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Post by Steve on Sept 16, 2023 16:46:15 GMT
It's impossible to have a discussion without a common language One conservative tax policy = hard right government The cuts in the NHS and welfare she'd have needed to do to make those tax cuts stick would have been very hard right wing. But as it turned out she was so weak she U turned and then flounced - thankfully. But her aims and those of what passed for her team were hard right wing. |
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Post by Orac on Sept 16, 2023 17:00:41 GMT
It's impossible to have a discussion without a common language One conservative tax policy = hard right government The cuts in the NHS and welfare she'd have needed to do to make those tax cuts stick would have been very hard right wing. But as it turned out she was so weak she U turned and then flounced - thankfully. But her aims and those of what passed for her team were hard right wing. These are just 'run of mill' budget, spending and taxation decisions. You may disagree with them, but that doesn't make them 'hard right' |
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Post by Steve on Sept 16, 2023 17:38:45 GMT
The cuts in the NHS and welfare she'd have needed to do to make those tax cuts stick would have been very hard right wing. But as it turned out she was so weak she U turned and then flounced - thankfully. But her aims and those of what passed for her team were hard right wing. These are just 'run of mill' budget, spending and taxation decisions. You may disagree with them, but that doesn't make them 'hard right' They were far from run of the mill, they were massive cuts unfundable by anything other than cuts in the NHS etc. Why do you think she had so many people fired for asking awkward questions and told the Office of Budget Responsibility to get lost? Truss was always a puppet of the far right of the Tory party. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2023 18:41:38 GMT
...are these guys giving Nazi salutes … er … Ukrainians .. by any chance ??🤔 … or just hard Left Anarchists whose arms twitched up impulsively on their day off pretending they were Liberals?😋 I think that the word "Espana" on the banner gives you a clue... España not espanner  |
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Post by Orac on Sept 16, 2023 18:44:41 GMT
These are just 'run of mill' budget, spending and taxation decisions. You may disagree with them, but that doesn't make them 'hard right' They were far from run of the mill, they were massive cuts unfundable by anything other than cuts in the NHS etc. Why do you think she had so many people fired for asking awkward questions and told the Office of Budget Responsibility to get lost? Truss was always a puppet of the far right of the Tory party. again..they are just budget cuts you disagree with. |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Sept 16, 2023 19:21:50 GMT
I think that the word "Espana" on the banner gives you a clue... España not espanner Indeedy. But I can't access the accents on my phone.
Besides, it still ain't "Ukraine" however you spell it.  |
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Post by Pacifico on Sept 16, 2023 20:54:31 GMT
They were far from run of the mill, they were massive cuts unfundable by anything other than cuts in the NHS etc. Why do you think she had so many people fired for asking awkward questions and told the Office of Budget Responsibility to get lost? Truss was always a puppet of the far right of the Tory party. again..they are just budget cuts you disagree with. Considering that Labour were promising spending cuts 'deeper than Thatcher' in the 2010 election perhaps Labour were the far right?  |
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Post by zanygame on Sept 16, 2023 21:54:18 GMT
So starts a 'briefing' in the current issue of the Economist.
"...Across much of Europe, populist right-wing parties like Vlaams Belang, once relegated to the fringe, are going from strength to strength. In Hungary, Italy and Poland they hold power. In Finland, Sweden and Switzerland they have a share of it. In Germany polls put the Alternative for Germany (AfD) party at 22%, up from 10% in the election in 2021. In France the National Rally (RN), the biggest hard-right party, has 24% support. Add in 5% for Reconquest, another anti-immigrant party, and the hard right becomes the biggest voting block in the country. In the Netherlands, too, a smattering of right-wing populists claim a quarter or more of the vote. Even newish democracies that for decades lacked big nationalist parties—Portugal, Romania and Spain—now have them."
Four of the five most populous countries in the EU now have hard-right/populist parties in government or polling above 20%. But how has this come about? According to the Economist, there are three reasons why countries where governments seemed to have regained a measure of public trust and support during the pandemic now seem to be sliding towards populism:
"...First, support is remarkably broad. Second, the current circumstances are especially propitious for populist parties, with immigration rising after a hiatus during the pandemic, inflation high and the growing cost of climate policy creating a potent new focus for popular ire. Third, and most important, the hard right does not need to win power to have a baleful impact on politics. Simply by attracting a big share of voters, it is already skewing the debate, and so making it harder for European governments to adopt sensible policies on pressing problems, such as the war in Ukraine, immigration and climate change."
The question that arises is, of course, given that the conditions driving the growth of hard-right parties are just as prevalent in the UK as on the continent, and perhaps even more so, how is it that the UK has so far proved impervious to populist argument? Is it the usual question of lack of charismatic and cohesive leadership or is it, as the Economist implies, that the UK has already had its own fling with populism in the form of UKIP and the Brexit referendum they forced to Conservatives to conduct, and the electorate don't want any more of it?
Before engaging in this interesting conversation. Can I just say Dan, very well written OP. Thank You.. |
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Post by Steve on Sept 16, 2023 22:47:11 GMT
again..they are just budget cuts you disagree with. Considering that Labour were promising spending cuts 'deeper than Thatcher' in the 2010 election perhaps Labour were the far right? Link please to back that |
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Post by steppenwolf on Sept 17, 2023 6:34:23 GMT
[Question] When do populist / nationalist / anti immigrant political parties do best ? [Answer] In difficult times, periods of high unemployment, depressions, recessions, wars and crisis. The BUF ( British Union of Fascists ) did well during the depression of the 1930s, Oswald Mosseley attracted fairly large numbers of followers. The Nazi Party of Germany did well at the same time, except that Germanys economy was far more badly affected than ours, and there was humiliation after World War One plus hyper inflation. The last time there was a spike in popularity of the far right in this country was in the aftermath of the Financial Crisis and Recession of 2007-2009, the BNP managed to aquire 2 EU seats in the 2009 European elections. In this country, give the far right the oxygen of publicity and scrutiny, and they fail by showing the electorate what they are, and who they really are, as happened Nick Griffin and Question Time. Europe is going through a very tough time thanks to the war in Ukraine, with gas supplies and gas prices, some nations are in recession. When times are tough, some people turn to extremist solutions, but I am not worried about the far right either here or across the channel. You appear to be discounting the well-documented finding that, in the UK, 'far right' policies attract much greater public support when they are not associated with parties that are labelled as such in the mainstream media.
The BNP being a particular case in point. In 2006 a YouGov survey asked two sample audiences a series of questions concerning proposals in a BNP manifesto. One sample was given the questions without the BNP being mentioned, the other was told the proposals were BNP policy. 37% of the former said they would vote for such a party, reducing to 20% for those who were told it was the BNP.
Good point. And the example of Nick Griffin and Question Time was a total disgrace. The weasely BBC said that they had to give Griffin a platform as he was an MEP, but then they filled the panel and the audience with all the loony Lefties and ethnics they could find. Even the so-called impartial chairman (David Dimbleby) came with a sheaf of prepared BNP quotes with which to attack Griffin. It was nothing less than a lynch mob. No one was remotely interested in what Griffin said - they were just there to attack him or shout abuse. The BBC should have hung its corporate head in shame, but instead trumpeted the success of "exposing the BNP to scrutiny". |
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Post by Dubdrifter on Sept 17, 2023 7:30:21 GMT
It has to be said the largely Zionist-controlled Media love to play “LEFT RIGHT shake it all about” … as they roll out censorship and smear campaigns against anyone who wants to have secure borders and doesn’t believe multiculturalism or one world government is good for protecting diversity and individualism.
If you go up against Globalist ambitions … you will be labelled ‘racist’ and ‘far right’ whether you like it or not …
Look at the Amazon for an example where tribes have had their cultures arguably destroyed by Globalists from the same tribe running the Amazon Store online … tribes are chewed up and their culture is trashed by today’s Media and Globalist juggernaut.
…. yet it only takes one tightly framed picture flashed around the World of a tiny bunch of radical Adolf Hitler clones in Spain giving Nazi salutes for gullible people to have apoplexy … and continue to vote for border breakers and indigenous tribe destroying policies.
The rise of the extremist Far Right is a major movement in Ukraine today … and their thugs take to the streets in torchlit parades and beat people according to racial stereo-typing. They murdered a whole bunch of innocent people during the Odessa Massacre in 2014 … and the MSM plays down what happened to the present day.
[Note: A video showing this nightmare unfolding was pulled from this Forum ‘Roses have Thorns’ Pt 6 … because it was classed as too gory … but it showed these Nazis committing the worst atrocities … so was that a sensible bit of ‘censorship’ … or a damaging one for Western education?
As the Western MSM, NATO and EU have turned a blind eye to this for over 10 years … and secretly funded and armed these thugs and their National Socialist extremism and ethnic cleansing of Russians and other races and groups they hate …. how many here on this Forum are going to come clean and admit they were DUPED to give money recently supporting this ‘fascism’??
At the end of the day … it’s time to acknowledge we have a biased Western Press secretly run and manipulated by Sectarian Religious racists dressed up as ‘Liberals’ … with an anarchist Agenda … that appears to be working to destroy the West from the Inside.
Sadly Multiculturalism is a ‘happy clappy’ recipe for disaster that always ends in tears and anarchy.
Tribes are healthiest, strongest and most successful defunding other tribes, destroying their cultural integrity, diluting their gene pool through inter-tribal marriages, breaking Community unity and breaking important tribal borders designed to keep Peace and Stability … Sadly, it’s been a SECRET Israeli Programme(Pogrom?) for Europe since the end of WW2.
Israel under a self-protectionist arguably moderate(?!) Zionist, Netanyahu is fast track deporting Africans and building the most secure fence you can imagine … yet his compatriot Bloomberg is happy to brainwash Americans and Europeans doing the same thing is a bad idea … and will happily rig the political scene to stop Republican Moderates like Trump securing America … and stopping Brexit ideology spreading to secure borders in Europe … arguably breaking up their planned destruction of Europe.
It’s obvious why Netanyahu gets barely a mention for executing policies championed by Nick Griffin … that moderates have wanted in Europe for decades now - but no moderate Party would deliver for an Electorate hungering for security.
Boris Johnson’s 74% landslide victory was an Electorate screaming out for border security … but the Tories didn’t deliver as Deep State/ Zionist extremists pushed forward their Agenda to engineer a One World Government/A New World Order.
… We watch them destabilise our Communities, then put CCTV on every corner … lockdown and censor and bully Society into silence in 15 minute cities and sell them Question Time as FREE SPEECH in action. Lol 🙄
Hmmm … does that remind anybody of the Third Reich? …. Yes, Zionists highjacked Nazi ideology … and dressed it up as something ‘benign’.
But as Ukrainians and even Russians discovered … it’s nothing of the sort …. and it will rapidly destabilise/destroy the integrity of your Country … in 20 short years - that’s how quickly the Soros Posse destroyed America, Europe, Britain, Russia, Ukraine and the Far East …. yet the West still listens to him and his anarchist Family. Worships them … it’s bizarre.🤪
The Zionist Fourth Reich is sadly here now … It got into ‘the building’ … and declared itself @ 9/11 …. but the MSM ignored it … and declared “Conspiracy Theory … move on … there’s nothing to see here”.
The WEST’s failure to secure FREE SPEECH and INDEPENDENCE of the MSM from Religious Faction ownership and control … has been it’s downfall. … and needs now to be the way forward to healing the Totalitarian problem. Because Deep State/Religion is a marriage made in HELL that destroys TRUE Democracy.
We are in for a very rough ride now … and there is not another Churchill around today to UNIFY us … to save us from this Fourth Reich that’s deeply entrenched like a virus - in our Establishment now …
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Post by Orac on Sept 17, 2023 8:48:19 GMT
Colonel Klink impersonator predicts that elections will not be needed in the future
It's a real mystery why anyone would have reservations about the nature and motivations of our current establishment
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Post by sheepy on Sept 17, 2023 8:57:49 GMT
Colonel Klink impersonator predicts that elections will not be needed in the future It's a real mystery why anyone would have reservations about the nature and motivations of our current establishment I don't want to advertise the fact but they already have their followers of fashion around the world saying democracy has failed and the youth would rather have dictatorships than anything democratic, while Sunak is saying they must capture youth culture, be under no doubt the WEF is insane. Or maybe just completely openly fascist. Which lets face it has become the norm in western politics rather than abnormal. Admittedly they have always said for globalism to work it needs fascism of one flavour or another. |
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Post by Orac on Sept 17, 2023 9:10:38 GMT
Colonel Klink impersonator predicts that elections will not be needed in the future It's a real mystery why anyone would have reservations about the nature and motivations of our current establishment I don't want to advertise the fact but they already have their followers of fashion around the world saying democracy has failed and the youth would rather have dictatorships that anything democratic, while Sunak is saying they must capture youth culture, be under no doubt the WEF is insane. Or maybe just completely openly fascist. Which lets face it has become the norm in western politics rather than abnormal. Admittedly they have always said for globalism to work it needs fascism of one flavour or another. Yes - the stable society of useful compromises is continually undermined with messaging. If you set the establishment at level ten bat-shit insane, nobody who wants stability and order knows which direction to face. It's psychological warfare 101 - first you destroy the 'home', then you surround your opposition when they have nowhere to run. Somebody positing sincerely "there would be no need for elections because we would know what the result will be" is either completely unaware of even the basics of political science and human nature, or they have some kind of serious and potentially dangerous psychiatric problem. One of the oddest features of what is happening is how completely incompetent and incoherent people seem to rise effortlessly into positions of massive influence. |
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Post by buccaneer on Sept 17, 2023 9:57:56 GMT
The EU's migration system is in a mess and is affecting member states. Yesterday, golden child Germany was saying "willkommen" to asylum seekers. Today, its now telling Italy to piss-off and deal with its issues alone.
The lack of 'solidarity' is there for all to see. Same as it was with Covid. Same as it will always be in Europe. Member states at heart are still national democracies whom lookout for themselves first and foremost. The EU tries
to hodge-podge issues like this and is dithering as usual. This leaves a space for the right to air their greviences while the situation escalates.
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