an act in the interests of Israel then it is in the interests of Jews . I suspect that the only criticism of the Israeli government that Jews will accept is not antisemitic is that its action is not in the interests of Israel. If you were correct ( which of course you are not ) then it would mean for example that the state of Israel or its forces could indulge in any kind of war crime, unacceptable actions or massacre, and be fully protected from criticism because, according to you, to criticise such actions would be antisemitic. Do you not realise how completely ridiculous your assertion is ? If the state of Pakistan or its forces committed some kind of attrocity, and you then criticised Pakistan ( The Islamic Republic of Pakistan ), you would then be Anti Muslim or Islamophobic. To criticise the actions of the Pakistani state or government is not anti Islamic / anti Muslim To criticise the actions of the Israeli state or government IS NOT ANTI SEMITIC |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2024 17:30:36 GMT
Oh yes you can separate Israel with Jewish people, first of all Israel is a state, a nation, a country, and Jewish people are a race and a particular faith or religion. If Israel bombed a hospital or a refugee camp or murdered innocents, then to criticise Israel, its government or its defence force IS NOT antisemitic, it is to criticise the actions of a state ( a state which happens to be majority Jewish ). I personally am not antisemitic, I am not anti Jewish and I would stand up against anyone who is racist towards Jews, but I will criticise Israel, the government of Israel and the IDF. Nope. Without Israel being Jewish is meaningless. Jews are defined by Israel. If Israel commits an act in the interests of Israel then it is in the interests of Jews . I suspect that the only criticism of the Israeli government that Jews will accept is not antisemitic is that its action is not in the interests of Israel. I've noticed they're trying to redefine what antisemitism means. When ISIS were slaughtering people, which was enabled by Tony Blair's actions, none of them gave a fk. The hostility toward Israel is antisemitism because the hostility is based on the fact that it's Jewish. |
|
|
|
Post by Bentley on Feb 18, 2024 17:33:29 GMT
Nope. Without Israel being Jewish is meaningless. Jews are defined by Israel. If Israel commits an act in the interests of Israel then it is in the interests of Jews . I suspect that the only criticism of the Israeli government that Jews will accept is not antisemitic is that its action is not in the interests of Israel. If you were correct ( which of course you are not ) then it would mean for example that the state of Israel or its forces could indulge in any kind of war crime, unacceptable actions or massacre, and be fully protected from criticism because, according to you, to criticise such actions would be antisemitic. Do you not realise how completely ridiculous your assertion is ? If the state of Pakistan or its forces committed some kind of attrocity, and you then criticised Pakistan ( The Islamic Republic of Pakistan ), you would then be Anti Muslim or Islamophobic. To criticise the actions of the Pakistani state or government is not anti Islamic / anti Muslim To criticise the actions of the Israeli state or government IS NOT ANTI SEMITIC You missed the point completely . If the government of Israel committed ‘ unacceptable’ actions then by definition they would against the interests of Israel and the Jews within . You also missed that I framed the point around what Jews would accept as antisemitic . Im sure that there are Muslims that believe it is not antisemitic to wish for the destruction of the state of Israel . Also ethnic groups in Pakistan are not defined by culturally significant areas of Pakistan in any way that is parallel to Jews . Your translation of my post is ridiculous not the substance of the post . |
|
|
|
Post by Bentley on Feb 18, 2024 17:37:44 GMT
Nope. Without Israel being Jewish is meaningless. Jews are defined by Israel. If Israel commits an act in the interests of Israel then it is in the interests of Jews . I suspect that the only criticism of the Israeli government that Jews will accept is not antisemitic is that its action is not in the interests of Israel. I've noticed they're trying to redefine what antisemitism means. When ISIS were slaughtering people, which was enabled by Tony Blair's actions, none of them gave a fk. The hostility toward Israel is antisemitism because the hostility is based on the fact that it's Jewish. I don’t think they understand anything other than a knee jerk anti Jew reaction when Israel is involved . You are correct . When Isis was murdering other Muslims the lefties stayed at home . Just as they are staying at home while the Taliban in Afghanistan was and is oppressing the Afghans. |
|
|
|
Post by witchfinder on Feb 18, 2024 18:04:59 GMT
Israel and many who support the actions of Israel are hiding behind "Antisemitism" and using asntisemitism as a shield to cover themselves from criticism.
To criticise the actions of the government of Israel and the IDF for the deaths of 30,000 civilians in Gaza IS NOT ANTI SEMITIC.
The opening post in this thread inferred that marchers protesting FOR a two state solution, or in favour of the Palestinian people was antisemitic, when in reality it is not.
If I criticise the Israeli government or the actions of the IDF, am I then antisemitic ?
|
|
|
|
Post by Bentley on Feb 18, 2024 18:10:05 GMT
Israel and many who support the actions of Israel are hiding behind "Antisemitism" and using asntisemitism as a shield to cover themselves from criticism. To criticise the actions of the government of Israel and the IDF for the deaths of 30,000 civilians in Gaza IS NOT ANTI SEMITIC. The opening post in this thread inferred that marchers protesting FOR a two state solution, or in favour of the Palestinian people was antisemitic, when in reality it is not. If I criticise the Israeli government or the actions of the IDF, am I then antisemitic ? You ignored this . Israel , Israel but silence about Hamas. “I notice that the pro Palestinian protesters condemn Israel but not Hamas . I also notice that not one of the banners demand Hamas stop using Palestinians as human shields. The bias is so overwhelming but the lefties are blind to it.” |
|
|
|
Post by Pacifico on Feb 18, 2024 18:18:03 GMT
This poster here at least partially answers my question But first, lets look at what Antisemitism actually means, and its not complicated at all, it simply means racism towards Jewish people, hatred of Jewish people or anything similar such as the desire to commit crimes or genocide against people because they are Jewish. I am willing to bet anyone a pound to a penny that the overwhelming and vast majority of people on that march with Jeremy Corbyn ARE NOT RACISTS, are not Antisemites and are not anti Jewish, but many will be opposed to the Israeli government and the Israeli Defence Force. Going back to my original point against the poster ... jonksy ... I still call into question his outrageous assertion that people who march either in favour of the rights of the Palestinian people, or against what the government of Israel is doing IS NOT ANTISEMITIC. The word "Antisemitic" is bandied about far too much in the WRONG context You can’t separate Jews and Israel . If you criticise the Jewish state you are criticising Jews. Let me repeat this I notice that the pro Palestinian protesters condemn Israel but not Hamas .
I also notice that not one of the banners demand Hamas stop using Palestinians as human shields.The bias is so overwhelming but the lefties are blind to it. It's even worse than that - when someone does turn up with a placard condemning Hamas they are attacked by the mob.. |
|
|
|
Post by Bentley on Feb 18, 2024 18:19:24 GMT
You can’t separate Jews and Israel . If you criticise the Jewish state you are criticising Jews. Let me repeat this I notice that the pro Palestinian protesters condemn Israel but not Hamas .
I also notice that not one of the banners demand Hamas stop using Palestinians as human shields.The bias is so overwhelming but the lefties are blind to it. It's even worse than that - when someone does turn up with a placard condemning Hamas they are attacked by the mob.. Indeed. Which makes the claim that they are not antisemitic risible. |
|
|
|
Post by The Squeezed Middle on Feb 18, 2024 18:23:31 GMT
Oh yes you can separate Israel with Jewish people, first of all Israel is a state, a nation, a country, and Jewish people are a race and a particular faith or religion. If Israel bombed a hospital or a refugee camp or murdered innocents, then to criticise Israel, its government or its defence force IS NOT antisemitic, it is to criticise the actions of a state ( a state which happens to be majority Jewish ). I personally am not antisemitic, I am not anti Jewish and I would stand up against anyone who is racist towards Jews, but I will criticise Israel, the government of Israel and the IDF. The left are fond of saying that criticising Israel is not anti-Semitic. However, criticising Israel for defending itself against anti-Semitism is. |
|
|
|
Post by Totheleft on Feb 18, 2024 18:59:27 GMT
You can’t separate Jews and Israel . If you criticise the Jewish state you are criticising Jews. Let me repeat this I notice that the pro Palestinian protesters condemn Israel but not Hamas .
I also notice that not one of the banners demand Hamas stop using Palestinians as human shields.The bias is so overwhelming but the lefties are blind to it. It's even worse than that - when someone does turn up with a placard condemning Hamas they are attacked by the mob.. There Jews who.protest against Hamas.in.England not known any of them. To be Attacked. The loudish voices against them. Is Some orthodox Jews who see the state of Israel has a Zionist State Are the Anti -semitic |
|
