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Post by Pacifico on May 21, 2023 7:15:57 GMT
Yet in the polls that matter the people always vote for lower taxes... funny that..  . Yet the party well known for increasing public spending is miles ahead in the polls funny that. 😂 🤣 Well thats a lie - for the last 2 GE's the LibDems have had manifesto commitments to increase taxes. After the last election they ended up with less MP's than they started. |
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Post by Pacifico on May 21, 2023 7:18:03 GMT
Here is another lefty who keeps saying people want to pay more tax - yet when given the chance he doesn't..  God, how many times have I seen this stupid argument. Ask an individual who says we should pay more tax to right out a personal cheque to HMRC. When anyone with a brain older than 12 knows it can't work like that. To raise enough tax to make a difference you need to collect from those who can afford it but don't want to pay it. Those who got rich because they lived in Great Britain, but don't want to give back. Amazon etc didn't get rich selling into poor countries with basic public services, they got rich selling into well run stable and safe countries with a healthy population. You have shifted your argument - you originally claimed that people want to pay more tax. Now you are saying that people want someone else to pay more tax. Well that is not a revelation.. |
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Post by zanygame on May 21, 2023 7:39:30 GMT
As stated we are not given that direct choice. Yet the party well known for increasing public spending is miles ahead in the polls funny that. 😂 🤣 Well thats a lie - for the last 2 GE's the LibDems have had manifesto commitments to increase taxes. After the last election they ended up with less MP's than they started. Your over simplification of how we vote is the same one used by Brexit supporters. I'E. Corbyn supported rejoining, we didn't vote for Corbyn, therefore we don't support re-joining. Its rather pathetic. So before you answer me how about you think of the reasons people did not vote Lib dem. Hint, a wasted vote |
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Post by wapentake on May 21, 2023 7:56:40 GMT
You couldn’t answer any of my other points? Sorry - I thought you were just venting.. And I think you’re evading answering |
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Post by Pacifico on May 21, 2023 10:51:15 GMT
Well thats a lie - for the last 2 GE's the LibDems have had manifesto commitments to increase taxes. After the last election they ended up with less MP's than they started. Your over simplification of how we vote is the same one used by Brexit supporters. I'E. Corbyn supported rejoining, we didn't vote for Corbyn, therefore we don't support re-joining. Its rather pathetic. So before you answer me how about you think of the reasons people did not vote Lib dem. Hint, a wasted vote If you dont vote for parties advocating policies that you support then there really is nobody to blame when those policies do not get enacted except yourself. If you dont want to vote for Parties promising higher taxes how do you expect them to be implemented? |
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Post by Pacifico on May 21, 2023 10:56:12 GMT
Sorry - I thought you were just venting.. And I think you’re evading answering Well if you want to start talking about energy then I believe energy prices are way too high. But that isnt as a result of who owns the energy companies - it's due to politicians who prevent us using our own energy resources. |
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Post by Red Rackham on May 21, 2023 11:50:16 GMT
Getting back on topic briefly (lol) I listened to someone on GB News yesterday who said in order to pay for upgrading Victorian sewers and sewarage systems, water bills will increase every year for the next 100 years. Also, water companies will pay shareholders an estimated £15 billion in dividends over he next six years. Also, our water rates at Rackham Towers has gone up 150% in ten years.
When it comes to the privatised water industry, something has gone spectacularly wrong.
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Post by zanygame on May 21, 2023 14:59:45 GMT
Your over simplification of how we vote is the same one used by Brexit supporters. I'E. Corbyn supported rejoining, we didn't vote for Corbyn, therefore we don't support re-joining. Its rather pathetic. So before you answer me how about you think of the reasons people did not vote Lib dem. Hint, a wasted vote If you dont vote for parties advocating policies that you support then there really is nobody to blame when those policies do not get enacted except yourself. If you dont want to vote for Parties promising higher taxes how do you expect them to be implemented? There are many policies from each party. |
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Post by Pacifico on May 21, 2023 16:36:51 GMT
If you dont vote for parties advocating policies that you support then there really is nobody to blame when those policies do not get enacted except yourself. If you dont want to vote for Parties promising higher taxes how do you expect them to be implemented? There are many policies from each party. Which does not answer my question. Do you think that we would have had a referendum on EU membership if people had not voted for UKIP? |
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Post by zanygame on May 21, 2023 16:45:57 GMT
There are many policies from each party. Which does not answer my question. Do you think that we would have had a referendum on EU membership if people had not voted for UKIP? No I don't, which is a shame. But there are very few issues that can gather that sort of support. My view is that a vote for the libdems would just be another vote for the Tories. I don't think it proves your argument that people don't want taxes raised. Most people want the rich to pay more tax. So I'm voting Labour because I do expect them to raise taxes and repair the damage done to the NHS. I hope they would also sort the railways and the water, but I'm a pragmatist. |
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Post by Pacifico on May 21, 2023 16:48:25 GMT
Which does not answer my question. Do you think that we would have had a referendum on EU membership if people had not voted for UKIP? No I don't, which is a shame. But there are very few issues that can gather that sort of support. My view is that a vote for the libdems would just be another vote for the Tories. I don't think it proves your argument that people don't want taxes raised. Most people want the rich to pay more tax. So I'm voting Labour because I do expect them to raise taxes and repair the damage done to the NHS. I hope they would also sort the railways and the water, but I'm a pragmatist. You just made the point - they want someone else to pay more tax (the mythical 'rich') - they certainly do not want to pay more tax themselves. |
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Post by zanygame on May 21, 2023 17:19:48 GMT
No I don't, which is a shame. But there are very few issues that can gather that sort of support. My view is that a vote for the libdems would just be another vote for the Tories. I don't think it proves your argument that people don't want taxes raised. Most people want the rich to pay more tax. So I'm voting Labour because I do expect them to raise taxes and repair the damage done to the NHS. I hope they would also sort the railways and the water, but I'm a pragmatist. You just made the point - they want someone else to pay more tax (the mythical 'rich') - they certainly do not want to pay more tax themselves. Yes, they want those who can afford to pay and made their money off the back of the UK to pay more. And believe me the rich are not mythical. We have friends who have just spent £11,000 on lounge sofas. We can afford more tax easily with no noticeable effect on our lives. Oh an BTW stop the mocking while stating the obvious. Of course those who can barely afford to feed themselves want those with ridiculous wealth to pay more. Sigh. |
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Post by Pacifico on May 21, 2023 17:50:31 GMT
You just made the point - they want someone else to pay more tax (the mythical 'rich') - they certainly do not want to pay more tax themselves. Yes, they want those who can afford to pay and made their money off the back of the UK to pay more. And believe me the rich are not mythical. We have friends who have just spent £11,000 on lounge sofas. We can afford more tax easily with no noticeable effect on our lives. Oh an BTW stop the mocking while stating the obvious. Of course those who can barely afford to feed themselves want those with ridiculous wealth to pay more. Sigh. There are articles in both the Guardian and Indy today complaining that Teachers and Nurses are now more commonly being high rate taxpayers. Apparently public sector workers should be exempt from these tax increases - perhaps they expect us to spend every evening clapping like demented seals whilst they rake in high wages. The trouble with the Labour Party is that they dont imagine that people can change their lifestyle - they really think that non-doms, billionaires etc etc are going to stay around in the UK and pay all this extra tax they want. The only tax increase that raises any where near the forecast amount is a rise in VAT - all others lead to lifestyle changes that make squeezing the pips a pointless exercise - as Denis Healey admitted when he tried it and it failed. |
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Post by zanygame on May 21, 2023 18:49:59 GMT
Yes, they want those who can afford to pay and made their money off the back of the UK to pay more. And believe me the rich are not mythical. We have friends who have just spent £11,000 on lounge sofas. We can afford more tax easily with no noticeable effect on our lives. Oh an BTW stop the mocking while stating the obvious. Of course those who can barely afford to feed themselves want those with ridiculous wealth to pay more. Sigh. I have said for sometime now that I don't think pay rates are the reason the NHS struggles to keep staff. High pay is the only reason more don't leave. The problem is circular, no new staff makes the wards etc understaffed and very stressful, this makes the jobs undesirable and continues the problem. Its gonna take a while to fix this The trouble with this Laffer curve theory is that is just not true. Non of the wealthy people I know would leave their family, home, golf club, shooting buddies to move to a country with slightly better tax terms. Its a myth put out to convince us we can't raise taxes. There's no more money left in the poor. A wealth tax could raise £22Bn a year ( An annual tax of 2% on any asset worth over £10m) I do not believe for a second that any Tory politician squeezed any rich person till the pips squeaked. |
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Post by zanygame on May 21, 2023 19:03:39 GMT
A true example of my point above.
My daughter in law is a ward sister on a special care baby unit. When she started they used to take it in turns to cover the intensive care ward, a very stressful area to work with many distraught and desperate parents and babies with a high mortality rate.
This ward requires a sister with certain experience and qualifications and in the last couple of years due to staff resignations there are to few of these.
So now my daughter in law is constantly on this ward,12.5 hour shifts of extreme stress. Already she has reduced her hours, but that has just made things worse as she dreads going in and finding critical tasks piled up and waiting for her and angry (worried) parents demanding information she doesn't have.
She never gets to see the babies that recover and go home as they leave her ward long before that, she never gets the tearful parents thanking her and giving chocolates and flowers, just endless sadness and pressure.
She is looking to leave and take a much lower paid job as soon as they can.
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