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Post by thomas on Sept 3, 2023 8:02:53 GMT
didnt the majority of businesses and business groups in the uk support remain in 2016? You and your fellows , including prominent leave politicians didnt listen , so im not sure why the irish is now subject to your golden rule of listening to business when it suits when you and yours didnt.
The republic of ireland and its people , and the wider european union dont exist to service the business whims of o `Leary.
what are you talking about tommo? - the UK government agreed with UK businesses and advocated remaining in the EU. Why do you think that the Irish Government will treat their businesses any different? eh? you are waffling again pacifico. In response to the link jonsky posted , regarding the french calling for the cost of british flights to europe being increased , you said (macron) is gonnae struggle to gat this past the irish .
When i asked what you meant , you waffled on about paddy o leary the boss of ryan air mouthing off about it.
so you are now implying that the government of the independent irish republic , free of britian and EU members while you voted out , are going to put pressure on the french president on behalf of your country and an irish citizens business interests there , because the french want to impose green taxes on your country , which the irish government already support and o leary has previously locked horns with and failed to change their minds? 
aye ok pacifico. Another day another pacifico delusion of grandeur.
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Post by oracle75 on Sept 3, 2023 9:40:07 GMT
Macron has no control of the prices charged by private airlines. He can impose taxes.
¹
He has been doing this across France on short haul flights, looking to encourage use of the rail system as part of its net zero programme.
The UK is no more a target than any other short haul destination. The UK is not exceptional.
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Post by Pacifico on Sept 3, 2023 10:29:17 GMT
what are you talking about tommo? - the UK government agreed with UK businesses and advocated remaining in the EU. Why do you think that the Irish Government will treat their businesses any different? eh? you are waffling again pacifico.
Every household in England got a leaflet from the Government telling them to vote to stay in the EU - didnt you get one in Scotland? |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2023 11:05:51 GMT
The period after 2007 also saw a crisis, the world wide banking crisis and recession which followed was no more the fault of Gordon Brown or Tony Blair, as what the Covid19 Pandemic was the fault of Boris Johnson. I refered to the ten "normal" years of Labour 1997 - 2007, where public services improved due to higher investment in those services, and all without excessive borrowing. It was a period of ten years of sustained growth, low inflation, low unemployment, low interest rates and good quality public services which all improved. Its called cherry picking data sid. New labour governed sadly for 13 years , and we are still paying the price for that today in many ways. the comparion between brown and blair and the financial crash and johnson and covid is a nonsense.
Brown and blair refused to regulate banking despite calls for them to do so. Their light touch regulation contributed to the banking crash. i dont like boris johnson , but blaming him for covid is up there with the birds.
which ive mentioned in your post previously.
there was excessive borrowing. Because you hid this from public accounts through PFI disasters , doesnt mean it didnt exist of the taxpayer wouldnt pay it back. Heres another example of labours disasterous pfi debt whcih was put n place in your so called golden years before the financial crash....
A Labour council, operating under a Labour Scottish Executive and a Labour government at Westminster, needed to spend £150m on its schools, but rather than use a small fraction of the effectively free money that was sitting around unspent in the Executive’s coffers, signed off on a PFI contract that would cost Scottish taxpayers £729m to do the exact same job.
this would then later lead to the very same north lanarkshire council to make 1300 employees redundant and hundreds of millions of cuts due to the insane pfi debt and financial legacy your new labour party bequeathed them from your pre 2007 golden years you consistently waffle about.
eh? many of the schools and hospitals you built under pfi were later found to be crumbling and in bad condition like oxgangs primary in edinburgh , built by a building company that were cronies of new labour politicians.
As i always say about you sid , you pick really silly hills to die on. defending labour legacy on mass uncontrolled immigration in previous threads , and now their disasterous pfi legacy is simply stupid. New labour legacy of shame.
Fury at £729m bill to build schools worth a fifth of that amount
TAXPAYERS will be saddled with debut until 2036-37 after North Lanarkshire Council entered into the Private Finance Initiative.
North Lanarkshire (Labour) Council were accused of saddling a generation of taxpayers with a “damaging legacy” by entering into a 31-year Private Finance Initiative to build 24 schools.
The council made their first payment in 2006-7 and will have paid the £150million capital cost by 2016-2017.
But under the terms of the deal, taxpayers will not be free of the debt until 2036-37
im not an snp supporter. Im a scot indy supporter. We have pr in scotland sid , that your new labour party brought in , and only use fptp for your parliament. The polls are indeed looking better for your party , but still a far cry from the days when scotland was treated as your fiefdom.
Dont count your chickens till they come home to roost though sid. Unfortunately for you we scots have long memories , and so do many english people.
Its a bit like going around in circles with you - thomas Explain why borrowing during a recession ( crisis ) as under Gordon Brown, is different to borrowing during a Pandemic and lockdown ( crisis ) as under Boris Johnson. ? Explain why the UK public sector debt rocketed in a different recession 1992 under John Major ?, explain why borrowing ALWAYS rises during a recession. The Banking Crisis had most of its roots and causes in the United States, so please explain how Gordon Brown or Tony Blair was responsible for not regulating US banks. ? Banking is international, and without international agreements and international regulation, any so called "credit issues" or "credit crunch" is contageous, unless we build a wall around UK banking and force UK banks to sell off international interests. PFI is an issue all on its own, perhaps a separate topic, and I am indifferent to PFI PFI is without doubt a cost burdon on the hospitals, health trusts and education authorities that have them, on the other hand, would for example The 1,200 bed Queen Elizabeth Hospital in Birmingham have been built without PFI. ? The largest hospital site in the UK cost over half a billion pounds. Would any of the new hospitals and schools have been built without PFI ? The alternative would be to BORROW the money and add it onto government spending, increasing the budget deficit, sending shivers through the markets, increasing the cost of borrowing and affecting inflation. PFI contracts whilst they still exist are a burdon on individual hospitals, health boards I believe in Scotland, or health trusts in England. They work similarly to mortgages, you pay the debt off monthly, and most of your income you keep to spend on day to day costs. I could easily argue against or in favour of PFI, I am not sure whether they are a bad idea or a good idea, but you have to bare in mind that without PFI, most of the new hospitals and schools would not have been built. |
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Post by Steve on Sept 3, 2023 12:56:57 GMT
eh? you are waffling again pacifico.
Every household in England got a leaflet from the Government telling them to vote to stay in the EU - didnt you get one in Scotland? They also got one telling them to Vote Leave |
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Post by thomas on Sept 3, 2023 13:28:16 GMT
eh? you are waffling again pacifico.
Every household in England got a leaflet from the Government telling them to vote to stay in the EU - didnt you get one in Scotland? the wee bleu book was a personal favourite of mine ...
...now you were saying about paddy o leary fighting your brexit battles for you..............?
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Post by thomas on Sept 3, 2023 13:36:32 GMT
Its called cherry picking data sid. New labour governed sadly for 13 years , and we are still paying the price for that today in many ways. the comparion between brown and blair and the financial crash and johnson and covid is a nonsense.
Brown and blair refused to regulate banking despite calls for them to do so. Their light touch regulation contributed to the banking crash. i dont like boris johnson , but blaming him for covid is up there with the birds.
which ive mentioned in your post previously.
there was excessive borrowing. Because you hid this from public accounts through PFI disasters , doesnt mean it didnt exist of the taxpayer wouldnt pay it back. Heres another example of labours disasterous pfi debt whcih was put n place in your so called golden years before the financial crash....
A Labour council, operating under a Labour Scottish Executive and a Labour government at Westminster, needed to spend £150m on its schools, but rather than use a small fraction of the effectively free money that was sitting around unspent in the Executive’s coffers, signed off on a PFI contract that would cost Scottish taxpayers £729m to do the exact same job.
this would then later lead to the very same north lanarkshire council to make 1300 employees redundant and hundreds of millions of cuts due to the insane pfi debt and financial legacy your new labour party bequeathed them from your pre 2007 golden years you consistently waffle about.
eh? many of the schools and hospitals you built under pfi were later found to be crumbling and in bad condition like oxgangs primary in edinburgh , built by a building company that were cronies of new labour politicians.
As i always say about you sid , you pick really silly hills to die on. defending labour legacy on mass uncontrolled immigration in previous threads , and now their disasterous pfi legacy is simply stupid. New labour legacy of shame.
Fury at £729m bill to build schools worth a fifth of that amount
TAXPAYERS will be saddled with debut until 2036-37 after North Lanarkshire Council entered into the Private Finance Initiative.
North Lanarkshire (Labour) Council were accused of saddling a generation of taxpayers with a “damaging legacy” by entering into a 31-year Private Finance Initiative to build 24 schools.
The council made their first payment in 2006-7 and will have paid the £150million capital cost by 2016-2017.
But under the terms of the deal, taxpayers will not be free of the debt until 2036-37
im not an snp supporter. Im a scot indy supporter. We have pr in scotland sid , that your new labour party brought in , and only use fptp for your parliament. The polls are indeed looking better for your party , but still a far cry from the days when scotland was treated as your fiefdom.
Dont count your chickens till they come home to roost though sid. Unfortunately for you we scots have long memories , and so do many english people.
Its a bit like going around in circles with you - thomas Explain why borrowing during a recession ( crisis ) as under Gordon Brown, is different to borrowing during a Pandemic and lockdown ( crisis ) as under Boris Johnson. ? That isnt the comparison. Explain why new labour had to prolifically borrow vast sums of money on outrageous and hellishly expensive pfi deals during an ecomonic boom that could have been paid for by their administrations but instead was passed onto future generations ?
red herring. They werent responsible for yank banks . Tjhey were responsible for banking regulation in the uk , and failed the uk electorate with their laughingly entitled light touch regualtion.
so when banking went well , tony blair and new labour took the credit , but when the shit hit the fan , banking was international and nothing to do with them ? Aye ok sid. Save it for the fantasists who believe in new labour.
yes they would. The pfi deals didnt make these schools and hospitals affordable. Ive pointed out they were often 5 to 7 times the capital cost , and when the snp government took over in 2007 , they set up a quango who renergotiated the cost of thse pfi deals often half the cost of what the clueless labour politicians had originally signed them up to.
So what are you talking about?
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Post by Pacifico on Sept 3, 2023 14:26:28 GMT
Would any of the new hospitals and schools have been built without PFI ? Quite obviously - we have been building Hospitals and Schools in this country for hundreds of years before PFI was invented. |
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Post by Pacifico on Sept 3, 2023 14:27:33 GMT
Every household in England got a leaflet from the Government telling them to vote to stay in the EU - didnt you get one in Scotland? the wee bleu book was a personal favourite of mine ...
...now you were saying about paddy o leary fighting your brexit battles for you..............?
Are you pissed again? - I only ask because I said nothing of the sort.. It would explain some of your posts today though. |
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Post by thomas on Sept 3, 2023 14:33:26 GMT
Would any of the new hospitals and schools have been built without PFI ? Quite obviously - we have been building Hospitals and Schools in this country for hundreds of years before PFI was invented. not only were labour that incomeptent regarding pfi deals in scotland that the snp government set up a quango who renegotiated them often for half the price the lamentable labour muppets signed scottish taxpeyers up to , but even more laughingly , in the years up to the 2006/07 term prior to when labour got the boot and the forthcoming banking crash , the labour party in scotland managed to underspend the scottish bloc grant to the tune of £1.5 billion which was returned to blair and brown for which the labour first minister jock mcconnel was awareded a lordship.
So the idea the scottish administration under labour couldnt have built hospitals and schools without their dodgy pfi deals is laughable.
The contract was signed in 2006/07, the last year of the Labour-led “Scottish Executive”. Over its two Holyrood administrations from 1999, Labour had managed to under-spend the Scottish block grant to the collective tune of £1.5bn – money which was returned to the Treasury at Westminster because, incredibly, Donald Dewar, Henry McLeish and Jack McConnell just couldn’t think of anything to spend it on.
(£1.5bn would have been enough in 2006 to build the Glasgow [£210m] and Edinburgh [£500m] Airport Rail Links and upgrade the entire A9 to dual-carriageway [£600m], spreading the benefits around the country and with £190m still left over.)
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Post by thomas on Sept 3, 2023 14:37:25 GMT
the wee bleu book was a personal favourite of mine ...
...now you were saying about paddy o leary fighting your brexit battles for you..............?
Are you pissed again? - I only ask because I said nothing of the sort.. It would explain some of your posts today though. Why is it certain posters on this forum feel the need to imply others are either drunk or throiwng a tantrum when debating? Read back through the posts on this thread from where i originally challenged you on what you meant when you said this...
paddy o leary is going to fight our brexit battles for us with the french...
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Post by Pacifico on Sept 3, 2023 15:24:29 GMT
Are you pissed again? - I only ask because I said nothing of the sort.. It would explain some of your posts today though. Why is it certain posters on this forum feel the need to imply others are either drunk or throiwng a tantrum when debating? Read back through the posts on this thread from where i originally challenged you on what you meant when you said this... A thread dedicated to a proposal by the French to have a minimum cost for flights in the EU and you start banging on about Brexit.. If you dont want to discuss the cost of flights in the EU but would rather discuss brexit then start another thread. |
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Post by thomas on Sept 3, 2023 15:59:43 GMT
Why is it certain posters on this forum feel the need to imply others are either drunk or throiwng a tantrum when debating? Read back through the posts on this thread from where i originally challenged you on what you meant when you said this... A thread dedicated to a proposal by the French to have a minimum cost for flights in the EU and you start banging on about Brexit.. If you dont want to discuss the cost of flights in the EU but would rather discuss brexit then start another thread. i am discussing the topic at hand while you waffle your way through another thread and fill it with diversions innuendo and bullshit.
I asked what you meant when you said (macron) would have to run his plan by the irish , and so far , all we have is excuses , going off at a tangent , and now attempts to shut me down all off a sudden using off topic rules.
i ask again. In line with your earlier comment , how and why are the irish ( the irish people , the irish government or certain irish businessmen like paddy o`leary) going to fight france for you imposing green taxes on uk travellers? over to you?
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Post by Pacifico on Sept 3, 2023 17:09:39 GMT
A thread dedicated to a proposal by the French to have a minimum cost for flights in the EU and you start banging on about Brexit.. If you dont want to discuss the cost of flights in the EU but would rather discuss brexit then start another thread. i am discussing the topic at hand while you waffle your way through another thread and fill it with diversions innuendo and bullshit.
I asked what you meant when you said (macron) would have to run his plan by the irish , and so far , all we have is excuses , going off at a tangent , and now attempts to shut me down all off a sudden using off topic rules.
i ask again. In line with your earlier comment , how and why are the irish ( the irish people , the irish government or certain irish businessmen like paddy o`leary) going to fight france for you imposing green taxes on uk travellers? over to you? Oh FFS Tommo at least find out what we are discussing - this is not a proposal for the French to impose extra charges on UK travellers. It is an idea to have an EU wide minimum pricing for airline tickets - and as such countries like Ireland are going to be somewhat reluctant to hobble their domestic industry. Bugger all to do with Brexit. |
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