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Post by bancroft on Jun 24, 2023 13:17:05 GMT
The question isnt can wales or scotland afford independence red. Ireland shows clearly thwe wonder of getting out from under the dead hand of westmsinter.
The question is can england survive without the colonies? Seeing how badly you are coping after leaving the safety of the EU , i think it will be hard for you without welsh and scottish taxpayers and resources funding your countries delusions.
A little bit misleading, Ireland lowered corporation tax and attracted the UK based US multi-nats and their GDP soared yet hardly benefited the rest of the country whose standard of living remained the same. Also Ireland was not in political union with the UK. They also joined the EU as an independent country. |
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Post by thomas on Jun 24, 2023 13:34:02 GMT
The question isnt can wales or scotland afford independence red. Ireland shows clearly thwe wonder of getting out from under the dead hand of westmsinter.
The question is can england survive without the colonies? Seeing how badly you are coping after leaving the safety of the EU , i think it will be hard for you without welsh and scottish taxpayers and resources funding your countries delusions.
A little bit misleading, Ireland lowered corporation tax and attracted the UK based US multi-nats and their GDP soared yet hardly benefited the rest of the country whose standard of living remained the same. Also Ireland was not in political union with the UK. They also joined the EU as an independent country. Eh? Ireland was in a political union with the rest of the current uk from 1801 , to 1922. As for the rest of your post , i cant quite make out of you are extolling the benefits of irish independence to me or not. It certainly seems the former.
any day now , im sure dublin will issue a proclamation demanding to return to westminster rule. Cant think why they wouldnt. They must look over the water at us and think how fucking sensible scotland is remaining in this wonderfull one sided union.
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Post by Handyman on Jun 24, 2023 13:58:21 GMT
Tam, Ireland are governed from Belgium, and unlike N Ireland Wales and Scotland they are not beneficiaries of the very generous Barnett formula, which means they owe the EU (As at 2021) £205 billion, or €239 billion. So you see, Ireland cant keep their own cash, they owe too much to the EU who bailed them out when their economy crashed. Some of my wife's family still live in the South of Ireland, the rest are in England have been for years to find work, I have been visiting the Republic almost every year for at least 40 years, nice place but even before they joined the EU it was a very expensive place to live, the day the Punt was kicked into touch and the Euro took its place everything went up, it is a very expensive place to live, it costs me a fortune to attend weddings and funerals It is 12% cheaper to live in Dublin than London, however due to the rise in the population driven by people across the EU due to freedom of movement, plus taking in refugees the price of housing has gone up the price of housing has gone through the roof, the demographics of the South has been changed 25% of registered births a few years ago showed 25% of the Mothers were not Irish. My wife's village with a main street about 500 yards long is way out on the West Coast middle of nowhere the locals call it the " Back of Beyond " the only cheap thing on theses trips to get to Shannon or Knock Airport is the Ryan Air flight, rent a car over 200 Euros for a weekend , hotel room 150 or more Euro's a night for B&B, a grand gone before you even get to the bar and beer is not cheap either There have been demonstrations in Ireland against taking in more alleged refugees and people from across the EU to many people chasing too few houses, same has here As they say in Ireland the only way to be a Millionaire to leave Ireland is to bring two million with you for your visit |
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Post by Red Rackham on Jun 24, 2023 14:18:36 GMT
Tam, Ireland are governed from Belgium, and unlike N Ireland Wales and Scotland they are not beneficiaries of the very generous Barnett formula, which means they owe the EU (As at 2021) £205 billion, or €239 billion. So you see, Ireland cant keep their own cash, they owe too much to the EU who bailed them out when their economy crashed. Some of my wife's family still live in the South of Ireland, the rest are in England have been for years to find work, I have been visiting the Republic almost every year for at least 40 years, nice place but even before they joined the EU it was a very expensive place to live, the day the Punt was kicked into touch and the Euro took its place everything went up, it is a very expensive place to live, it costs me a fortune to attend weddings and funerals It is 12% cheaper to live in Dublin than London, however due to the rise in the population driven by people across the EU due to freedom of movement, plus taking in refugees the price of housing has gone up the price of housing has gone through the roof, the demographics of the South has been changed 25% of registered births a few years ago showed 25% of the Mothers were not Irish. My wife's village with a main street about 500 yards long is way out on the West Coast middle of nowhere the locals call it the " Back of Beyond " the only cheap thing on theses trips to get to Shannon or Knock Airport is the Ryan Air flight, rent a car over 200 Euros for a weekend , hotel room 150 or more Euro's a night for B&B, a grand gone before you even get to the bar and beer is not cheap either There have been demonstrations in Ireland against taking in more alleged refugees and people from across the EU to many people chasing too few houses, same has here As they say in Ireland the only way to be a Millionaire to leave Ireland is to bring two million with you for your visit Interesting Handyman. A short while back I declined an invite to a stag weekend in Dublin, god knows why they chose Dublin but when they got back all they could talk about was the price of a pint, which was €10 and even €11 (£9.46 for a pint!) in some bars. Yes indeed, they had an expensive time. |
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Post by Handyman on Jun 24, 2023 14:31:21 GMT
Some of my wife's family still live in the South of Ireland, the rest are in England have been for years to find work, I have been visiting the Republic almost every year for at least 40 years, nice place but even before they joined the EU it was a very expensive place to live, the day the Punt was kicked into touch and the Euro took its place everything went up, it is a very expensive place to live, it costs me a fortune to attend weddings and funerals It is 12% cheaper to live in Dublin than London, however due to the rise in the population driven by people across the EU due to freedom of movement, plus taking in refugees the price of housing has gone up the price of housing has gone through the roof, the demographics of the South has been changed 25% of registered births a few years ago showed 25% of the Mothers were not Irish. My wife's village with a main street about 500 yards long is way out on the West Coast middle of nowhere the locals call it the " Back of Beyond " the only cheap thing on theses trips to get to Shannon or Knock Airport is the Ryan Air flight, rent a car over 200 Euros for a weekend , hotel room 150 or more Euro's a night for B&B, a grand gone before you even get to the bar and beer is not cheap either There have been demonstrations in Ireland against taking in more alleged refugees and people from across the EU to many people chasing too few houses, same has here As they say in Ireland the only way to be a Millionaire to leave Ireland is to bring two million with you for your visit Interesting Handyman. A short while back I declined an invite to a stag weekend in Dublin, god knows why they chose Dublin but when they got back all they could talk about was the price of a pint, which was €10 and even €11 (£9.46 for a pint!) in some bars. Yes indeed, they had an expensive time. Dublin is a great place for a Stag Weekend the area named " Temple Bar " is full of great pubs music Bistro's Restaurants, but yes flipping expensive, I am saving up to attend another wedding in Ireland in October |
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Post by thomas on Jun 24, 2023 14:32:30 GMT
Tam, Ireland are governed from Belgium, and unlike N Ireland Wales and Scotland they are not beneficiaries of the very generous Barnett formula, which means they owe the EU (As at 2021) £205 billion, or €239 billion. So you see, Ireland cant keep their own cash, they owe too much to the EU who bailed them out when their economy crashed. Some of my wife's family still live in the South of Ireland, the rest are in England have been for years to find work, I have been visiting the Republic almost every year for at least 40 years, nice place but even before they joined the EU it was a very expensive place to live, the day the Punt was kicked into touch and the Euro took its place everything went up, it is a very expensive place to live, it costs me a fortune to attend weddings and funerals It is 12% cheaper to live in Dublin than London, however due to the rise in the population driven by people across the EU due to freedom of movement, plus taking in refugees the price of housing has gone up the price of housing has gone through the roof, the demographics of the South has been changed 25% of registered births a few years ago showed 25% of the Mothers were not Irish. My wife's village with a main street about 500 yards long is way out on the West Coast middle of nowhere the locals call it the " Back of Beyond " the only cheap thing on theses trips to get to Shannon or Knock Airport is the Ryan Air flight, rent a car over 200 Euros for a weekend , hotel room 150 or more Euro's a night for B&B, a grand gone before you even get to the bar and beer is not cheap either There have been demonstrations in Ireland against taking in more alleged refugees and people from across the EU to many people chasing too few houses, same has here As they say in Ireland the only way to be a Millionaire to leave Ireland is to bring two million with you for your visit i too have family on the island of ireland, only they are in the north. Im part irish myself , in terms of ancestry , and i dont doubt what you are saying about either how expensive it is to live in places like Dublin , and we know the issues the irish have had in recent times with immigration like much of the westernworld including your country.
No one is pretending ireland is some sort of nirvana.
However , they get to make their own decisions , stand or fall by them , and dont have muppets in england telling them they cant be irish and must see themselves as british .
So the question must be handyman , if irish independence isnt the nirvana they thought it would be , why arent the irish desperate to come back under mother englands apron strings? Quite obviously while irish independence isnt the nirvana where nothing bad ever happens , the irish are clearly much better of then what they were when your country was starving half their popualtion to death and forcing the rest to emigrate.
You only need to compare the independent part of the island of ireland , and superior quality of living and how rich they have become including having the ability to be part of the eu without your country dragging them out , and the impoverished british part in the north.
No wonder the poor irish stuggle on stoically with independence eh? cant think why.
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Post by Red Rackham on Jun 24, 2023 14:58:09 GMT
i too have family on the island of ireland, only they are in the north. Im part irish myself , in terms of ancestry , and i dont doubt what you are saying about either how expensive it is to live in places like Dublin , and we know the issues the irish have had in recent times with immigration like much of the westernworld including your country. No one is pretending ireland is some sort of nirvana. However , they get to make their own decisions , stand or fall by them , and dont have muppets in england telling them they cant be irish and must see themselves as british. So the question must be handyman , if irish independence isnt the nirvana they thought it would be , why arent the irish desperate to come back under mother englands apron strings? Quite obviously while irish independence isnt the nirvana where nothing bad ever happens , the irish are clearly much better of then what they were when your country was starving half their popualtion to death and forcing the rest to emigrate. You only need to compare the independent part of the island of ireland , and superior quality of living and how rich they have become including having the ability to be part of the eu without your country dragging them out , and the impoverished british part in the north. No wonder the poor irish stuggle on stoically with independence eh? cant think why. Apologies for pointing out your error Tam, but unless Ireland have left the EU, they do not make their own decisions. As a member state of the EU they are governed from Brussels. |
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Post by bancroft on Jun 24, 2023 15:09:53 GMT
Ireland did get huge bank bail outs in 2011 from UK, IMF and EU. This bbc article says UK and IMF repaid by 2017 yet much larger EU fund remains outstanding, article is dated 2021 with no updates www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-56539764 |
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Post by thomas on Jun 24, 2023 15:21:47 GMT
i too have family on the island of ireland, only they are in the north. Im part irish myself , in terms of ancestry , and i dont doubt what you are saying about either how expensive it is to live in places like Dublin , and we know the issues the irish have had in recent times with immigration like much of the westernworld including your country. No one is pretending ireland is some sort of nirvana. However , they get to make their own decisions , stand or fall by them , and dont have muppets in england telling them they cant be irish and must see themselves as british. So the question must be handyman , if irish independence isnt the nirvana they thought it would be , why arent the irish desperate to come back under mother englands apron strings? Quite obviously while irish independence isnt the nirvana where nothing bad ever happens , the irish are clearly much better of then what they were when your country was starving half their popualtion to death and forcing the rest to emigrate. You only need to compare the independent part of the island of ireland , and superior quality of living and how rich they have become including having the ability to be part of the eu without your country dragging them out , and the impoverished british part in the north. No wonder the poor irish stuggle on stoically with independence eh? cant think why. Apologies for pointing out your error Tam, but unless Ireland have left the EU, they do not make their own decisions. As a member state of the EU they are governed from Brussels. The irish have more self governing power within the EU , including the ability to leave it , than we do in the uk , where we are told we are not allowed to democratically leave.
apologies red for pointing this out , but i would take that what the irish have any day of the week mate.
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Post by thomas on Jun 24, 2023 15:27:42 GMT
Ireland did get huge bank bail outs in 2011 from UK, IMF and EU. This bbc article says UK and IMF repaid by 2017 yet much larger EU fund remains outstanding, article is dated 2021 with no updates www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-56539764didnt the imf bail out the uk as well once upon a time? Sorry bancroft , im still not really getting the point behind your post.
The western world largely had to be bailed out with the exception from memory of wee iceland who let their banks fails and jailed corrupt bankers.
If independence is that bad for all these countires , and they cant manage thier economies as you imply , why arent they begging to become part of the uk ?
Isnt the uks current debt at levels not seen in more than half a century? Isnt the uk econommy predictd to be the worst in the developed world , lagging way behind wee irelands economy in terms of growth?
Considering the current state of the uk economy , i wouldnt be trying to dredge up dirt on other nations in economic terms. The uk ......Greece without the sunshine and decent food.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2023 15:30:46 GMT
Apologies for pointing out your error Tam, but unless Ireland have left the EU, they do not make their own decisions. As a member state of the EU they are governed from Brussels. The irish have more self governing power within the EU , including the ability to leave it , than we do in the uk , where we are told we are not allowed to democratically leave.
apologies red for pointing this out , but i would take that what the irish have any day of the week mate.
Here on planet Earth we have left the EU. Parliament had the power to leave at anytime, and from memory the process was added in Lisbon. For how long this would have been possible is anyone's guess, considering there is greater demand from more centralisation of power in the EU that the ordinary people won't have a sniff at. It all went through a referendum to acquire the democratic mandate from the people.
If Ireland want out then they should be making preparations now.
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Post by thomas on Jun 24, 2023 15:32:58 GMT
The irish have more self governing power within the EU , including the ability to leave it , than we do in the uk , where we are told we are not allowed to democratically leave.
apologies red for pointing this out , but i would take that what the irish have any day of the week mate.
Here on planet Earth we have left the EU.
here on planet earth we are talking about ireland , who havent left the EU. Even the british part in the north is still in the EU.
your parliament will have the power to go back in when keir the europhile starmer takes back control.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2023 15:33:21 GMT
It's like talking to a child.
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Post by thomas on Jun 24, 2023 15:34:28 GMT
The irish have more self governing power within the EU , including the ability to leave it , than we do in the uk , where we are told we are not allowed to democratically leave.
apologies red for pointing this out , but i would take that what the irish have any day of the week mate.
If Ireland want out then they should be making preparations now.
Ireland dont want out. Yet again , like calling the snp nazis and much else you make up on the hoof , you are telling porkies once more b4.
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Post by thomas on Jun 24, 2023 15:35:21 GMT
It's like talking to a child. im sorry you couldnt follow a simple conversation between the grown ups and thought we were talking about your little uk instead of the mighty irish nation. |
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