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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Dec 5, 2023 19:40:26 GMT
Dunno.
I am in the middle of a row with my local council, which requires me to send endless emails. I am also holding the fort for my son who represents a lot of people who really don't like paying taxes. And then there are the Christmas presents and concert tickets that I have bought on line. And the various bills I have paid in a similar manner.
Apart from making a few pots of coffee and pumping ship, I have not moved away from the monitor all day, but I reckon that I have earned my beer and bacon.
So one way and another, I reckon computers have made the UK more efficient and led to a considerable improvement in my life style
I notice much of your example is private business. Time is money in private business, where in the state, time is a safe 9-5 with mortgage automatically paid and a triple locked pension, just for needing your bum on a seat. Meanwhile the shit is overflowing in the Victorian sewers where no one wants to do real productive work.
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Post by borchester on Dec 5, 2023 20:25:50 GMT
Dunno.
I am in the middle of a row with my local council, which requires me to send endless emails. I am also holding the fort for my son who represents a lot of people who really don't like paying taxes. And then there are the Christmas presents and concert tickets that I have bought on line. And the various bills I have paid in a similar manner.
Apart from making a few pots of coffee and pumping ship, I have not moved away from the monitor all day, but I reckon that I have earned my beer and bacon.
So one way and another, I reckon computers have made the UK more efficient and led to a considerable improvement in my life style
I notice much of your example is private business. Time is money in private business, where in the state, time is a safe 9-5 with mortgage automatically paid and a triple locked pension, just for needing your bum on a seat. Meanwhile the shit is overflowing in the Victorian sewers where no one wants to do real productive work. I did not give any particulars, so am unable to see how you came to your conclusions. In practice I have found that the public sector uses larger and thus more complex systems, which as a result tend to have more faults. I have also found the public sector more professional than the private, so these matters tend to balance out.
Anyway, I like computers
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Dec 5, 2023 20:39:40 GMT
I notice much of your example is private business. Time is money in private business, where in the state, time is a safe 9-5 with mortgage automatically paid and a triple locked pension, just for needing your bum on a seat. Meanwhile the shit is overflowing in the Victorian sewers where no one wants to do real productive work. I did not give any particulars, so am unable to see how you came to your conclusions. In practice I have found that the public sector uses larger and thus more complex systems, which as a result tend to have more faults. I have also found the public sector more professional than the private, so these matters tend to balance out.
Anyway, I like computers
I looked the other day. I enquired about a simple legal process which just required the filling in of a one-page form. In the small print on the website it said allow 20 weeks for the application to process. I'm sure there is some bullshit reason, but no real reason. It could be done in a microsecond.
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Post by Orac on Dec 6, 2023 8:45:02 GMT
Everything we used to do in work re training was once done on paper, but is now done online. It takes a whole lot longer, the system often malfunctions, and sometimes all you get is the spinning wheel of doom as the training module refuses to load. It also every now and again refuses to recognise valid passwords which have to be sorted by a manager phoning India. And as for simple things like loyalty cards, used to be the case that they were always in the form of an actual plastic card, which required a quick scan of the barcode taking two seconds, job done. Now customers have been encouraged to put the damned things on their phones which many of them dont seem able to access properly. We are not trained to do it for them and are in any case not allowed to handle their phones. The amount of faffing about with their phones that some of them seem to find necessary truly is a wonder to behold. And of course most of their discounts depend upon scanning a loyalty card, and the ones who dont know how to use their phones nevertheless do not bother to bring an actual plastic card. Many a long suffering customer has been stuck in a queue behind such an absolute tit. Just examples from my day job of how the advance of technology is making everything slower and so much less reliable and more hassle. Computers may do stuff so much faster than us. But so much technology requires a human operator who knows what they are doing, and there is the problem right there. I absolutely agree. I think there is in incentive effect at work here. An efficient process clears a space and the next guy adds his bullshit there because there is now a space to put it and his job depends on the bullshit being there. I think the government should intervene to outlaw loyalty cards
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Post by Bvl on Dec 7, 2023 18:54:14 GMT
Everything we used to do in work re training was once done on paper, but is now done online. It takes a whole lot longer, the system often malfunctions, and sometimes all you get is the spinning wheel of doom as the training module refuses to load. It also every now and again refuses to recognise valid passwords which have to be sorted by a manager phoning India. And as for simple things like loyalty cards, used to be the case that they were always in the form of an actual plastic card, which required a quick scan of the barcode taking two seconds, job done. Now customers have been encouraged to put the damned things on their phones which many of them dont seem able to access properly. We are not trained to do it for them and are in any case not allowed to handle their phones. The amount of faffing about with their phones that some of them seem to find necessary truly is a wonder to behold. And of course most of their discounts depend upon scanning a loyalty card, and the ones who dont know how to use their phones nevertheless do not bother to bring an actual plastic card. Many a long suffering customer has been stuck in a queue behind such an absolute tit. Just examples from my day job of how the advance of technology is making everything slower and so much less reliable and more hassle. Computers may do stuff so much faster than us. But so much technology requires a human operator who knows what they are doing, and there is the problem right there. I absolutely agree. I think there is in incentive effect at work here. An efficient process clears a space and the next guy adds his bullshit there because there is now a space to put it and his job depends on the bullshit being there. I think the government should intervene to outlaw loyalty cards They are a form of market manipulation. The bastards should make their products better if they want more sales. I tend to boycott firms who use these sales tactics.
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Post by bancroft on Dec 7, 2023 19:05:38 GMT
The NHS is too big for the systems they have,if you ask a question their PCs are too slow they can't check anything.
The other thing is the front end systems they are developing seem to have no user testing as they don't work properly.
Another aspect is that some of the carers they use are thieves.
I know this from my Dad having a heart attack and regular check ups.
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Post by Orac on Dec 7, 2023 20:13:13 GMT
I absolutely agree. I think there is in incentive effect at work here. An efficient process clears a space and the next guy adds his bullshit there because there is now a space to put it and his job depends on the bullshit being there. I think the government should intervene to outlaw loyalty cards They are a form of market manipulation. The bastards should make their products better if they want more sales. I tend to boycott firms who use these sales tactics. There is a minority of the population that actually likes faffing about with their special cards, for rest of us it's just another layer of pointless tedium and delay. Compete on price and quality, not by trapping people in your own artificial currency
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2023 22:28:19 GMT
They are a form of market manipulation. The bastards should make their products better if they want more sales. I tend to boycott firms who use these sales tactics. There is a minority of the population that actually likes faffing about with their special cards, for rest of us it's just another layer of pointless tedium and delay. Compete on price and quality, not by trapping people in your own artificial currency There are a number of reasons why Lidl and Aldi are so much faster. than the likes of Tesco and Morrisons. But a biggie is that they have no loyalty cards for customers to faff about with and consequently no discount vouchers, and especially nothing put on customers phones. Much of the faffing about at checkouts is due to people looking for cards and coupons, especially on their pigging phones. And the problem is that there are so many big discounts on certain items that customers will spend as long as it takes to figure out what they have no idea how to do. And yet even that is a con. Because the discounts that were once offered to everyone are only now available to loyalty card holders. Which encourages ever more faffing about. Anyway, I know what goes on at supermarkets from the inside and could type loads but it really needs a new thread which will have to wait until I have more time off.
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Post by Vinny on Dec 8, 2023 0:13:26 GMT
The NHS is too big for the systems they have,if you ask a question their PCs are too slow they can't check anything. The other thing is the front end systems they are developing seem to have no user testing as they don't work properly. Another aspect is that some of the carers they use are thieves. I know this from my Dad having a heart attack and regular check ups. You have my sympathy. When my Dad had a heart attack, he had to wait over a year for a quadruple bypass op. In the intervening time he was in and out of hospital like a yo yo. But, he survived thank goodness.
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Post by walterpaisley on Dec 8, 2023 8:10:10 GMT
There are a number of reasons why Lidl and Aldi are so much faster. than the likes of Tesco and Morrisons. But a biggie is that they have no loyalty cards for customers to faff about with and consequently no discount vouchers, and especially nothing put on customers phones. Apologies, but you're a little wrong there.. Lidl DO have a loyalty card app' (it's called "Lidl Plus"). The only reason I know this is because I was in a branch this week and was a bit irked at how many things were stickered for discount IF the shopper used their app'.
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Post by borchester on Dec 8, 2023 9:51:46 GMT
Somewhat off topic, but a few days ago I ordered a month's basics via the internet and they were delivered within 24 hours and you could not do that before the arrival of these electric adding machines.
The only problem was that the driver, who was rude and worse, ridden with self pity. I told him that we all had our tales of woe and that if he did not like the job he could fuck off back to Bongo Bongo land (I think he was Cornish), but he still snivelled on.
I look forward to the arrival of delivery drones or such
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2023 11:12:20 GMT
There are a number of reasons why Lidl and Aldi are so much faster. than the likes of Tesco and Morrisons. But a biggie is that they have no loyalty cards for customers to faff about with and consequently no discount vouchers, and especially nothing put on customers phones. Apologies, but you're a little wrong there.. Lidl DO have a loyalty card app' (it's called "Lidl Plus"). The only reason I know this is because I was in a branch this week and was a bit irked at how many things were stickered for discount IF the shopper used their app'. Yes, I have that app and don't get irked at all. In fact it works a treat. I like Lidl.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2023 11:52:15 GMT
There are a number of reasons why Lidl and Aldi are so much faster. than the likes of Tesco and Morrisons. But a biggie is that they have no loyalty cards for customers to faff about with and consequently no discount vouchers, and especially nothing put on customers phones. Apologies, but you're a little wrong there.. Lidl DO have a loyalty card app' (it's called "Lidl Plus"). The only reason I know this is because I was in a branch this week and was a bit irked at how many things were stickered for discount IF the shopper used their app'. Oh OK. I have never seen one being used at my local Aldi. Though they have installed some of those infernal self service machines. No idea why but they seem to be used so much more sensibly by customers than at, for example, Tesco. People only use them if they have small amounts of shopping and know what they are doing. Anyone with a big load goes through a manned checkout and are much less deterred by queues than they would be at Tesco. And that seems to be because service is much quicker, with customers encouraged by the very set up - little room for shopping once scanned plus counter provided for shoppers to pack after they have paid, plus super fast scanning =- encourages those who cant keep up to just bung it back in their trolleys and pack after they have paid. And it works. Also the ultra show customers who think both they and everyone queueing behind them have all the time in the world tend to avoid Aldi and Lidl on principle because they refuse to be rushed. Which actually suits these stores perfectly. Because Aldi and Lidle have worked out that the faster you serve customers - the more cans of this or that you scan per hour - the more cost effective and cheaper are staffing costs. They have built their business model on this and because staff productivity is so much higher, they can afford both higher pay for staff to attract the best workers and lower prices for customers. So most of the slow ones who believe in taking their time on principle going to their competitors instead and thus slowing down the opposition even more, just makes it even harder for Tesco, etc to compete. Aldi have worked out that time is money and that increased staff productivity pays for both better wages and cheaper prices, so everything is geared for speed at their checkouts. So although they will never admit this and indeed would deny it, they dont actually want the slow ones who find it necessary for endless faffing about. It makes them even more competitive if these slow ones go elsewhere and thereby slow down and add to the costs of the competition. And a little inside information. Checkout staff have their performance continually monitored, including idle time with no customers, throughput which measures how much is going through your till, waiting time which measures how long you are waiting for customers to pay, and scanning rate which measures how many items you scan per hour. This latter only counts the time from when you scan the first item until you press the total button. And to illustrate the speed differences, Tesco has a scanning rate target for staff of 1100 items per hour. Aldi's scanning rate target for staff is 1600 items per hour. If these targets are being met, Aldi staff are scanning 3 items for every 2 Tesco staff are scanning. And that does not even begin to include the time many customers spend faffing about at Tesco once they have finally packed. So the Aldi and Lidl business model relies on encouraging customers to get their asses in gear as the price of faster service and cheaper prices, whilst those who cant or wont are deterred by the emphasis on speed, and slow down the competition instead. It is as brutal as that. It works for them. But it is not good for the elderly or infirm which is coming to us all at some point.
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Post by johnofgwent on Dec 8, 2023 15:03:05 GMT
Apologies, but you're a little wrong there.. Lidl DO have a loyalty card app' (it's called "Lidl Plus"). The only reason I know this is because I was in a branch this week and was a bit irked at how many things were stickered for discount IF the shopper used their app'. Oh OK. I have never seen one being used at my local Aldi. Though they have installed some of those infernal self service machines. No idea why but they seem to be used so much more sensibly by customers than at, for example, Tesco. People only use them if they have small amounts of shopping and know what they are doing. Anyone with a big load goes through a manned checkout and are much less deterred by queues than they would be at Tesco. And that seems to be because service is much quicker, with customers encouraged by the very set up - little room for shopping once scanned plus counter provided for shoppers to pack after they have paid, plus super fast scanning =- encourages those who cant keep up to just bung it back in their trolleys and pack after they have paid. And it works. Also the ultra show customers who think both they and everyone queueing behind them have all the time in the world tend to avoid Aldi and Lidl on principle because they refuse to be rushed. Which actually suits these stores perfectly. Because Aldi and Lidle have worked out that the faster you serve customers - the more cans of this or that you scan per hour - the more cost effective and cheaper are staffing costs. They have built their business model on this and because staff productivity is so much higher, they can afford both higher pay for staff to attract the best workers and lower prices for customers. So most of the slow ones who believe in taking their time on principle going to their competitors instead and thus slowing down the opposition even more, just makes it even harder for Tesco, etc to compete. Aldi have worked out that time is money and that increased staff productivity pays for both better wages and cheaper prices, so everything is geared for speed at their checkouts. So although they will never admit this and indeed would deny it, they dont actually want the slow ones who find it necessary for endless faffing about. It makes them even more competitive if these slow ones go elsewhere and thereby slow down and add to the costs of the competition. And a little inside information. Checkout staff have their performance continually monitored, including idle time with no customers, throughput which measures how much is going through your till, waiting time which measures how long you are waiting for customers to pay, and scanning rate which measures how many items you scan per hour. This latter only counts the time from when you scan the first item until you press the total button. And to illustrate the speed differences, Tesco has a scanning rate target for staff of 1100 items per hour. Aldi's scanning rate target for staff is 1600 items per hour. If these targets are being met, Aldi staff are scanning 3 items for every 2 Tesco staff are scanning. And that does not even begin to include the time many customers spend faffing about at Tesco once they have finally packed. So the Aldi and Lidl business model relies on encouraging customers to get their asses in gear as the price of faster service and cheaper prices, whilst those who cant or wont are deterred by the emphasis on speed, and slow down the competition instead. It is as brutal as that. It works for them. But it is not good for the elderly or infirm which is coming to us all at some point. I have not seen them at Aldi, i have seen them at Lidl People use them in other shops because they have no alternative I tend not to use other shops for that reason. The only thing i do not buy from a discounter is meat, because numerous small shops and two mobile lorries have sprung up around here to sell meat and meat related items and in that way i think Newport is returning to the retail practice of the days of my early childhood, service from a human, and i am all for it. While their produce exceeds the quality of the supermarket - and it does, for seemingly little extra as large retailer prices rocket, i’m happy to keep them in business
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Post by bancroft on Dec 8, 2023 19:29:14 GMT
The NHS is too big for the systems they have,if you ask a question their PCs are too slow they can't check anything. The other thing is the front end systems they are developing seem to have no user testing as they don't work properly. Another aspect is that some of the carers they use are thieves. I know this from my Dad having a heart attack and regular check ups. You have my sympathy. When my Dad had a heart attack, he had to wait over a year for a quadruple bypass op. In the intervening time he was in and out of hospital like a yo yo. But, he survived thank goodness. With my Dad it was an electrolyte issue so he has an ICD fitted yet he has also had a mild I guess stroke and his memory is really bad, he asks who the photos are of on his mantlepiece - grandchildren!
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