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Post by bancroft on May 17, 2023 11:51:04 GMT
@srb7677
16-17 year olds have had little experience of the world.
Not quite children yet certainly not adults.
Pensioners on the other hand have worked and paid taxes and seen friends die and see children born. They would probably have faced challenges in their own lives with the up and down economic and political cycles. So know from experience a little of politics and broken promises so think a little harder about it.
Young adults are susceptible to being influenced by teachers with a union mind-set and the loudest friend. As are older students yet at least they have a couple more years of experience under their belts and their brains are a bit bigger.
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Post by see2 on May 17, 2023 12:17:03 GMT
If somebody has been here for "ten, twenty, thirty years" and hasn't got British citizenship, then they obviously don't want it and are not that bothered about the ability to vote. That does not make a long term committed resident any less committed to this country. It is the point of commitment, like I'm married to a Brit, a tax payer, paying of NI, of children born here etc. that is the point that Starmer in making. |
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Post by Bentley on May 17, 2023 12:34:37 GMT
If they are not willing to make the effort to become citizens of the UK then they are not fully committed to the UK.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2023 12:45:52 GMT
If they are not willing to make the effort to become citizens of the UK then they are not fully committed to the UK. We need to be committed if we are UK citizens.🤣 |
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Post by see2 on May 17, 2023 12:47:20 GMT
If they are not willing to make the effort to become citizens of the UK then they are not fully committed to the UK. In your opinion. And all your opinion means is that you cannot think of a possible reason for him not taking that final step even though he is de-facto committed. Even if the wife and kids are committed? It is a point of contention, I think someone heavily de-facto committed should get the vote, problem is without taking that final step then one never knows how real the commitment is. AFAIA it is only a suggestion by Starmer not a commitment. |
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Post by Bentley on May 17, 2023 12:50:29 GMT
If they are not willing to make the effort to become citizens of the UK then they are not fully committed to the UK. In your opinion. And all your opinion means is that you cannot think of a possible reason for him not taking that final step even though he is de-facto committed. Even if the wife and kids are committed? It is a point of contention, I think someone heavily de-facto committed should get the vote, problem is without taking that final step then one never knows how real the commitment is. AFAIA it is only a suggestion by Starmer not a commitment. O& course it’s my opinion . What opinion was you hoping for , yours? ’His’ wife and children are not him. If an individual wants the right to vote for the UK they should be an adult UK citizen. Doesn’t matter if their wife , kids , grandma or second cousin already is . |
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Post by Fairsociety on May 17, 2023 12:52:50 GMT
In your opinion. And all your opinion means is that you cannot think of a possible reason for him not taking that final step even though he is de-facto committed. Even if the wife and kids are committed? It is a point of contention, I think someone heavily de-facto committed should get the vote, problem is without taking that final step then one never knows how real the commitment is. AFAIA it is only a suggestion by Starmer not a commitment. O& course it’s my opinion . What opinion was you hoping for , yours? ’His’ wife and children are not him. If an individual wants the right to vote for the UK they should be an adult UK citizen. Doesn’t matter if their wife , kids , grandma or second cousin already is . see2 will always accuse you of not delivering facts just 'opinions', then when you point out that you are giving a 'opinion' he accuses you of giving a opinion ...LOL |
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2023 14:23:10 GMT
Well he is doing a very good impression of one, showcasing an apparent inability to challenge anything I say. And only the right wing barrel works in your shotgun. So what? I don't have a shotgun, I use a bullet fired from a deadly accurate rifle. Too many big words = waffle, eh. Lol Fuck knows why you seem to think I am angry but if that fits your assumptions better just like most other shit you make up, fill your boots, lol |
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2023 14:27:06 GMT
@srb7677 16-17 year olds have had little experience of the world. Not quite children yet certainly not adults. Pensioners on the other hand have worked and paid taxes and seen friends die and see children born. They would probably have faced challenges in their own lives with the up and down economic and political cycles. So know from experience a little of politics and broken promises so think a little harder about it. Young adults are susceptible to being influenced by teachers with a union mind-set and the loudest friend. As are older students yet at least they have a couple more years of experience under their belts and their brains are a bit bigger. Pensioners also have much less stake in the future and are in most cases no longer nett contributors, but in spite of these shortcomings I will continue to support your right to vote just as much as I wouls support it for 16 and 17 year olds. And in my experience the average 16 and 17 year old is far more clued up than some pensioners are when it comes to modern day living. I know quite a few of the latter who dont even know how to go on the internet and are afraid of it. |
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2023 14:29:48 GMT
In your opinion. And all your opinion means is that you cannot think of a possible reason for him not taking that final step even though he is de-facto committed. Even if the wife and kids are committed? It is a point of contention, I think someone heavily de-facto committed should get the vote, problem is without taking that final step then one never knows how real the commitment is. AFAIA it is only a suggestion by Starmer not a commitment. O& course it’s my opinion . What opinion was you hoping for , yours? ’His’ wife and children are not him. If an individual wants the right to vote for the UK they should be an adult UK citizen. Doesn’t matter if their wife , kids , grandma or second cousin already is . You have stated no clear arguments why that should be so. If anyone presents any in opposition to you you tend not to understand it and just dismiss it as pointless words, thereby showcasing your intellectual failure. |
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2023 14:34:54 GMT
If they are not willing to make the effort to become citizens of the UK then they are not fully committed to the UK. Bollocks. Shelling out large sums of money is not a reasonable determinant of commitment. After all it represents very little genuine commitment to a rich man. Actually living here and working here and raising a family here shows far more commitment to the UK. And is not something that mere money can demonstrate. But do carry on talking shit. It gives me something to laugh at. Hahaha |
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2023 14:36:21 GMT
Well he is doing a very good impression of one, showcasing an apparent inability to challenge anything I say. And only the right wing barrel works in your shotgun. So what? I don't have a shotgun, I use a bullet fired from a deadly accurate rifle. I bow to your greatness, a legend in your own mind. |
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Post by sandypine on May 17, 2023 14:36:57 GMT
@srb7677 16-17 year olds have had little experience of the world. Not quite children yet certainly not adults. Pensioners on the other hand have worked and paid taxes and seen friends die and see children born. They would probably have faced challenges in their own lives with the up and down economic and political cycles. So know from experience a little of politics and broken promises so think a little harder about it. Young adults are susceptible to being influenced by teachers with a union mind-set and the loudest friend. As are older students yet at least they have a couple more years of experience under their belts and their brains are a bit bigger. Pensioners also have much less stake in the future and are in most cases no longer nett contributors, but in spite of these shortcomings I will continue to support your right to vote just as much as I wouls support it for 16 and 17 year olds. And in my experience the average 16 and 17 year old is far more clued up than some pensioners are when it comes to modern day living. I know quite a few of the latter who dont even know how to go on the internet and are afraid of it. Pensioners may have more stake in the future with children grandchildren etc. Many pensioners may not be clued up on teh internet but they are generally not afraid or traumatised by hearing people with different points of view and do not need safe spaces within which they are insulated from differnet opinions. |
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Post by Toreador on May 17, 2023 14:39:03 GMT
If they are not willing to make the effort to become citizens of the UK then they are not fully committed to the UK. We need to be committed if we are UK citizens.🤣 I think you should be committed. |
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2023 14:40:43 GMT
If somebody has been here for "ten, twenty, thirty years" and hasn't got British citizenship, then they obviously don't want it and are not that bothered about the ability to vote. Absolute nonsense. It is far more likely that they are not prepared to pay £1400 for the right to vote. And why would they? How many of the rest of us would pay that for the right to vote? Vanishingly few I suspect. The right to vote should be determined by residency not money nor citizenship if acquiring the latter costs a lot of money |
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