|
|
Post by walterpaisley on May 1, 2023 11:27:02 GMT
Glad to see you endorse fptp in referendums too so no brexit failed no one I had no problem with the referendum. A narrow, terrible, result - but the vote itself was absolutely fine. Win some, lose some. |
|
|
|
Post by Montegriffo on May 1, 2023 11:38:38 GMT
Glad to see you endorse fptp in referendums too so no brexit failed no one I had no problem with the referendum. A narrow, terrible, result - but the vote itself was absolutely fine. Win some, lose some. It was the misinformation surrounding the campaigns that was the problem. Take back control, have your cake and eat it, 180 million a week to save the NHS, a new deal within a day etc. |
|
|
|
Post by thomas on May 1, 2023 11:42:08 GMT
I had no problem with the referendum. A narrow, terrible, result - but the vote itself was absolutely fine. Win some, lose some. It was the misinformation surrounding the campaigns that was the problem. Take back control, have your cake and eat it, 180 million a week to save the NHS, a new deal within a day etc. sure monte , but the same could be said of us in 2014. Everything they told us that would happen if we voted yes has happened because we voted no.
The same so called liberals who were laughing at me in 2014 with crys of thats how the cookie crumbles were running around screaming its not fair two years later.
I agree with walter. I also point out remain in england were just as bad as leave in terms of telling porkie pies.
|
|
|
|
Post by Montegriffo on May 1, 2023 11:49:45 GMT
It was the misinformation surrounding the campaigns that was the problem. Take back control, have your cake and eat it, 180 million a week to save the NHS, a new deal within a day etc. sure monte , but the same could be said of us in 2014. Everything they told us that would happen if we voted yes has happened because we voted no.
The same so called liberals who were laughing at me in 2014 with crys of thats how the cookie crumbles were running around screaming its not fair two years later.
I agree with walter. I also point out remain in england were just as bad as leave in terms of telling porkie pies.
I acknowledged that with my pluralisation of campaign. What you have to ask yourself is whose predictions were more accurate. I maintain that the Leave side's pies were bigger. |
|
|
|
Post by thomas on May 1, 2023 11:56:04 GMT
sure monte , but the same could be said of us in 2014. Everything they told us that would happen if we voted yes has happened because we voted no.
The same so called liberals who were laughing at me in 2014 with crys of thats how the cookie crumbles were running around screaming its not fair two years later.
I agree with walter. I also point out remain in england were just as bad as leave in terms of telling porkie pies.
I acknowledged that with my pluralisation of campaign. What you have to ask yourself is whose predictions were more accurate. I maintain that the Leave side's pies were bigger. possibly , but saying one sides lies were greater than the other isnt going to justify overturning a referendum result . Like scotland in 2014 , the brexit vote in my opinion despite all the remainers crying about foul play, was won on the back of the majority of peoples pre conceived views.
You have to face the fact monte that there are a large amount of people in England especially who just dont like europe and the europeans , potentially its based on englands history with europe . The idea to me anyway people are gullible and stupid and easily led by lies doesnt really wash regarding brexit.
Saying it was all lies that won it , along with crackers some remainers came out with abour russian influence merely makes remain look like its having a temper tantrum about losing and sour grapes. I said this for years now , as someone who voted remain , that it merely makes remainers look bad and strengthen leaves hands.
|
|
|
|
Post by Bentley on May 1, 2023 11:58:02 GMT
Remainers used the project fear strategy, claiming that the sky will fall in immediately after a vote to leave.
What they should of said is that remainers in the UK establishment will adopt a strategy of undermining any attempt to make a post Brexit UK work .
|
|
|
|
Post by Montegriffo on May 1, 2023 12:01:02 GMT
I acknowledged that with my pluralisation of campaign. What you have to ask yourself is whose predictions were more accurate. I maintain that the Leave side's pies were bigger. possibly , but saying one sides lies were greater than the other isnt going to justify overturning a referendum result . Like scotland in 2014 , the brexit vote in my opinion despite all the remainers crying about foul play, was won on the back of the majority of peoples pre conceived views.
You have to face the fact monte that there are a large amount of people in England especially who just dont like europe and the europeans , potentially its based on englands history with europe . The idea to me anyway people are gullible and stupid and easily led by lies doesnt really wash regarding brexit.
Saying it was all lies that won it , along with crackers some remainers came out with abour russian influence merely makes remain look like its having a temper tantrum about losing and sour grapes. I said this for years now , as someone who voted remain , that it merely makes remainers look bad and strengthen leaves hands.
Yet if you polled the people tomorrow you would get a different result. Which, if I'm not mistaken, is your argument for an Indy Ref 2. |
|
|
|
Post by thomas on May 1, 2023 12:07:56 GMT
possibly , but saying one sides lies were greater than the other isnt going to justify overturning a referendum result . Like scotland in 2014 , the brexit vote in my opinion despite all the remainers crying about foul play, was won on the back of the majority of peoples pre conceived views.
You have to face the fact monte that there are a large amount of people in England especially who just dont like europe and the europeans , potentially its based on englands history with europe . The idea to me anyway people are gullible and stupid and easily led by lies doesnt really wash regarding brexit.
Saying it was all lies that won it , along with crackers some remainers came out with abour russian influence merely makes remain look like its having a temper tantrum about losing and sour grapes. I said this for years now , as someone who voted remain , that it merely makes remainers look bad and strengthen leaves hands.
Yet if you polled the people tomorrow you would get a different result. Which, if I'm not mistaken, is your argument for an Indy Ref 2. you would because you are not only polling the people from 2014 and 2016 , but new voters coming online. I dont believe very many have changed their minds from the previous votes , even in scotland.
You may have a few people with brexit regret , but i maintain from what ive seen and heard , especially on forums like this , the vast majority of brexiters maintain to the death their views and have no regret about leaving whatsoever.
As benny hints at above , they are even more determined for brexit to succeed in the face of what they believe as a remian establishment pissing all over their brexit.I go back to my original point that the idea people have had a mass conversion to remain ( thats 2016 voters) and the dawning realisation they have been lied to is laughable.
|
|
|
|
Post by thomas on May 1, 2023 12:10:24 GMT
possibly , but saying one sides lies were greater than the other isnt going to justify overturning a referendum result . Like scotland in 2014 , the brexit vote in my opinion despite all the remainers crying about foul play, was won on the back of the majority of peoples pre conceived views.
You have to face the fact monte that there are a large amount of people in England especially who just dont like europe and the europeans , potentially its based on englands history with europe . The idea to me anyway people are gullible and stupid and easily led by lies doesnt really wash regarding brexit.
Saying it was all lies that won it , along with crackers some remainers came out with abour russian influence merely makes remain look like its having a temper tantrum about losing and sour grapes. I said this for years now , as someone who voted remain , that it merely makes remainers look bad and strengthen leaves hands.
Which, if I'm not mistaken, is your argument for an Indy Ref 2. no the arguemnt for indy ref 2 is basic so called democracy. IE - a party stands on a democractic mandate to hold an indy ref , wins the election and then implements that mandate. Which your westmisnter government is stopping.
If a party at westmisnter stands on a rejoin mandate , then wins an election , the same rule should apply. What you are getting though is starmers cac handed lies and rejoin behind the bike sheds instead of honesty , which in my view will cause even more turnmoil should he succeed dishonestly in taking the uk back in via the brussells back door.
|
|
|
|
Post by see2 on May 1, 2023 12:11:20 GMT
Remainers used the project fear strategy, claiming that the sky will fall in immediately after a vote to leave. What they should of said is that remainers in the UK establishment will adopt a strategy of undermining any attempt to make a post Brexit UK work . Even though SOME may have claimed that the "sky will fall in immediately after a vote to leave" the term "Project fear" was used by Brexit voters in order to avoid answering reasonable concerns raised by people concerned about possible pit-falls caused by a Brexit vote. The so called "strategy of undermining any attempt to make a post Brexit UK work" is similarly used as an excuse by some who voted for Brexit, for the troubled and anticipated by some, start for Brexit. |
|
|
|
Post by Montegriffo on May 1, 2023 12:13:12 GMT
Yet if you polled the people tomorrow you would get a different result. Which, if I'm not mistaken, is your argument for an Indy Ref 2. you would because you are not only polling the people from 2014 and 2016 , but new voters coming online. I dont believe very many have changed their minds from the previous votes , even in scotland.
You may have a few people with brexit regret , but i maintain from what ive seen and heard , especially on forums like this , the vast majority of brexiters maintain to the death their views and have no regret about leaving whatsoever.
As benny hints at above , they are even more determined for brexit to succeed in the face of what they believe as a remian establishment pissing all over their brexit.I go back to my original point that the idea people have had a mass conversion to remain ( thats 2016 voters) and the dawning realisation they have been lied to is laughable.
Are you saying ''you lost, get over it''? Some might call that an inconsistent position for you to hold. |
|
|
|
Post by see2 on May 1, 2023 12:14:13 GMT
His extremely, typically dishonest right-wing approach, to achieve what he wanted seems to appeal to you. And is still a long way away from proving to be the best outcome for the UK. IMO there is still a good possibility that an effigy of Farage may well replace Guy Fawkes on the bonfires in a generation or two. Nothing at all dishonest about allowing the people a say.. I never suggested there was. |
|
|
|
Post by thomas on May 1, 2023 12:16:29 GMT
you would because you are not only polling the people from 2014 and 2016 , but new voters coming online. I dont believe very many have changed their minds from the previous votes , even in scotland.
You may have a few people with brexit regret , but i maintain from what ive seen and heard , especially on forums like this , the vast majority of brexiters maintain to the death their views and have no regret about leaving whatsoever.
As benny hints at above , they are even more determined for brexit to succeed in the face of what they believe as a remian establishment pissing all over their brexit.I go back to my original point that the idea people have had a mass conversion to remain ( thats 2016 voters) and the dawning realisation they have been lied to is laughable.
Are you saying ''you lost, get over it''? Some might call that an inconsistent position for you to hold. no im saying whatever bitterness and unfairness you have from losing the brexit ref , you need to move on and try and elect a party on a rejoin mandate rather than carrying on raking over the coals of defeat forevermore. |
|
|
|
Post by see2 on May 1, 2023 12:17:26 GMT
Posting idiotic politically biased posts appears to be your forte  anyone who disagrees with new labour and their vacuous followers like you and sid are of course according to you politically biased.
I dont always agree with steve( srb) and his politics , but he does have starmer and new new labour down to a tee.
Extremely politically biased posts from yourself, prove the high level of your political bias. |
|
|
|
Post by thomas on May 1, 2023 12:17:59 GMT
Nothing at all dishonest about allowing the people a say.. I never suggested there was. so what are you saying then that he is dishonest because you disagree wiht his politics as you tell me im biased as you disagree with mine?
Im sure puerlie name calling might make you feel better , but doesnt win elections
|
|
