|
|
Post by see2 on Feb 10, 2024 20:45:02 GMT
. You wanted devolution within the Labour Party, and as I pointed out that is just a nonsense. Brilliant. We got there in the end . so you agree with me in you above statement that labour aren't different parties , and dont have autonomy in the different nations of the uk , but are one party with keir starmer as leader? Excellent. That took a long time for you to get to see 2 didnt it? I suppose you have been too busy calling labour activists who question your dear leader knob heads , and slagging off the electorate . WOW talk about double talk'. That there is only one Labour party has been my position all along. If you mean "autonomy" as in following different political policies then, my position is and has been that Labour Party members follow Labour Party policies. Now where is your clear example of just exactly what Labour MPs are claimed to have whinged about? |
|
|
|
Post by thomas on Feb 10, 2024 20:49:30 GMT
Brilliant. We got there in the end . so you agree with me in you above statement that labour aren't different parties , and dont have autonomy in the different nations of the uk , but are one party with keir starmer as leader? Excellent. That took a long time for you to get to see 2 didnt it? I suppose you have been too busy calling labour activists who question your dear leader knob heads , and slagging off the electorate . WOW talk about double talk'. That there is only one Labour party has been my position all along. If you mean "autonomy" as in following different political policies then, my position is and has been that Labour Party members follow Labour Party policies. Now where is your clear example of just exactly what Labour MPs are claimed to have whinged about? ive specified what I mean numerous times now. You aren't clever enough see 2 to try sophistry , so dont please , as it makes you look even more stupid. Glad we finally agree though after all this time that Scottish labour aren't an autonomous party , and that the Scottish branch manager merely follows the orders of his boss in London. Exactly what Johan Lamont , kezia dug dale , Wendy Alexander , Ian gray and many more have said over the years . I didnt say Labour MPs . I said labour msps and gave the link back up the thread. |
|
|
|
Post by thomas on Feb 10, 2024 20:51:18 GMT
Brilliant. We got there in the end . so you agree with me in you above statement that labour aren't different parties , and dont have autonomy in the different nations of the uk , but are one party with keir starmer as leader? Excellent. That took a long time for you to get to see 2 didnt it? I suppose you have been too busy calling labour activists who question your dear leader knob heads , and slagging off the electorate . Now where is your clear example of just exactly what Labour MPs are claimed to have whinged about? whinged? You aren't being very respectful of labour figures past and present are you see 2 today? |
|
|
|
Post by buccaneer on Feb 10, 2024 21:06:40 GMT
It is real. Look at the export stats from before and compare to now. Use an inflation calculator and work it out. Your arguments are flawed. Yes, I get it you like the EU, why I don't know, free movement maybe? But it wasn't working when we were in. Manufacturer after manufacturer left us. Even Ford stopped making cars and vans here and yet we're told it was good for jobs. It wasn't. After the vote to leave, industry got the biggest boost it had received for decades, unemployment fell. Exports rose dramatically imports rose as well. We'd all be worse off if we were members, and going back would mean joining the Euro and Schengen, and we wouldn't have a veto. You know we're not going back, so stop sulking and get on with your life. It would be an interesting discussion Vinny, why manufacturer after manufacturer left us for the EU when the EU was also in the EU. The advantage of being in the EU was that we shared the advantages of a superpower. We could demand better trade deals In the meantime costofbrexit.netlify.app/www.euronews.com/business/2024/01/12/brexit-here-is-how-much-it-has-cost-for-british-peopleBritain's departure from the European Union has cost its economy some £140 billion (€162.87 billion) so far, with an economic output of 6% less than if the UK had remained in the EU, according to a report by Cambridge Econometrics.www.itv.com/news/2022-12-20/brexit-costs-government-40-billion-a-year-in-lost-tax-revenueThere's lots more if you want to read them.
The report by Cambridge Econometrics has been rubbished. You need to check your sources before finding confirmation bias articles. Read the rest of the article to see how you've been conned, yet again.  www.briefingsforbritain.co.uk/sadiq-khans-brexit-figures-are-straight-out-of-fantasyland/ |
|
|
|
Post by Pacifico on Feb 10, 2024 22:46:30 GMT
Did you read it? It actually tells you that their calculations are not correct as it was made using out of date information - also it claims that there are now 1.8 million fewer jobs overall in the UK as a result of Brexit. The truth is that the number of jobs is at a record high.  Choose one of the others then. Or find me one that concludes we are better off. That way I wont think you are cherry picking data. I'm not the one desperately scouring the internet to support my claims. You seem to be making a habit of this - the other day you claimed there was a shrinking economy and today you claim that we have less jobs. Both claims totally unsupported by the data. Who are you trying to convince? |
|
|
|
Post by johnofgwent on Feb 10, 2024 23:22:59 GMT
Still causing division in the UK. Here's what the world and the UK think.  It seems 32% of the UK is alone in thinking the EU is a bad thing, Oh dear Let’s start by asking the obvious How many of the NON-EU countries other than us have bern forced to hand god knows how many billions of pounds to it over the past forty years and got fuck all except diktat after diktat and shit loads of unwanted immigrants we couldn’t turn away. How many of those NON-EU countries do you think would still consider it a good think if their treasuries were raided as ours has been and their shores invaded as ours had been. |
|
|
|
Post by zanygame on Feb 10, 2024 23:44:48 GMT
Choose one of the others then. Or find me one that concludes we are better off. That way I wont think you are cherry picking data. I'm not the one desperately scouring the internet to support my claims. You seem to be making a habit of this - the other day you claimed there was a shrinking economy and today you claim that we have less jobs. Both claims totally unsupported by the data. Who are you trying to convince? But I didn't say there were less jobs, I said find me an expert group saying that overall we are better off for Brexit, |
|
|
|
Post by buccaneer on Feb 11, 2024 1:44:06 GMT
I'm not the one desperately scouring the internet to support my claims. You seem to be making a habit of this - the other day you claimed there was a shrinking economy and today you claim that we have less jobs. Both claims totally unsupported by the data. Who are you trying to convince? But I didn't say there were less jobs, I said find me an expert group saying that overall we are better off for Brexit, You're the one making claims we're worse off since Brexit, the onus is on you to prove that. You've already tried and failed with your Cambridge Econometrics report, that looks as though it made-up a 6% loss in GDP out of thin air. |
|
|
|
Post by Pacifico on Feb 11, 2024 7:34:52 GMT
I'm not the one desperately scouring the internet to support my claims. You seem to be making a habit of this - the other day you claimed there was a shrinking economy and today you claim that we have less jobs. Both claims totally unsupported by the data. Who are you trying to convince? , I said find me an expert group saying that overall we are better off for Brexit, You posted a link saying there are now 1.8 million fewer jobs - if you didn't mean to claim that what was the purpose of posting that link? |
|
|
|
Post by zanygame on Feb 11, 2024 8:16:43 GMT
But I didn't say there were less jobs, I said find me an expert group saying that overall we are better off for Brexit, You're the one making claims we're worse off since Brexit, the onus is on you to prove that. You've already tried and failed with your Cambridge Econometrics report, that looks as though it made-up a 6% loss in GDP out of thin air. You're the ones claiming we are better off after Brexit, the onus is on you to prove that. |
|
|
|
Post by zanygame on Feb 11, 2024 8:20:37 GMT
But I didn't say there were less jobs, I said find me an expert group saying that overall we are better off for Brexit, You posted a link saying there are now 1.8 million fewer jobs - if you didn't mean to claim that what was the purpose of posting that link? The bit I highlighted. Britain's departure from the European Union has cost its economy some £140 billion (€162.87 billion) so far, with an economic output of 6% less than if the UK had remained in the EU, according to a report by Cambridge Econometrics |
|
|
|
Post by Pacifico on Feb 11, 2024 8:29:08 GMT
You posted a link saying there are now 1.8 million fewer jobs - if you didn't mean to claim that what was the purpose of posting that link? The bit I highlighted. Britain's departure from the European Union has cost its economy some £140 billion (€162.87 billion) so far, with an economic output of 6% less than if the UK had remained in the EU, according to a report by Cambridge Econometrics So the claim is that had we remained in the EU that since 2016 we would have grown by 14.4% rather than the 8.4% we actually did. How believable is that we would have been the fastest growing economy in Europe at over twice that of Germany or Italy and miles ahead of France?. Are you really trying to tell us that you honestly believe this?  |
|
|
|
Post by buccaneer on Feb 11, 2024 11:02:03 GMT
You're the one making claims we're worse off since Brexit, the onus is on you to prove that. You've already tried and failed with your Cambridge Econometrics report, that looks as though it made-up a 6% loss in GDP out of thin air. You're the ones claiming we are better off after Brexit, the onus is on you to prove that. Nope. Please desist from lying. I'm not the one throwing up dodgy reports claiming Brexit has made Britain 6% worse off. |
|
|
|
Post by buccaneer on Feb 11, 2024 11:04:18 GMT
The bit I highlighted. Britain's departure from the European Union has cost its economy some £140 billion (€162.87 billion) so far, with an economic output of 6% less than if the UK had remained in the EU, according to a report by Cambridge Econometrics So the claim is that had we remained in the EU that since 2016 we would have grown by 14.4% rather than the 8.4% we actually did. How believable is that we would have been the fastest growing economy in Europe at over twice that of Germany or Italy and miles ahead of France?. Are you really trying to tell us that you honestly believe this? I think he realises he's been duped by a sus report making up wild claims. Will he double down on this? |
|
|
|
Post by see2 on Feb 11, 2024 11:06:18 GMT
WOW talk about double talk'. That there is only one Labour party has been my position all along. If you mean "autonomy" as in following different political policies then, my position is and has been that Labour Party members follow Labour Party policies. Now where is your clear example of just exactly what Labour MPs are claimed to have whinged about? You aren't clever enough see 2 to try sophistry , so dont please , as it makes you look even more stupid. Glad we finally agree though after all this time that Scottish labour aren't an autonomous party , and that the Scottish branch manager merely follows the orders of his boss in London. Exactly what Johan Lamont , kezia dug dale , Wendy Alexander , Ian gray and many more have said over the years . I didnt say Labour MPs . I said labour msps and gave the link back up the thread. No you haven't, you have mentioned discontent, but not the actual evidence of just what the discontent is about. The 'sophistry' is all yours. "Scottish Labour, officially the Scottish Labour Party, is the part of the UK Labour Party active in Scotland. Ideologically social democratic and unionist, it holds 22 of 129 seats in the Scottish Parliament and 2 of 59 Scottish seats in the House of Commons." It obviously carries very little pull in either parliament, so there isn't even much room for a whinge, so I take it that the whinging, if any, by Labour in Scotland is nothing to write home about. Fit only for exaggeration by opponents and knockers. Labour MSPs are Labour. It is possible that you have furnished the information needed for debate, but I refuse to give consent to cookies to any news outlets. So if you think you have provided enough to debate I suggest you copy and past just the relevant part of information needed. |
|
