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Post by patman post on Feb 12, 2024 13:19:20 GMT
Seems to me that like the shifts from horse and oxen power to steam, electric, and ICE power, BEVs will develop to the point where they’re transport means of choice.
As examples, since 1970 seven lunar rovers, seven Mars rovers, and three asteroid rovers have successfully landed and been used for exploration…
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Post by Orac on Feb 12, 2024 13:35:11 GMT
Seems to me that like the shifts from horse and oxen power to steam, electric, and ICE power, BEVs will develop to the point where they’re transport means of choice. Because you use a Walt Disney model of technical innovation. It's very likely that the adaption that is needed is an adjusted periodic table with extra entries in the left hand column. Doing something about this would mean going back and adjusting the big bang |
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Post by patman post on Feb 12, 2024 13:56:43 GMT
Seems to me that like the shifts from horse and oxen power to steam, electric, and ICE power, BEVs will develop to the point where they’re transport means of choice. Because you use a Walt Disney model of technical innovation. It's very likely that the adaption that is needed is an adjusted periodic table with extra entries in the left hand column. Doing something about this would mean going back and adjusting the big bang That's an interesting collection of words. Perhaps, if I drop them into a kaleidoscope and shake them up, they might eventually reassemble into something coherent.
Meanwhile — referring back to my full post — the fact remains, battery powered vehicles have already proved themselves to be the only feasible means of transport in certain environments...
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Post by Orac on Feb 12, 2024 14:02:49 GMT
Because you use a Walt Disney model of technical innovation. It's very likely that the adaption that is needed is an adjusted periodic table with extra entries in the left hand column. Doing something about this would mean going back and adjusting the big bang Meanwhile — referring back to my full post — the fact remains, battery powered vehicles have already proved themselves to be the only feasible means of transport in certain environments...
Yes. If the earth loses its atmosphere I am going to be forced to concede a functional use case for BEVs |
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Post by Pacifico on Feb 12, 2024 18:18:40 GMT
Seems to me that like the shifts from horse and oxen power to steam, electric, and ICE power, BEVs will develop to the point where they’re transport means of choice.As examples, since 1970 seven lunar rovers, seven Mars rovers, and three asteroid rovers have successfully landed and been used for exploration… Well they might - then again they might not. You are placing an awful lot of hope on the right technology being developed and EV's becoming widely feasible. |
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Post by zanygame on Feb 12, 2024 19:24:30 GMT
Yes just like fly tipping, they will if they can. Fly tipping is a behavior rather than a technology. In any case, let's try to make your hysterical analogy work.. Imagine if they banned dustbins and forced people to use butterfly nets as a replacement - 'butterfly nets are 'perfectly adequate' they would argue. "I only have one piece of rubbish a week and i think most people are the same - what difference does it make?" Imagine if they supplied skips only to licensed companies to stop dumping pollution. Skips are quite aqequate but more expensive, so some people who don't care about the planet fly tip. Yes there are people like you out there, you are not alone in not caring beyond your own needs. You're the reason we need the very laws you dislike. |
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Post by Orac on Feb 12, 2024 19:39:38 GMT
Fly tipping is a behavior rather than a technology. In any case, let's try to make your hysterical analogy work.. Imagine if they banned dustbins and forced people to use butterfly nets as a replacement - 'butterfly nets are 'perfectly adequate' they would argue. "I only have one piece of rubbish a week and i think most people are the same - what difference does it make?" Yes there are people like you out there, you are not alone in not caring beyond your own needs. You're the reason we need the very laws you dislike. ..and you are just the kind of self absorbed prannie who, if allowed, makes it their life work to create and expand unrealistic and damaging regulations. In the competitive regulation community, it is a mark of pride to be able come up with, or support the ,most imbecilic and damaging set of regulations imaginable and nevertheless still get them past the line so they are imposed on the innocent (against their will). There is also a runners up competition for holding regulations in place despite them being obviously corrupt or dysfunctional btw I haven't dropped litter since i was about seven. I was quite pro social as a child and was often mistaken for Christopher Robin |
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Post by zanygame on Feb 12, 2024 19:47:09 GMT
Yes there are people like you out there, you are not alone in not caring beyond your own needs. You're the reason we need the very laws you dislike. ..and you are just the kind of self absorbed prannie who, if allowed, makes it their life work to create and expand unrealistic and damaging regulations. In the competitive regulation community, it is a mark of pride to be able come up with, or support the ,most imbecilic and damaging set of regulations imaginable and nevertheless still get them past the line so they are imposed on the innocent (against their will). There is also a runners up competition for holding regulations in place despite them being obviously corrupt or dysfunctional btw I haven't dropped litter since i was about seven. I was quite pro social as a child and was often mistaken for Christopher Robin Like preventing fly tipping. Or stopping people polluting the atmosphere because its a bit more convenient for them. Yep that's me. |
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Post by Orac on Feb 12, 2024 19:58:32 GMT
..and you are just the kind of self absorbed prannie who, if allowed, makes it their life work to create and expand unrealistic and damaging regulations. In the competitive regulation community, it is a mark of pride to be able come up with, or support the ,most imbecilic and damaging set of regulations imaginable and nevertheless still get them past the line so they are imposed on the innocent (against their will). There is also a runners up competition for holding regulations in place despite them being obviously corrupt or dysfunctional btw I haven't dropped litter since i was about seven. I was quite pro social as a child and was often mistaken for Christopher Robin Like preventing fly tipping. Or stopping people polluting the atmosphere because its a bit more convenient for them. Yep that's me. Everything is a matter of choosing between realistic alternatives.For instance - A ban on fly tipping is unlikely to significantly decrease the standard of living for millions of people and so the downsides are limited - even, perhaps virtually non-existent? This is the kind of distinction that you seem have a blind spot with. |
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Post by patman post on Feb 12, 2024 20:12:03 GMT
Meanwhile — referring back to my full post — the fact remains, battery powered vehicles have already proved themselves to be the only feasible means of transport in certain environments...
Yes. If the earth loses its atmosphere I am going to be forced to concede a functional use case for BEVs Atmosphere loss need not be the driver. Preventing pollution, or substituting an energy source could be another. Imagine helicopters on Mars — if they were electric, they’d not add to the local atmosphere’s unsuitability for human life… mars.nasa.gov/news/9540/after-three-years-on-mars-nasas-ingenuity-helicopter-mission-ends/ |
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Post by zanygame on Feb 12, 2024 20:17:17 GMT
Like preventing fly tipping. Or stopping people polluting the atmosphere because its a bit more convenient for them. Yep that's me. Everything is a matter of choosing between realistic alternatives.For instance - A ban on fly tipping is unlikely to significantly decrease the standard of living for millions of people and so the downsides are limited - even, perhaps virtually non-existent? This is the kind of distinction that you seem have a blind spot with. Driving an EV instead of a gas guzzler does not significantly decrease the standard of living for millions of people. Fly dumping does not change weather patterns burn down forests or flood peoples homes. Its a very measured response. |
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Post by patman post on Feb 12, 2024 20:21:49 GMT
Seems to me that like the shifts from horse and oxen power to steam, electric, and ICE power, BEVs will develop to the point where they’re transport means of choice.As examples, since 1970 seven lunar rovers, seven Mars rovers, and three asteroid rovers have successfully landed and been used for exploration… Well they might - then again they might not. You are placing an awful lot of hope on the right technology being developed and EV's becoming widely feasible. No hope involved — I’m confident that a suitable technology will evolve which will tick many more boxes than the current ICE offerings. Even producing synthetic petrol and diesel appears to use more polluting energy than it replaces. As for HHO, pull the other one… |
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Post by Orac on Feb 12, 2024 21:45:01 GMT
What you are saying is idiotic. In human livability terms Mars has no atmosphere. |
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Post by Orac on Feb 12, 2024 21:54:28 GMT
Everything is a matter of choosing between realistic alternatives.For instance - A ban on fly tipping is unlikely to significantly decrease the standard of living for millions of people and so the downsides are limited - even, perhaps virtually non-existent? This is the kind of distinction that you seem have a blind spot with. Driving an EV instead of a gas guzzler does not significantly decrease the standard of living for millions of people. *for short circular journeys if you have a garage and the weather is suitable and the domestic grid system keeps up. As I indicate and argue that simply isn't true. At least Dan is somewhat realistic - of those who argue in favour, he is the most realistic. Dan sees the BEV switchover as the much needed kick to clear the common folk off the road system and get them back queuing for buses where they belong. While i have only tepid sympathy with his motives, at least he is more honest about the likely consequences. I fear even Dan is going to blanch at the chaotic reality. |
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Post by Pacifico on Feb 12, 2024 22:17:29 GMT
Well they might - then again they might not. You are placing an awful lot of hope on the right technology being developed and EV's becoming widely feasible. — I’m confident that a suitable technology will evolve which will tick many more boxes than the current ICE offerings. Even producing synthetic petrol and diesel appears to use more polluting energy than it replaces. As for HHO, pull the other one… Well I was reading about a guy who was developing a Nuclear Battery that never had to be recharged - if he can get that to become a commercial product then it could replace ICE vehicles. However at moment there is no battery technology that can do that - you are living in hope that, at some point in the future, technology will arrive that allows EV technology to replace ICE. |
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